Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[rhorle]

Even the Ringer is finally starting to admit there might be a huge problem here.

You are aware they are talking about Citadel and not Rings of Power, right? This really shows how people are reaching to keep that hate going lol.

[AtomR]

It doesn't need to be in the same time period to rip-off, rings of power fucks all over the place the timeline as well

There isn't a case of "gaining support from haters" they need to prove if it was stolen or not

Imagine "stealing" an established universe, publish an unauthorized book set in that universe, and then complain the owners of the universe stole it from them.

[Rennadrel]

Oh dear, some guy wrote a fanfic 'sequel' to LotR, unauthorised of course, published it on Amazon - and now is suing Amazon and the Tolkien estate, claiming they plagiarised his 'copyrighted' work in RoP.

https://radaronline.com/p/jeff-bezos...amazon-series/

Someone is about to get wrecked.

Considering this dipshit does not own the rights to anything in LOTR and interpretive works does not give you access to copyright protections if the work is interpreted from someone else's creation, he's gonna get crushed in a lawsuit. Amazon doesn't own the rights to anything LOTR either, they are merely licensing segments of the content, so they don't really have a case against the guy because they aren't the rights owners, but the Tolkien estate does.

[s_bushido]

They’re finally starting to admit what is obvious - that lukewarm reviews from critics who don’t recognize how the lore was butchered don’t matter, because a lot of fans absolutely hated it.

That article says literally nothing about the lore of RoP. Because spoiler alert: "the lore" doesn't mean shit when it comes to the success or failure of a script. People wouldn't forgive bad performances and poor pacing just because it got the lore right...and it wouldn't matter how much a production "butchered" the source material if the end product was itself very good anyway. Fucking obviously.

[Biomega]

Fucking obviously.

You SAY that... and yet there's like 50 pages in this thread somewhere of people arguing the exact opposite, as if accuracy to the lore was somehow a sacred formula that would make all things better automatically and without question.

[s_bushido]

You SAY that... and yet there's like 50 pages in this thread somewhere of people arguing the exact opposite, as if accuracy to the lore was somehow a sacred formula that would make all things better automatically and without question.

I know. Why do you think I haven't bothered with this shitshow of a thread (that's somehow still regularly bumped) for months.

[callipygoustp]

Did I mention that I thought the show sucked?

This guy is still spot on!

[Fabinas]

You SAY that... and yet there's like 50 pages in this thread somewhere of people arguing the exact opposite, as if accuracy to the lore was somehow a sacred formula that would make all things better automatically and without question.

Well, that's not accurate. Most people grinded the show for lore butchering, along with subpar direction, pretentious scenario, mediocre or bad performances and poor casting (not talking about the race stuff).

Noone claimed that if it was "lore accurate" this would have been a good show. At any rate, that lore butchering was about misrepresenting characters and their position in the world, the "mithrilgate", plus the condensing of the timeline and the AWFUL ring crafting circumstances.

[Syegfryed]

Imagine "stealing" an established universe, publish an unauthorized book set in that universe, and then complain the owners of the universe stole it from them.

Its morse worse if the owners did in fact steal it

its like robbing a rober, but in this case, you are so fucking bad that you are stealing bad fanfic

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Lots of cool guys here posting about how they’re too cool to post in this thread.

The "im so much better than y'all" syndrome, that have the people who suffer from this constantly have the need to remind others of that, while complaining about complainers, is such a sight.

[rhorle]

And while it’s obvious that you need more than book readers to be successful, it doesn’t follow that you can therefore just ignore book readers. The whole thing is just mind boggling.

Doesn't the success of Lord of the Rings media prove that otherwise? Pretty much all Lord of the Rings works ignores the books when they feel like it including Peter Jackson. Shadow of Mordor and its sequel ignore the books. Lord of the Rings online ignores the books when needed including creating their own "lore". Faithfulness isn't as important as you are making it out to be and is just the latest attempt at moving the goal posts in the ever shifting ways to lambast the show.

[Forogil]

In addition to the big deals like mithril, it was small things like horribly miscasting Gil-Galad and Celebrimbor, having two dwarves names Durin, just like really small obvious self-owns all over the series.

Multiple dwarves named Durin is according to the LOTR (although confusing), but since they are sometimes seen as Durin I reborn they should be almost identical (which would make it comically confusing) and also makes it unlikely that they are alive at the same time.

(And I haven't seen this series, since I only had Amazon a short time earlier to watch Good Omens - and 1984; both highly recommended.)

[rogoth]

Multiple dwarves named Durin is according to the LOTR (although confusing), but since they are sometimes seen as Durin I reborn they should be almost identical (which would make it comically confusing) and also makes it unlikely that they are alive at the same time.

(And I haven't seen this series, since I only had Amazon a short time earlier to watch Good Omens - and 1984; both highly recommended.)

i randomly saw this post on the front page for the first time in months, after having said my piece to the bottom feeders who dwell here defending this shitshow of a project (i don't aim any anger or anything at you btw), i'm here to correct your misunderstanding of the 'Durin' mythos that Tolkien created:

the whole storyline of Durin is based on the Arthurian mythos of Britaian where Arthur Pendragon is both the once and future king of Albion (the mythical name for Britain), meaning that he lived originally thousands of years ago, and when the people of Britain were in great need, he would awaken again in a new age and lead the people once more as King.

in the case of LOTR, Durin can be thought of the first dwarf to awaken in Arda, and once his body was broken and he died his spirit endured, and when such a time as the dwarves were in dire need, he would be 'reborn' in a single dwarf of the age and would rise up as king Durin essentially having the original persona of the dwarf that was, and the memories and 'spirit' of all Durin iterations that have gone before, the dwarf that emerges as king Durin is random, it is not something dictated by blood or station, usually it is a dwarf that is already fighting a losing battle and is seen by many as a natural leader to begin with.

