1. #1021
    Quote Originally Posted by UnifiedDivide View Post
    Because, no matter how much they scream their projection onto others, they insist on being outraged over anything they can. They are unable to just walk away. I give Shadowferal shit for not actually finishing Wheel of Time and still complaining about things he's not really seen, but at least he had the principles to do so. People like Xath, on the other hand, need to bitch and moan as much as they can. They need to have something they can do so with. For a lot of people, it sadly defines them.

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    Reminds me of DC and them pushing movies out to try and do what Marvel have done, before eventually giving up because they just didn't understand how they were messing things up.
    Wheel of Time is one of my favorite book series of all time I've read and listened to it well over a dozen times. You on the other hand literally just exist to be contrary. You said nothing of substance in the WoT thread while others as much as I may have disagreed with them at least articulated their pov. LoTR is also up there for me almost like there is a huge overlap in fanbase.

  2. #1022
    Quote Originally Posted by Magnagarde View Post
    Hmm, I wrote that with the possibility that Amazon was going to buy the IP on my mind. I read it's going up for sale sometime soon and that Amazon is speculated to be the number one potential buyer, which is why I think it is possible that they expand the "canon universe" on their own because it'd be their property.
    You're talking about the IP rights for movies and games. The Tolkien Estate is not giving up the LOTR IP. It still would need to be liscenced through them, as well as all non-book material would still be deemed non-canon. Just as all movie and game material already is.

    You're talking about a liscencing deal which would allow Amazon to freely build a 'Cinematic Universe' between games and movies and make money off all existing games and movies being sold. It has nothing to do with making anything canonical to the books. We are solely talking about a potential Cinematic Universe. It will never enter the canon of the books, just being clear.

  3. #1023
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    To be fair, I doubt he'd approve of the Hobbit Trilogy just the same. New Line capitalized on making 3 movies out of something that had no reason being 3 movies.

    We don't even know if he would necessarily have approved the LOTR trilogy for that matter.
    If his son's opinion was any indication, probably not... though i'd argue Christopher might have been even more zealous in protecting his father's work than Tolkien himself was.
    Last edited by Ara Myrr; 2022-02-17 at 04:04 PM.

  4. #1024
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    They have 2 more seasons confirmed. Don't think they really mich care about whatever 'blew up on their face', since it doesn't seem to matter as much as people think it does.
    True, but I’m extremely curious to see if they scale back on the nonsense in season 2. They have to know that the series was very poorly received by its biggest fans.

  5. #1025
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    You're talking about the IP rights for movies and games. The Tolkien Estate is not giving up the LOTR IP. It still would need to be liscenced through them, as well as all non-book material would still be deemed non-canon. Just as all movie and game material already is.

    You're talking about a liscencing deal which would allow Amazon to freely build a 'Cinematic Universe' between games and movies and make money off all existing games and movies being sold. It has nothing to do with making anything canonical to the books. We are solely talking about a potential Cinematic Universe. It will never enter the canon of the books, just being clear.
    Oh, I thought they were selling the IP.

  6. #1026
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    As someone who loves Tolkien Lore and always tunes into channels like Nerd of the Rings and Broken Sword for my lore its really annoying to see youtube recommendations constantly recently keep showing the angry, whingy white boy channels as if to say you may also like this... I am like 'no, no I wont' and you cannot get rid of them I have blocked this one channel whose name rhymes with birdtonic at least 5 times now

    This happened with the Star Wars trilogy, before the new trilogy came out I was happy with my Star Wars lore channels then youtube just started sending me angry grifters every day as if to say 'yea, this is the same thing you like'

    And before anyone says 'oh so you think everyone who complains about the show is just a grifter man child' no I am not, I am saying if you gotta make one video everyday telling us that on youtube then yes you are.
    Last edited by Orby; 2022-02-17 at 06:48 PM.
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  7. #1027
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    As someone who loves Tolkien Lore and always tunes into channels like Nerd of the Rings and Broken Sword for my lore its really annoying to see youtube recommendations constantly recently keep showing the angry, whingy white boy channels as if to say you may also like this... I am like 'no, no I wont' and you cannot get rid of them I have blocked this one channel whose name rhymes with birdtonic at least 5 times now

    This happened with the Star Wars trilogy, before the new trilogy came out I was happy with my Star Wars lore channels then youtube just started sending me angry grifters every day as if to say 'yea, this is the same thing you like'

    Have these overgrown man children not grown up yet?

