Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[Triceron]

I explained why I made the comparison. Those characters are routinely mocked as being forced into stories for the sake of diversity. If we're going to pretend a large portion of the criticism these shows get isn't due to this fact then you're simply not being honest about the nature of this 300+ page thread.

I'm not pretending anything.

I'm aware that a large portion of the criticism these shows get are purely predicated on the diversity topic, most of which happened before the show even came out. But I'm not sure why this is making its rounds again oddly enough, since it was quite a dead horse for about a solid month or show as the show reached its current episodes. Can't say I've been paying attention too closely to all the bullshit that happens here, there's only so much bullshit I can keep track of really.

[Xath]

Serious question for those who keep defending the lack of anything happening of import going into the final episode do you have infinite time on your hands? Most of us have limited time if a show can't hook you in the first six hours which is basically the run time of two lotr movies why in the world would people continue to watch it. You keep claiming the story is barely starting the first season is basically done at this point in the LoTR trilogy we are at the prep for the battle of Helm's deep possibly slightly further.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

If you want to carry on that exchange, then sure, I can merely brush off what you listed as being the 30% talk about the show while 70% is still talking about stuff around the show. Just like it happens to be in most other threads here.

And most of what you posted consists of how many posts overall in the 10 pages you sifted through? It's usually a few posts talking about it, then the conversation ends quick.

That was from just five pages and with a quick glance through excluding the page that is mostly our back and forth each page has 4-6 post truly unrelated to the show out of the default layout of 19 post per page.

But given that you think comparing characters from the show isn’t actually talking about the show I’m willing to bet you could up that number to what ever you wanted by just saying it’s all talking around the show.

[Triceron]

That was from just five pages and with a quick glance through excluding the page that is mostly our back and forth each page has 4-6 post truly unrelated to the show out of the default layout of 19 post per page.

But given that you think comparing characters from the show isn’t actually talking about the show I’m willing you could up that number to what ever you wanted by just saying it’s all talking around the show.

We're on page 341 and barely any discussion of the actual content of the show happened in the past 15 pages. Like, legitimate discussion, and not just some tangential thing about ratings or a mention of Galadriel being compared to Rey.

Like, I'll even be frank with you. I don't see the show's content being talked about, as an episode-basis, as much as I see other things being talked about just random other things. I don't consider ratings talks, or comparisons of Galadriel to Rey and Carol for the sake of trivializing the criticisms as being a product of anti-diversity 'hatespeech' as being related to the show. If you're seeing the glass half full here then I'm just gonna say I express my views through my subjective lens and agree to disagree with you here, and will continue to express my views freely without further acknowledging that the glass is half full here. Cuz I consider the odd mention of a harfoot to be an exception rather than the rule.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Serious question for those who keep defending the lack of anything happening of import going into the final episode do you have infinite time on your hands? Most of us have limited time if a show can't hook you in the first six hours which is basically the run time of two lotr movies why in the world would people continue to watch it. You keep claiming the story is barely starting the first season is basically done at this point in the LoTR trilogy we are at the prep for the battle of Helm's deep possibly slightly further.

People a fair amount of the people defending the show likely enjoy it. so the real question is if you don’t have Infintine time on your hands wht are you watching and talking about a show you don’t enjoy?

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We're on page 341 and barely any discussion of the actual content of the show happened in the past 15 pages. Like, legitimate discussion, and not just some tangential thing about ratings or a mention of Galadriel being compared to Rey.

Like, I'll even be frank with you. How often do you have actual episodic discussion here compared to arguments about something completely unrelated to what happened in the episodes?

Ha thanks for proving me right that you’d just up the number to what ever you wanted.

But your right only “ legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s” count as talking about a show now, lol.

[Triceron]

Ha thanks for proving me right that you’d just up the number to what ever you wanted.

But your right only “ legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s” count as talking about a show now, lol.

That's been my point from the beginning. Talking about the episodes. Because you made a statement suggesting the popularity and activity of this thread being indicative to the success of the show in some roundabout way, when most of the posts here don't really have anything to do with discussing its actual episodic content.

And what? You expect me to say zero talk about the show has happened in the past 15 pages? Cuz an episode did come out within that time frame and I'm not delusional :P It exists, in the minority of discussion. And I'm not assed to do the math on a thread that I know doesn't have much episodic discussion in it to begin with.

Like I equated it before, it's like the She-hulk thread getting boosted constantly to the front. Most of the posts in that thread that I can take a quick glance at aren't about the show either, they're usually talking about something completely unrelated. Mostly diversity issues in that thread too.

It doesn't mean the thread has a lot of activity because people are actually talking about the show, it's because these shows have an indirect way of bringing about controversial topics which get argued constantly and pointlessly.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

That's been my point from the beginning. Talking about the episodes. Because you made a statement suggesting the popularity and activity of this thread being indicative to the success of the show in some roundabout way, when most of the posts here don't really have anything to do with discussing its actual episodic content.

