Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[Syegfryed]

None of that had anything to do with what I said Hence it's a strawman he is arguing... not me.... I don't agree with everything he is saying, just the first statement.

That is not a strawman since im not arguing against you?? lol

Im saying what makes a show successful, and saying rings of power didn't check any of those boxes.

"Niesel chart in the months showed they had a huge drop..." what does that even mean?

Dropping from 2/3rd place to 7th in the top 10? then disappearing entirely later?

Yes I get it, some influencer showed you a South Park meme and that's where your knowledge of this begins and ends.

What south park meme are you even talking about?

its literally in the show, rings of power, the dude complaining about elves telling their jobs, and this is something xenophobe people, more common in US think about immigration

you don't need to watch a cartoon to see the allegory, just to use your brain

They wouldn't hire Elves. In the series nobody talked about jobs, that's something someone told you and you're just following blindly. What the Numenoreans were being pushed towards fearing was competition for their trade from beings that are objectively superior.

Oh, so you didn't watch the show, that explain a lot. The dude literally say that in the rally. go watch it and then come back, i heard it is a success.

WTF dude, is this what the SJW boogie man is up to these days? I don't know if you're spending too much time on YouTube or Twitch or TikTok but you gotta lay off the influencers for a while.

So this is how you are going to escape ? cause you didn't adressed shit from what i said.

make a quick search and you will see many people claiming orcs are an indication of racism towards POC, hell, they evens aid that about the blue people from avatar.

[rhorle]

Oh, so you didn't watch the show, that explain a lot. The dude literally say that in the rally. go watch it and then come back, i heard it is a success.

The line is "Elf workers taking your trades". It could really go either way based both arguments. That line is specifically referencing Halbrand who tried to steal his way into being able to practice a trade on Numenor. It can either be about taking their literal job offering a craft that non-elves can't compete with. Which would put them out of business but not be the same as "taking their jobs".

If the view on the show fits a xenophobic viewpoint then it fits perfectly with what Tolkien had of the Numenoreans. As they were split between elf-friend and elf-foe. That is what we see with the scene as the speaker ends with "I say, the Queen's either blind or an Elf lover. Just like her father". It really was just a simple display of a political faction on the island raising its pitch forks. Since we know Sauron was involved it makes the scene more acceptable because he was clearly exerting influence or "his plan".

Dropping from 2/3rd place to 7th in the top 10? then disappearing entirely later?

Most shows start to drop and disappear after they stop release new content.

[Syegfryed]

The line is "Elf workers taking your trades". It could really go either way based both arguments. That line is specifically referencing Halbrand.

no it wasn't, Halbrand is not the one who does not age and don't get tired.

Numenorians, who are stronger and live for far longer, would not fear a southlander.

[Triceron]

no it wasn't, Halbrand is not the one who does not age and don't get tired.

Numenorians who are stronger and life for far longer would not feat a southlander.

Not to mention that the show established the craftsman guild as being long-established and exclusive industry in Numenor. No one can be a craftsman without joining the Guild. What Halbrand did was steal a badge with no credentials to back it up, meaning he wouldn't have been able to get a legitimate job that way anyways. A stolen badge does not equate to 'taking their jobs'.

And blaming the Elves on top of that just makes even less sense. The only reason it's brought up in the protest is so that Pharazon could have something to say about Elves in the show.

[Dhrizzle]

Dropping from 2/3rd place to 7th in the top 10? then disappearing entirely later?

What charts are you talking about?

What south park meme are you even talking about?

The "they took our jerbs" meme you keep parroting.

its literally in the show, rings of power, the dude complaining about elves telling their jobs, and this is something xenophobe people, more common in US think about immigration

Except he doesn't say jobs, he says Elven craftsmen will take their trade because they are unsleeping, unaging and untiring. It's not about them moving to Numenor and taking employment.

you don't need to watch a cartoon to see the allegory, just to use your brain

It would help if you actually watched the show instead of parroting what influencers tell you.

Oh, so you didn't watch the show, that explain a lot. The dude literally say that in the rally. go watch it and then come back, i heard it is a success.

I literally rewatched that scene moments before posting how wrong you are.

So this is how you are going to escape ? cause you didn't adressed shit from what i said.