    And before anyone says 'oh so you think everyone who complains about the show is just a grifter man child' no I am not, I am saying if you gotta make one video everyday telling us that on youtube then yes you are.
    I feel this way about WoW news. I haven't played in over 10 years, but I still like to catch up on the news around the game. I used to listen to the Instance, but they did a big shift in focus away from Blizzard games since around the time of the big recent lawsuits.

    It's hard to find any WoW related news today without someone bringing in an angle. Sometimes I just wanna know what's happening, without it being filtered through some lens.

    I wouldn't even know where to start with LOTR news.

  8. #1028
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    https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...rings-of-power
    What, Exactly, Is the Source Material Here?

    So what did Amazon buy? “We have the rights solely to The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers, The Return of the King, the appendices, and The Hobbit,” Payne says. “And that is it. We do not have the rights to The Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, The History of Middle-earth, or any of those other books.” That takes a huge chunk of lore off the table and has left Tolkien fans wondering how this duo plans to tell a Second Age story without access to those materials. “There’s a version of everything we need for the Second Age in the books we have the rights to,” McKay says. “As long as we’re painting within those lines and not egregiously contradicting something we don’t have the rights to, there’s a lot of leeway and room to
    dramatize and tell some of the best stories that [Tolkien] ever came up with.”

    “We took all these little clues and thought of them as stars in the sky that we then connected to write the novel that Tolkien never wrote about the Second Age,” Payne says. The duo cites songs like “The Fall of Gil-galad” (you can hear actor Bill Nighy sing it here from a 1981 BBC Radio adaptation) or “The Song of Eärendil” or Fellowship chapters like “The Council of Elrond” and “The Shadow of the Past” or the “Concerning Hobbits” section of the prologue as sources for significant lore dumps. Beyond the premiere, there aren’t, however, any significant time jumps or, thus far, episode-long journeys to the past. The rights to the First Age material from The Silmarillion are still owned by the Tolkien estate.

    “We worked in conjunction with world-renowned Tolkien scholars and the Tolkien estate to make sure that the ways we connected the dots were Tolkienian and gelled with the experts’ and the estate’s understanding of the material,” Payne says.
    Last edited by Ihavewaffles; 2022-02-17 at 05:22 PM.

  9. #1029
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    And before anyone says 'oh so you think everyone who complains about the show is just a grifter man child' no I am not, I am saying if you gotta make one video everyday telling us that on youtube then yes you are.
    I mean, it's not really about being a child or not, they are simply milking the topic. Pretty normal behavior for many channels to follow and make multiple comments on the current hottest news, and LotR controversy is very hot right now. I would also not put scorn on this type of behavior, considering being YouTuber is main source of income for many.
    Last edited by Makabreska; 2022-02-17 at 05:30 PM.
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  10. #1030
    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    So what did Amazon buy? [B]“We have the rights solely to The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers, The Return of the King, the appendices, and The Hobbit,” Payne says. “And that is it. We do not have the rights to The Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, The History of Middle-earth, or any of those other books.”
    To be fair, I doubt the Tolkien Estate would ever liscence the latter for multimedia entertainment.

    Anything being done with the Second Age in movies or games would have to be mostly new stuff anyways.

  11. #1031
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magnagarde View Post
    Hmm, I wrote that with the possibility that Amazon was going to buy the IP on my mind. I read it's going up for sale sometime soon and that Amazon is speculated to be the number one potential buyer, which is why I think it is possible that they expand the "canon universe" on their own because it'd be their property.
    Oh, that is interesting. But, IMHO, I still don't think that it would make the series canon, in the end, just the books are canon, everything else is non-canon or "cinematic universe" at best.