And what? You expect me to say zero talk about the show has happened in the past 15 pages? Cuz an episode did come out within that time frame and I'm not delusional :P

Ah yes that was your point from the start which is why your just now changing from “talk” about the show to “legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s“.

Pull the other one it’s got bells on.

[Triceron]

Ah yes that was your point from the start which is why your just now changing from “talk” about the show to “legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s“.

Pull the other one it’s got bells on.

Yes because the first thing I replied to you on was about your comment:

'This thread has gotten like 20 pages in a week, even if it’s twice as lively as the general talk around the show that’s a lot of people talking about it.'

And I was making a point that most of the talk isn't even about the show. Most of the posts here are about arguments beyond the show. At the time, I used the example of people criticizing the show, and other people criticizing the critics, namely because I thought this whole diversity bullshit was behind us. Guess not. We've circled back to Rey and Carol Danvers and diversity criticism while I was a away for the weekend :P

But hey, since you think this is still talking about the show then yeah, we disagree on the same shit. If you didn't understand my point then yea, I could see how you think I was changing my message when I use a different example to reinforce the same point. Can't see the forest for the trees.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Yes because the first thing I replied to you on was about your comment:

'This thread has gotten like 20 pages in a week, even if it’s twice as lively as the general talk around the show that’s a lot of people talking about it.'

And I was making a point that most of the talk isn't even about the show. Most of the posts here are about arguments beyond the show. At the time, I used the example of people criticizing the show, and other people criticizing the critics, namely because I thought this whole diversity bullshit was behind us. Guess not. We've circled back to Rey and Carol Danvers and diversity criticism while I was a away for the weekend :P

Ah yes because of course this reply about talk about the show was really about the lack of “legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s“.

Most of which is people criticizing the show and people criticizing the critics

Don't think there's been much praising overall. Just people being defensive saying the show isn't as bad as people think, or some blanket 'the show is good because many people are watching it' response.

Echo chamber of a thread really.

Are you even trying to convince any one at this point, like you can’t even be fooling your self with this right?

[Triceron]

Ah yes because of course this reply about talk about the show was really about the lack of “legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s“.
Are you even trying to convince any one at this point, like you can’t even be fooling your self with this right?

Yes, because my whole point is the majority of the posts in this thread are not actually about the show. As in, discussion on the episodic content.

You've been laser focused on arguing that there are plenty of posts that relate to the show through means of technicalities (your full list), which is splitting hairs and not addressing the main point I've made - that a majority of posts in this very thread aren't actually talking about the show.

How many posts are we spending right now in this back and forth? This is what MOST discussions in this threads are filled with. We aren't even talking about the show right now, you realize this right?

You realize in the past 2 pages, much of it is people spending it on back-and-forth discussions like this is happening right now, right? And that the actual talk of the show is being outright buried in this, right?

As I said, this is an echochamber. What have either of us said in the past 10 messages that hasn't already been said days ago? How much discussion is actually being had on the actual show itself, and not just part of some externalized nit-picking on the details or some completely off-topic tangent?

[rhorle]

As in, you disagree that there are some underlying problems with Rings of Poo regarding acting, dialogues, plot?

Please quote me where I said there are no underlying problems with Rings of Power? Strange how you won't be able to, right?

If you can't see how your two quotes are related then that is on you. You are selectively applying when "diversity and modern stuff" is good or bad. If you like the show then it is perfectly fine for it to exist. If you don't like the show, as in the case of Rings of Power, then it is suddenly an issue. If those concepts are a bad thing then it should bring down any adaptation that has them present, right?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Yes, because my whole point is the majority of the posts in this thread are not actually about the show. As in, discussion on the episodic content

No your whole point was to say no one was praising the show because you wanted to reaffirm that it’s a bad show so it’s mostly just criticism.

But then you fell down this whole rabbit hole of weaselling about what actually counts as “talk” about a show so are now retroactively trying to pretend your post were always inline with your new stance.

How many posts are we spending right now in this back and forth?

to many at this point given that your last honest bone must have decided it was in over its head and left your body and your now lying through your teeth.

[rhorle]

As I said, this is an echochamber. What have either of us said in the past 10 messages that hasn't already been said days ago? How much discussion is actually being had on the actual show itself, and not just part of some externalized nit-picking on the details?

It is amusing how you keep denying trying to stop discussion while your entire point of posting today is about trying to stop discussions from happening. If you didn't try to moderate you would have saved those 10 posts. In an effort to get people to stop you've become the very problem you decry. A self fulfilling prophecy.

[Xath]

People a fair amount of the people defending the show likely enjoy it. so the real question is if you don’t have Infintine time on your hands wht are you watching and talking about a show you don’t enjoy?

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Ha thanks for proving me right that you’d just up the number to what ever you wanted.

