All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.
Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2023-02-19 at 06:45 PM.
All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.
Then that's just ignorance, not censorship.
Expressing a personal anecdote, even in ignorance, is not a statement on who can or can not enjoy the show.
You can point out what is being complained about, and I can point out how it has nothing to do with the complaint.
Last edited by Triceron; 2023-02-19 at 07:08 PM.
Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2023-02-19 at 07:14 PM.
All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.
Typos on gate aside, no it’s nothing different they were gate keeping and your trying to say that gate keeping was just ignorance when just reading the back and forth makes it clear it’s dishonesty instead as they not only said no fans liked it they went out of there way to point to them being white knights instead.
All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.
You call it dishonesty but ignorance isn't immediately dishonesty.
For all I know, maybe he was talking about people in real life and not about random stranger opinions that he doesn't trust, that wouldn't be dishonest even if it is ignorant.
He didn't say no fans liked it, he said he didn't know any who did. That's quite a leap to assume his statement implies that he knows every fan, and is being blatantly dishonest about them all.
I hope you understand how I don't consider twisting personal anecdotes into arguments to be examples of gatekeeping.
If I say 'I don't know any pizza lovers who likes pineapple on pizza' it shouldn't be regarded as a gatekeeping statement against Hawaiian pizza. For all you know maybe I only know two people who love pizza, and they both happen to not like Hawaiian pizza. It's an anecdote, not a statement. IMO, it's not a reason for anyone to take offense to it. Even if it were 'hatekeeping' as you call it, it remains an anecdote of personal opinion.
Last edited by Triceron; 2023-02-19 at 08:04 PM.
I call it dishonest because that's what it is just like you are being dishonest right now pretending that they were talking about real life when the post was in direct response to why people are here in this thread.
But I shouldn't be surprised at this point given that you've said your just in the thread to troll in the past and are clearly continuing to do so.
All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.
Isn't that also why you're here?
Be honest
You're not actually answering anything I talked about, just pointing other things you don't find agreeable and making judgements.
At that point, you're just trolling by trying to spin a personal anecdote into being 'gatekeeping' for the sake of argument. What's the difference?
If you know I'm here to troll and you engage in responding to me, and then continue to argue for the sake of arguing, then I don't this being my problem. If you want to be on the higher horse and pretend I'm the troll, then you're telling me you're the kinda guy who knowingly engages with trolls.
Last edited by Triceron; 2023-02-19 at 08:23 PM.
No, The time's I've posted in a thread for the sake of trolling I could count on one hand and none of them have been in this one.
Though your right it isn't your fault you have been clear your just here for the sake of trolling, I am the one at fault for forgetting that as I tend to do.
All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.
I mean, thats your own fault by thinking tolkien fans = real fans
you can be a fan of the work without being a fan of tolkien
You are getting rly worked up for such hyperbole hun?Literally claims nobody in the whole world liked it for what it was, that they must have just wanted to pass the time (50 hours...), or it was just pretty to look at. And that anyone that dare suggest they'd rewatch it, is only doing so out of spite, as if nerd rage on the internet actually matters to anyone.
Yet, everything is true, everyone who came here that didn't hate it, just though the show was ok and everyone talk about the strong points being the scenario, the world and the cgi, not the dialogue, not the writing, not the acting or the action.
Because you and the others didn't, just here to be the contrarian.Belittles anyone remotely positive about the series as a "drone" because he cannot fathom someone enjoying it.
Tells us, whats the best parts of the show, what you were most hyped about, i mean since you liked the show so much, go on, point your favorite parts
LEts see if you will be bombarded and pushed away like you claimed people were doing
And if you think that way, why you come here and start complaining about complainier, just so we can start talking again?This thread would have literally died already if people like you didn't feel the need to come and start talking about how much you hate it again, because you can't stop thinking about it lol
Like come on, you don't rly want us to stop, you would not give us ammunition, otherwise you have nothing else to do, you need us.
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They are not that crazy to slip him into this shitstorm. As we saw, they would never do the character justice.
But hear me out, im not a superfan like the people amazon brought to do their advertise, so i don't know if the dude appear outside lord of the rings, so i don't know if they can lore-wise.
you still didn't answer my question, furthermore, you have failed to define what a 'fan' or 'superfan' is, all you have done is assert that nobody needs to have any prior knowledge of a thing to be considered a fan of said thing (which is not only asinine it's factually wrong).
all you have done in this most recent tirade is argue that calling someone who is clearly NOT a fan of the franchise, who has no actual knowledge of said franchise outside of passive surface level knowledge that is likely incorrect anyway, is make the claim that they are in fact a 'fan' despite all signs and information contradicting you.
the reason their social media presence was mentioned in relation to them NOT being fans of the franchise is because they were paid to provide rave reviews of the product (this dumpster fire of a show) to their respective audiences, as well as meet the various quotas for gay/black/disabled/*insert other minority or protected group here* that Amazon is adamant about having with their extremely racist casting and hiring policies, and as stated not one of them has produced a SINGLE PIECE OF CONTENT either about LOTR or this show, not a single thing.
to illustrate just how moronic your statement of defence for these clowns is, here's an example for you:
based on your stupid definition of what classifies as a fan of something, you're saying that someone could be a fan of football, even though they don't know how it works at all, they don't know who plays the game but because they like 'sports' in general they are by extension a fan of this specific sport.