    I might be wrong though, it does not seem like the tolkien state would sell it.
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  12. #1032
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    To be fair, I doubt the Tolkien Estate would ever liscence the latter for multimedia entertainment.

    Anything being done with the Second Age in movies or games would have to be mostly new stuff anyways.
    I used to complain that the family wouldn't license stuff, but with what amazon has done, I have changed my mind...

  13. #1033
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...rings-of-power
    What, Exactly, Is the Source Material Here?

    So what did Amazon buy? “We have the rights solely to The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers, The Return of the King, the appendices, and The Hobbit,” Payne says. “And that is it. We do not have the rights to The Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, The History of Middle-earth, or any of those other books.” That takes a huge chunk of lore off the table and has left Tolkien fans wondering how this duo plans to tell a Second Age story without access to those materials. “There’s a version of everything we need for the Second Age in the books we have the rights to,” McKay says. “As long as we’re painting within those lines and not egregiously contradicting something we don’t have the rights to, there’s a lot of leeway and room to
    dramatize and tell some of the best stories that [Tolkien] ever came up with.”

    “We took all these little clues and thought of them as stars in the sky that we then connected to write the novel that Tolkien never wrote about the Second Age,” Payne says. The duo cites songs like “The Fall of Gil-galad” (you can hear actor Bill Nighy sing it here from a 1981 BBC Radio adaptation) or “The Song of Eärendil” or Fellowship chapters like “The Council of Elrond” and “The Shadow of the Past” or the “Concerning Hobbits” section of the prologue as sources for significant lore dumps. Beyond the premiere, there aren’t, however, any significant time jumps or, thus far, episode-long journeys to the past. The rights to the First Age material from The Silmarillion are still owned by the Tolkien estate.

    “We worked in conjunction with world-renowned Tolkien scholars and the Tolkien estate to make sure that the ways we connected the dots were Tolkienian and gelled with the experts’ and the estate’s understanding of the material,” Payne says.
    Wow, they don't have permission to use the silmarillion? That explains A LOT, and also makes some things way weirder
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  14. #1034
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    As someone who loves Tolkien Lore and always tunes into channels like Nerd of the Rings and Broken Sword for my lore its really annoying to see youtube recommendations constantly recently keep showing the angry, whingy white boy channels as if to say you may also like this... I am like 'no, no I wont' and you cannot get rid of them I have blocked this one channel whose name rhymes with birdtonic at least 5 times now

    This happened with the Star Wars trilogy, before the new trilogy came out I was happy with my Star Wars lore channels then youtube just started sending me angry grifters every day as if to say 'yea, this is the same thing you like'

    Have these overgrown man children not grown up yet?

    And before anyone says 'oh so you think everyone who complains about the show is just a grifter man child' no I am not, I am saying if you gotta make one video everyday telling us that on youtube then yes you are.
    I had this issue with starwars as well when the sequels were fresh, I ended up just blocking any and all starwars content as every time I’d watch any thing starwars related I’d get endless rage videos, hell even today it still happens with SWtor trailers, it’s such a bother and I’d assume adding Lotr to that must be awful.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  15. #1035
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    I feel this way about WoW news. I haven't played in over 10 years, but I still like to catch up on the news around the game. I used to listen to the Instance, but they did a big shift in focus away from Blizzard games since around the time of the big recent lawsuits.

    It's hard to find any WoW related news today without someone bringing in an angle. Sometimes I just wanna know what's happening, without it being filtered through some lens.

    I wouldn't even know where to start with LOTR news.
    Broken Sword and Nerd of the Rings are two really good channels I like as far as anythign tolkien related goes, they most do lore videos but they will always talk about any upcoming news stories related to it,. they been doing trailer breakdowns and stuff recently.
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  16. #1036
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post

    It's like adapting a Shakespeare play to film but all you can use are Coles Notes.
    They've done this, to very great effect. It's a movie called 10 Things I Hate About You, and every woman my age loves that movie. It's based on The Taming of the Shrew.