But your right only “ legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s” count as talking about a show now, lol.

I'm specifically talking about the people defending who are resorting to it's just the start of the story aka the it can get better approach.

[Triceron]

Ah yes that was your point from the start which is why your just now changing from “talk” about the show to “legitimate actual episodic discussion‘s“.

Pull the other one it’s got bells on.

No, it wasn't the point. 'The show isn't getting a lot of praise overall' was merely a supporting statement to make a point that the thread isn't indicative of the show being successful among even the audiences here, with most of the discussion being (at the time) back-and-forth debates about criticisms of the show. You said that criticisms of the show are still talking about the show. And I was making the point that most of the banter between criticisms are not, and I'm making this very discussion we're having now as an example of how those debates also end up being like. If not, there's plenty of other examples here of arguments taken outside the context of the show.

The point had been that this thread's activity isn't very relevant to the show's success, namely because a majority of the posts aren't actually talking about the show's content, nor is much of that even praising it. That's the whole reason I called it an echochamber.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I'm specifically talking about the people defending who are resorting to it's just the start of the story aka the it can get better approach.

I’m not one of those people (liked the first episode) but I’d assume the answer would be the same just in part instead of the whole.

Some one likes where they think the story is going, the characters, actors, visuals, ect and thing it’s worth putting the time in to see if the parts they don’t like will match up with the parts they do.

[Triceron]

It is amusing how you keep denying trying to stop discussion while your entire point of posting today is about trying to stop discussions from happening. If you didn't try to moderate you would have saved those 10 posts. In an effort to get people to stop you've become the very problem you decry. A self fulfilling prophecy.

How has anything I've said actually been an effort to get anyone to stop posting?

What are you projecting here? Like, read what you just quoted. Where does it say people should stop posting?

You're asking a loaded question that has nothing to do with anything I've said. Please stop accusing me of things I haven't done.

[Fortress of Arrogance]

Please quote me where I said there are no underlying problems with Rings of Power? Strange how you won't be able to, right?

Of course I won't be able to, because I am not stating you did say that, to begin with. I am merely inquiring.
Now, do you agree there are some underlying problems with Rings of Poo in regards to acting, plot, dialogues?
Would you like to discuss them?

If you can't see how your two quotes are related then that is on you.

No.

You are selectively applying when "diversity and modern stuff" is good or bad.

No.
Diversity and modern stuff is universally bad if done for its own sake and/or poorly executed.
As in, adding token character of a token ethnicity for it's own sake would be a bad thing in my book.

If you don't like the show, as in the case of Rings of Power, then it is suddenly an issue.

It's an issue if it is being done for it's own sake.
Like, take the queen of Numenor for example.
Why would they cast a diverse actress instead of another one, more visually resembling of the book' character?
Because she's a great actress?

If those concepts are a bad thing then it should bring down any adaptation that has them present, right?

If it is being done for it's own sake, then yes.
Unless the audience is, let's say, intellectually challenged.
Like with the Shitcher series. Being okay with this...this Triss Gypsygold must take great mental power.

[rhorle]

How has anything I've said actually been an effort to get anyone to stop posting?

Then let them? I mean, are they gonna change their minds because you explain it differently somehow?

So what does let them mean if not to stop responding to them? I can't project what you actually stated. Lmao.

[Triceron]

So what does let them mean if not to stop responding to them? I can't project what you actually stated. Lmao.

It means we don't have to concern ourselves with trying to prove subjective statements objectively wrong?

That is the whole fallacy of the the discussion, and what ultimately perpetuates the entire back and forth between those 'diversity' discussions. It's one side taking something ultimately subjective, and trying to argue how it's objectively wrong.

And in the context of that entire discussion? 'Them' wasn't even a specific person making that argument, it was merely one person's bad example of an opinionated statement. Which means whatever was being argued won't change anything anyways since there's literally NO ONE making that argument to begin with. NO minds would be changed by arguing it since it's all predicated on a fallacy to begin with, whether people are arguing for or against it. It's all arguments on principle, without any relevance to the show. It was an EXAMPLE of an opinion, not any actual opinion that someone here actually made.

And most of which could easily be resolved by simply accepting that those ideas would exist and merely disagree with them. And this has nothing to do with shutting anyone up, merely sharing an observation that this whole subtopic is quite pointless to begin with especially when no one was making that point to begin with. It's just people defending and debunking the same pointless example and somehow more and more people got involved in it without even caring about the context having been born from a bad example.

Like, yeah, there are going to be people in the world who may equate Galadriel to Rey or Carol Danvers. But none of those people are actually making that argument here. So why the fuck are people suddenly arguing it. That's my point. We can literally accept that there are people who are gonna have that opinion and letting the bad example remain a bad example without having people jump in to argue it on the principle of it. By all means, people can choose to still argue it if they wish, I'm not stopping anyone from doing what they want. I'm just saying in this case it's utterly pointless.