That's 'cos you're rambling nonsense.

make a quick search and you will see many people claiming orcs are an indication of racism towards POC, hell, they evens aid that about the blue people from avatar.

Many people are saying something on the internet!? Well that's definitely important and needs paying attention to.

[Syegfryed]

What charts are you talking about?

Nielsen months, check past pages and you see the prints and the links for then, the week the last episode aired it drop entirely from the chart.

The "they took our jerbs" meme you keep parroting.

Never ehard before, never watched that carton outside one movie, im not a USA guy, sorry

Except he doesn't say jobs, he says Elven craftsmen will take their trade because they are unsleeping, unaging and untiring. It's not about them moving to Numenor and taking employment.

ohohohoho so he says "the elves craftsmen will take their trade" not "the elves gonna take our jobs"

wink wink

Come on, not even you can be that oblivious.

Many people are saying something on the internet!? Well that's definitely important and needs paying attention to.

it gets a lot of attention actually, thats why many rpgs out there are making sure to remove racist and xenophobe content they had, mainly wotc with their campaigns

Again, just search online, a lot of people attack and said tolkien was racist because his orcs.

[rhorle]

no it wasn't, Halbrand is not the one who does not age and don't get tired.

He is seen as an "elf friend" who tried to steal a badge that allows you to practice a trade. The guy, Tamar, who is giving the speech is the guy he stole from and beat up. That line and all the anger is rooted in the actions of Halbrand even if it had no extra manipulation by Sauron.

[Dhrizzle]

Never ehard before, never watched that carton outside one movie, im not a USA guy, sorry

The fact you're parroting a meme with no clue where it came from really doesn't surprise me.

ohohohoho so he says "the elves craftsmen will take their trade" not "the elves gonna take our jobs"

wink wink

Come on, not even you can be that oblivious.

Hmm, let's see if you understand it this way, if I said "Americans are worried about losing trade to China" do I mean
A) Americans are worried about the Chinese taking their trade.
Or
B) Americans are worried about Chinese migrants moving to America and taking their jobs.

it gets a lot of attention actually, thats why many rpgs out there are making sure to remove racist and xenophobe content they had, mainly wotc with their campaigns

Again, just search online, a lot of people attack and said tolkien was racist because his orcs.

Well there is a good argument that at the least some of Tolkien's descriptions of Orcs would be considered racist but in terms of fantasy monsters they're certainly not referencing anything. There's no reason for you to get upset about them being shown in a more sympathetic light through the Adar storyline.

[Syegfryed]

The fact you're parroting a meme with no clue where it came from really doesn't surprise me.

There is no need to "parrot a meme" its ltierally in the show

you fixation in this bit, trying to ridicule when im not even aware of that, as some sort of defence of your argument is laughable

Hmm, let's see if you understand it this way, if I said "Americans are worried about losing trade to China" do I mean
A) Americans are worried about the Chinese taking their trade.
Or
B) Americans are worried about Chinese migrants moving to America and taking their jobs.

Is this supposed to be your clever comeback? cause both are valid.

Well there is a good argument that at the least some of Tolkien's descriptions of Orcs would be considered racist but in terms of fantasy monsters they're certainly not referencing anything. There's no reason for you to get upset about them being shown in a more sympathetic light through the Adar storyline.

hum what??? lmao, thats a weird strawman coming out of nowhere.

and outside of Adar, which he still is an elf, no orc is show in a "more sympathetic light"

[rhorle]

and outside of Adar, which he still is an elf, no orc is show in a "more sympathetic light"

Galadrial calls him 'Moriondor' which is sons of the dark. Elves that were tortured and twisted into becoming Morgoth's evil minions. While adar prefers the term Uruk which means orc. It seems clear that the show is establishing that he is no longer an elf. It is like calling the Ring Wraiths human even though they were corrupted into something beyond that. Or calling the Oathbreakers men even though they became undead.

[Fabinas]

"I merely stated that us liking or disliking the metrics because arbitrary, statistics (that can be truthful and deceiving at the same time), nonsensical etc, has no bearing at the industry, because that's what they have decided to use."

How is this a fact? Lol...

The fact is that THIS IS THE METRIC USED by the industry.

You not accepting it, calling it nonsensical etc, has no bearing or influence to the fact above.