    The Lion King is based on Hamlet. Ian McKellen played a fascist Richard III re-imagined in 1930s Britain. Romeo + Juliet is based on...well, you know, and it was a teen romcom in the 90s, and they used guns instead of swords.

    I'm sure there's others I can't think of, off the top of my head.

  17. #1037
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    You're talking about the IP rights for movies and games. The Tolkien Estate is not giving up the LOTR IP. It still would need to be liscenced through them, as well as all non-book material would still be deemed non-canon. Just as all movie and game material already is.

    You're talking about a liscencing deal which would allow Amazon to freely build a 'Cinematic Universe' between games and movies and make money off all existing games and movies being sold. It has nothing to do with making anything canonical to the books. We are solely talking about a potential Cinematic Universe. It will never enter the canon of the books, just being clear.
    I'm still sad that The White Council was canceled that game was going to be amazing and absolutely unprecedented in terms of Tolkien lore.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    They have 2 more seasons confirmed. Don't think they really mich care about whatever 'blew up on their face', since it doesn't seem to matter as much as people think it does.
    No they have one more season confirmed. The "confirmation" of season 3 was a late addition to criminal minds supposedly not being cast as part of the reboot. Aka not even close to an actual confirmation.

  18. #1038
    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    They've done this, to very great effect. It's a movie called 10 Things I Hate About You, and every woman my age loves that movie. It's based on The Taming of the Shrew.

    The Lion King is based on Hamlet. Ian McKellen played a fascist Richard III re-imagined in 1930s Britain. Romeo + Juliet is based on...well, you know, and it was a teen romcom in the 90s, and they used guns instead of swords.

    I'm sure there's others I can't think of, off the top of my head.
    Not quite what I'm talking about, but I get that I used a very loose example. What you've said here is very valid. I mean, my favourite adaptation of Macbeth is Kurosawa's Throne of Blood.

    These are adaptations that put their own spin on the original tale. Stuff like West Side Story is Romeo and Juliet in story and spirit, but everything else is changed. And to be fair, I probably wouldn't mind seeing something like this if Amazon was up for it. If this series embraced itself as a stylistic interpretation of the LOTR universe, set in the Second Age, I wouldn't be opposed at all. I'd probably accept it like how Star Wars Visions presented a bunch of non-canon Star Wars stories in the style of anime, created by popular anime studios.

    The problem I have (and most people seem to) is that they're doing the opposite, and trying to pass the series off as being an authentic story set in the LOTR universe, even though there's very little authentic about it.

  19. #1039
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    The problem I have (and most people seem to) is that they're doing the opposite, and trying to pass the series off as being an authentic story set in the LOTR universe, even though there's very little authentic about it.
    What does this even mean... Any adaptation that went through the proper channels to get made (as opposed to crap like those ridiculous Transmorphers rip-offs) is as """authentic""" as the next. Anything else is just the sort of worthless gatekeeping that gives fanboys a bad name.

  20. #1040
    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    What does this even mean... Any adaptation that went through the proper channels to get made (as opposed to crap like those ridiculous Transmorphers rip-offs) is as """authentic""" as the next. Anything else is just the sort of worthless gatekeeping that gives fanboys a bad name.
    Authentic as an adaptation of its own making, yes. Authentic to the source material, no.

    The Michael Bay Transformers movies may have defined themselves and its own style as a 'Transformers film series', but it is not authentic to the original source of the G1 cartoon series.

    I mean if we're just talking about adaptations that are being defined by their liscences, then I would actually call that all 'official' rather than 'authentic'. So like the Hobbit Trilogy are all officially liscenced Hobbit movies, but they're not authentic to the original source material (for many reasons which includes changes or additions that were not in the original story)
    Last edited by Triceron; 2022-02-17 at 06:39 PM.

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