I did answer your question in this post here, and Prior knowledge in this cases covers all of Tolkien's works as any and all are all you need to take in to be a fan of his that includes movies and novels and the Silmarillion.
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Yes I do have a tendency to do so Unfortunately.
Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2023-02-19 at 09:30 PM.
All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.
I have at numerous points asked people like Rhole, keen and unified to provide receipts for the things that are so amazing/they love/they enjoy about the show. Instead they continue to attack people that didn't like/didn't enjoy the show. That is why I call such people drones.
They don't have thoughts about what they enjoyed (things like they enjoyed the music, the CGI, certain scenes, etc), no instead they just attack the people who didn't enjoy it. No thoughts only attack, attack, attack, like good like robots.
Like not once have they responded to one of the several people engaging them about what they enjoyed. For instance the scene where Durin conned Gil-Galad out of the table for his wife. While I don't think the scene fits as well into a Tolkien story (I feel if they wanted something of this nature it should have been the Elves conning the dwarfs) the scene was close enough it worked for me so I didn't mind it (minus the fuck awful dialogue that occurred afterwards of "give me the meat and give it to me raw"). That however would require them to have independent thought, so alas, no thinking.
Even when there has been discussions about those things you still dismiss it. Don't act all arrogant here. You are no better then what you accuse others of being. Also amusing how you have been attacking for several of your posts but are somehow not a "good little robot". That is the problem with people that take your position. You create an enemy and no matter what they say or do you find some way to rationalize why they are bad even when you do the exact same things you accuse them of doing.
I've discussed many times what I've liked about scenes and what my own interpretation of things were. However since you don't like that it isn't blatant hate for the show it is dismissed as never occurring.
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
Consdiering his parentage was revised a couple of times that is a bold claim to make. Their is remarkably little about a lot of the characters Tolkien created. He was good at creating a mythology but lacked the detail of personalities, motivations, etc. It is also silly to say there is zero about his character that fits lore when his depiction has yet to contradict anything in the lore.
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
I guess the showrunners did not know this. Or are you hearing this nuance out of their interview? I hear very clearly that they consider anyone that would take the rings as foolish. I think I know why. They have watched Shadow of Mordor with the scenes of Annatar giving the rings in very ominious circumstances and from that got the idea of it being a devil's bargain.
Yes it is. Because with that argument you can defend anything. Frodo could have had pink hair and cyberpunk upgrades, maybe Tolkien would have written that if he had the choice. Maybes and potential changes are not good arguments.
I would not be surprised in the least if the billion dollar contract they signed with amazon also included a few lines that binds the Tolkiens to "like" the show at least in public.
But even if not and it is genuine, so what? Knowledge and the ability to write are not genetic. Just because they are related does not mean that anything they like would be in accordance with Tolkiens ideas.
But in general you missunderstood me. I say it would be fine to improve on Tolkien. The problem I have is that the show does not. It takes away and reduces his amazing world to a mere reflection of ours because the showrunners had a message to bring to the audience and that message superceded any intention of telling a compelling story.
You are again missunderstanding me. What I am talking about is that a narrative only works if the author can pull the reader into the fanatasy world they created. Tolkien is a human and was socialized in 19th/20th century times with a christian background. That will always be part of his writing, but he still managed to establish a world that functions on it's own without needing to be a direct reflection of ours.
You speak of heavy Christian themes. I would say I can barely notice them, despite having studied religion in university. They are there, but not in a way that would affect the story negatively. Conversely, with all the obvious political messaging in Rings of Power it is a wonder the series had time for plot because it is...in ...every... scene...so overdone that it suffocates the narrative.
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I mainly linked the video because it was the easiest way to find the lines. Otherwise I would have had to go through the podcast and that was just a bit too much effort for this discussion (besides I did not want amazon to think I liked that drivel). The point however is my own conclusion, built on what the series shows me, combined with what the showrunners are saying. I do not require a youtuber for that.
It is a fact that current hollywood is spending more time catering to poltics then to the quality of it's media, the examples for that are numerous. The same has happened here and it is the root of the problem. A fantasy world just does not lend itself to spoon-feed people a political idea unless you twist it so much that it is nigh unrecognizable.
I really can't see it and I have talked to many people about it who all agreed that there are big problems. But I mean, have you listened to what they are saying on this podcast? How is this "appreciation"? The literal words were "who would fall for that?", for one of the core ideas in the story. How else is this to be interpreted then "the author is writing idiot characters, we have to fix that".
Then there were lines like Sauron "will be similar to Walter White". What the actual frag... There is modernizing things and then there is shoving succesful ideas into your project, because they worked somewhere else.
I am not saying that I haven't seen worse shows. The Netflix Resident Evil and She-Hulk definately beat this one, but they really really had to do better to be worthy of the legacy they are taking over here. Unfortunately I see zero acceptance of that in the showrunners, since their only reaction to critism is pretending to be tragic heroes in the fight against rascism and misogynism, so season 2 is likely going to be the same level of quality.