[Nerovar]

If the view on the show fits a xenophobic viewpoint then it fits perfectly with what Tolkien had of the Numenoreans. As they were split between elf-friend and elf-foe. That is what we see with the scene as the speaker ends with "I say, the Queen's either blind or an Elf lover. Just like her father". It really was just a simple display of a political faction on the island raising its pitch forks. Since we know Sauron was involved it makes the scene more acceptable because he was clearly exerting influence or "his plan".

For season 2 they should give Pharazôn a blonde wig and some orange spray tan. That's clearly what Tolkien had in mind.

[rhorle]

That's clearly what Tolkien had in mind.

So the divide of the faithful and the King's Men was not about their views of elves? Their was no dislike or prejudice from the King's Men faction towards the elves? There is no reason to try to interject American politics into this discussion.

[Dhrizzle]

There is no need to "parrot a meme" its ltierally in the show

you fixation in this bit, trying to ridicule when im not even aware of that, as some sort of defence of your argument is laughable

It's not though, nowhere in Rings of Power does anyone mention "YER JERBS," that's a South Park meme you've picked up from somewhere and substituted for the actual show.

Is this supposed to be your clever comeback? cause both are valid.

No they're not. Losing trade to workers in another place is different to losing your job to immigrants even if the result is the same (unemployment.) Your failure to grasp this is...not actually that surprising.

hum what??? lmao, thats a weird strawman coming out of nowhere.

and outside of Adar, which he still is an elf, no orc is show in a "more sympathetic light"

Adar is an Orc, one of the first Orcs, and his entire arc is about showing Orcs in a more sympathetic light as people who deserve their own homeland and a chance to live their own way. Generally that's what people whinge about the "shades of grey" aspect, not whatever it is you've picked up.

[Triceron]

The fact is that THIS IS THE METRIC USED by the industry.

You not accepting it, calling it nonsensical etc, has no bearing or influence to the fact above.

It is A metric used by the industry, not THE metric used by the industry.

This tiny caveat is what makes what you're saying quite dishonest, and non-factual.

[Fabinas]

It is A metric used by the industry, not THE metric used by the industry.

This tiny caveat is what makes what you're saying quite dishonest, and non-factual.

You people are hopeless.

[Triceron]

You people are hopeless.

Or you're just being dishonest.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

It is A metric used by the industry, not THE metric used by the industry.

This tiny caveat is what makes what you're saying quite dishonest, and non-factual.

Could you point to any more wide spread metric to be THE metric of the industry?

[Triceron]

Could you point to any more wide spread metric to be THE metric of the industry?

There isn't, that is the whole point.

The industry doesn't operate off one metric any more that you can point at any one streaming platform as being THE streaming platform of the industry.

Imagine if I said Netflix was the streaming platform of the industry. Would you consider this factual? Just because something is more widespread than others doesn't make it defacto. Trying to pass anything off Nielsen as THE metric of the industry, as a fact, would be quite dishonest.


Just to expand on the topic of analytics, there are various other methods that are arguable quite accurate and becoming more effective than Nielsen. Why is Nielsen still being widely used then? Because it's been around longer and considered reliable and trustworthy, while these new methods are still in their infancy and have not been around long enough to be considered reliable yet.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment..._google_trend/

For example, someone used machine learning and google trends to analyze the potential number of WoW subscribers after they stopped giving the numbers. And Google Trends are already being used to analyze interest in certain shows, like calculating people's retweets to gauge interest.

Anyone with any amount of sense would not simply defer to one system of data, especially when all of these methods involve estimations and extrapolations. It's practically a fancier version of polling data; no one poll is significantly better than other polls.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

There isn't, that is the whole point.

The industry doesn't operate off one metric any more that you can point at any one streaming platform as being THE streaming platform of the industry.

Imagine if I said Netflix was the streaming platform of the industry. Would you consider this factual? Just because something is more widespread than others doesn't make it defacto.

There may be other metrics but they aren’t all equal and some are obviously more wide spread then others and it seems disingenuous to act like people aren’t talking about the most widely used one when saying it’s THE metric.

Like the thing I linked some days ago said Nelson is used by what 25 of the biggest streaming related businesses and is being used by Netflix to push ad data and it has been a stable of actual tv numbers for years. Unless there is some metric even more wide spread it defiantly seems to be THE metric of the industry even if it’s not the only one.