in this shitshow of a production the showrunners in their infinite wisdom sought to bastardise and corrupt this lore by having some fuckwit king called 'Durin' who had a son also called 'Durin', not only would that never happen in the lore, it would be seen in dwarven society as blasphemous and abhorrent and regardless if the original king was the embodiment of king Durin of old, he would never name any sons he had also 'Durin', it would be like naming your child jesus Christ and proclaiming he is the son of god then when he got older and had a family he did the same thing to his son, it makes no fucking sense whatsoever.

that's just one of a very long list of examples of how badly these so called showrunners fucked up with the source material and royally screwed the pooch with this bastardised terrible fanfiction so bad that they are being sued for plagiarism which on the surface holds some merit, so that should tell you all you need to know about these hacks who were failing upwards their entire careers.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I don't understand what you're saying here. The idea behind dwarves being named Durin is, as you said, they are supposed to represent Durin reborn, so having the king named Durin and his son also named Durin, as if they are both reincarnations alive at the same time, is lol.

As I’ve said before I’m not big on the actual lore but just looking at a family tree, unless the Current Durin is killing him self the second his kid is born or something else happens having multiple Durin’s at the same time seems in line with lore as seen with Durin 1-6

[rhorle]

As I’ve said before I’m not big on the actual lore but just looking at a family tree, unless the Current Durin is killing him self the second his kid is born or something else happens having multiple Durin’s at the same time seems in line with lore as seen with Durin 1-6

Dwaves only live about 250 years though the first Durin lived so long he was called deathless. On your graphic I think you are missing the importance YT (year of trees), FA (first age), SA (second age), and TA (third age). So in lore there wasn't a Durin reborn alive at the same time though his bloodline survived. There is even writing from Tolkien that had the spirit of Durin re-enter his original body (that was somehow preserved) instead of being "reincarnated" in an heir of the bloodline.

The show has two alive because of the condensed time line. Despite people knowing of the condensed time line it is still something they love to point as a problem. With the condensed events of the show two alive at one time sense.

[rogoth]

As I’ve said before I’m not big on the actual lore but just looking at a family tree, unless the Current Durin is killing him self the second his kid is born or something else happens having multiple Durin’s at the same time seems in line with lore as seen with Durin 1-6

i have explained above how Durin the Deathless exists, i have explained how it's such a nonsensical farcical bullshit notion that this shitshow of a production tried to pass off, you don't need to understand the entire dwarven family lines to understand just how much of a stupid lazy and badly written plot point this was in the show.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Dwaves only live about 250 years though the first Durin lived so long he was called deathless. On your graphic I think you are missing the importance YT (year of trees), FA (first age), SA (second age), and TA (third age). So in lore there wasn't a Durin reborn alive at the same time though his bloodline survived. There is even writing from Tolkien that had the spirit of Durin re-enter his original body (that was somehow preserved) instead of being "reincarnated" in an heir of the bloodline.

The show has two alive because of the condensed time line. Despite people knowing of the condensed time line it is still something they love to point as a problem. With the condensed events of the show two alive at one time sense.

ah so it just seems like they would be father/son due to the direct descendant line and the unknown birth/death dates for most of them when it could really be gap beyond dwarven life spans.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

i have explained above how Durin the Deathless exists, i have explained how it's such a nonsensical farcical bullshit notion that this shitshow of a production tried to pass off, you don't need to understand the entire dwarven family lines to understand just how much of a stupid lazy and badly written plot point this was in the show.

I used the chart just because full family tree's are with graphics are cool not because you need to know it all.

[Forogil]

I don't understand what you're saying here. The idea behind dwarves being named Durin is, as you said, they are supposed to represent Durin reborn, so having the king named Durin and his son also named Durin, as if they are both reincarnations alive at the same time, is lol.

Exactly - the problem is that they live at the same time, which wasn't clear from the brief complaint about two Dwarfs.

[Syegfryed]

Right. I mean on some level it has to look something like what people expect out of the ip. It doesn’t have to be perfect, but it should somewhat match expectations of customers. This thing didn’t at all.

In addition to the big deals like mithril, it was small things like horribly miscasting Gil-Galad and Celebrimbor, having two dwarves names Durin, just like really small obvious self-owns all over the series.

And while it’s obvious that you need more than book readers to be successful, it doesn’t follow that you can therefore just ignore book readers. The whole thing is just mind boggling.

ITs a common fallacy that people use here screaming "you want the show/movie to be a carbon copy of the book!!!!", when this was never the point no one ever made

If you ignore how they butcher lore, since those people argue that the story isn't important, everything else is bad, the only two things that can be salvaged from this show are the CGI and SOME characters interactions, its not just a bad tolkien show, its a bad show in general

Oh and haha - check out my new sig!

you can find a lot those kind of contradictions

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As I’ve said before I’m not big on the actual lore but just looking at a family tree, unless the Current Durin is killing him self the second his kid is born or something else happens having multiple Durin’s at the same time seems in line with lore as seen with Durin 1-6

In the very image you posted says those Durins are NOT father and son, just direct descendant since they had dotlines instead of a complete line. So they were not alive at the same time

The only reason they made two durins, when it should not be possible its because they compressed the timeline, but they could have just fucking renamed him, its not like they were giving two shits about lore anyway

I can only think they plan to make the Balrog kill his father to earn the title of durin's bade, but that is already going to be pointless

[rhorle]

The only reason they made two durins, when it should not be possible its because they compressed the timeline, but they could have just fucking renamed him, its not like they were giving two shits about lore anyway

Do you honestly expect us to believe that you, and others, wouldn't complain that they then left out Durin IV? In the same post you said no one wants a 1:1 adaptation of the source material you complain about not following the source material. Lol.