Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[s_bushido]

My only hope is that if LOTR turns out to be a the woke fiasco that its looking like it might, that Blizzard takes a good long look at what it does to a popular franchise. Pandering to a misguided extremist minority is honestly completely insane.

lol... Sorry buddy, I don't think studios are going to stop casting brown people in their productions any time soon. You may have to get over it.

[Dhrizzle]

It is scraps when you want to make a show about the Second Age: From The Lord of the Rings, you get some accounts from Aragorn, Elrond or Gandalf and a few short lines in the appendices covering hundreds of years, and from The Hobbit, nothing at all.

But lets face it: all we know about the Second Age is sketchy at best. Even if we look at Akkalabêth, in The Silmarillion, it is not much. Especially if the show's story begins after the Downfall of Númenor. You could find more information in the Book of Lost Tales or Unfinished Tales, but even then it is rather sketchy and even contradictory (especially concerning Galadriel, where she was, when and where she met Celeborn and who the heck was even Celeborn?). But the Tolkien Estate didn't give them the rights to use these sources. Which means that it gives much leeway to the creators of the show. So of course it will be different from what we know (or think we know) about that time period and what the characters were doing. We should not consider this an adaptation, but treat the show as its own thing, on its own merits. Maybe it will be good, maybe it will suck. But whatever it is, contrary to what some have said, it won't destroy Tolkien's work. The books will remain there, unsullied, for everyone to enjoy.

I don't think that is entirely true, the licensing seems to allow them to delve into other volumes if it supports the stuff they are explicitly licensed to use. On top of that, judging by the trailer, they can also allow additional materials to be used on a case-by-case basis. Hence we get the Two Trees and what looks to be the Oath of Feanor.

[Shadowferal]

Your hoping that blizzard will remove black people and fighting women from wow then? Or is there some other “woke fiasco” on display in the little material we’ve seen so far?

Forsaken...those fuckers need to burn.
REMEMBER TELDRASSIL!!!1

[kenn9530]

Lol 90 million books sold worldwide is a “niche” fan base. You seemed to have left out the fact the show shed viewers big time every week.

90 million books is not 90 million fans so yes its niche and books are already niche fanbases to begin with

[Theangryone]

Books are niche fan bases lol, congrats on the dumbest shit I’ve read all day.

[Rennadrel]

Adaptations dont need to be faithful they can do whatever they want so in the end it doesnt matter in the slightest if the story is changed or not. LOTRs universe is subject to changes it doesnt need to follow everything written in the book, as long as its entertaining thats all that really matters.

By your dumb logic then there's no reason to brand a show or film after an IP that already exists if an adaptation "can do whatever they want". You know they did that right? And it actually worked out well once upon a time. The original West Side Story is an Americanized version of Romeo and Juliet, it's an adaptation using American cultural norms, and doesn't at all attempt to present itself as Romeo and Juliet. They do it because the name has recognition and is popular. Whether it be WoT, LOTR, Percy Jackson, Harry Potter, Conan the Barbarian and many more. Peter Jackson at least tried to be faithful to the books with the LOTR films, and Warner Bros did an alright job adapting the Harry Potter books even though they could have easily added in some more subplot stuff to make the movies flow a little better with some of the side characters. The Percy Jackson films took a lot of creative liberties and paid the price for it at the box office, despite the books being relatively popular.

WoT should have been a slam dunk had the writers just stuck to the plot and not try to hamfist in subplots that were never in the books and not ruined Rand's coming out moment as the Dragon Reborn at the end of the first fucking season with their strong woman moment of Egwene and Nynaeve killing a horde of Trollocs when they can barely even so much as touch the True Source instead of Rand obliterating two of the Forsaken at the Eye of the World. Not to mention completely omitting Elayne meeting Rand for the first time in Camelyn and gutting out Mat's story arc involving the Shadar Logoth dagger and how it ties him to Padan Fain for pretty much the entire series. WoT has plenty of moments where the female characters are interesting and badass, it just doesn't happen until much later in the story. Rafe Judkins is a talentless hack who should be fired into the sun for that piss ass excuse for a show.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Feels like if they just released the latest trailer instead of those few utterly disastrously bad teaser trailers things probably would have gone a bit better.

[s_bushido]

Feels like if they just released the latest trailer instead of those few utterly disastrously bad teaser trailers things probably would have gone a bit better.

And what makes you think that? I have no idea what was "disastrously bad" about any teasers they've released up to this point, but it's been clear for a while now that no one responding to this is interested in giving it a chance. It was basically doomed ever since the outrage merchants found out that they might be looking to hire someone whose job description involved dealing with nudity.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Explain how it wouldn't apply? Both groups are making up their mind on limited material.

Actually, one group has made up their minds. The other group is "hey, saying it sucks before you've even seen a single episode is a little premature"

- - - Updated - - -

Books are niche fan bases lol, congrats on the dumbest shit I’ve read all day.

I'll bet you that for every person you know that's read the Lord of the Rings I can find at least 50 that haven't but have seen the movies.

[rogoth]

Actually, one group has made up their minds. The other group is "hey, saying it sucks before you've even seen a single episode is a little premature"

- - - Updated - - -



I'll bet you that for every person you know that's read the Lord of the Rings I can find at least 50 that haven't but have seen the movies.

i'm genuinely curious, are there ever times in your life when you look at a product or service in your day to day, and think back to experiences you have had with similar things and judged the new thing as a result of past experiences?, because if not then you're literally the first person in human history to ever do this.

Based on past experience, and with the MANY examples of wokeness causing the downfall of franchises over the last 8-10 years now, it's not exactly hard to call out how badly this mess will perform regardless of how pretty and sparkly they try to dress it up as, a turd is a turd even if it's wrapped in gold, and blindly arguing with people to 'hey just wait and see, it might be good' is futile because based on past experience, the conclusion being made here is more likely than not the outcome that will come to pass, and yet you're still trying to peddle some hopium/copium levels of 'it won't be that bad surely'.

as to your second point, everybody i know who has seen the peter jackson trilogy has read the books in their entirety, so that's hundreds of people straight off the bat, if you expand that based on age you get an even bigger base of people who read the books before seeing the films, so sure, if you limit your search to people born in the last 15 years sure you're more likely to find people who have seen the films first then if interested enough have then gone on to read the books, but come on, now you're just skewing the results to favour your stance, not a great look honestly and the perfect politician style response.

[s_bushido]

MANY examples of wokeness causing the downfall of franchises over the last 8-10 years

lol
10char

[Adamas102]

Based on past experience, and with the MANY examples of wokeness causing the downfall of franchises over the last 8-10 years now...

Unless you’re making up your own definition of “wokeness”, it hasn’t caused the downfall of ANY franchises. That’s just the excuse of ignorant, narrow-minded people.

[Fuiking]

It is scraps when you want to make a show about the Second Age: From The Lord of the Rings, you get some accounts from Aragorn, Elrond or Gandalf and a few short lines in the appendices covering hundreds of years, and from The Hobbit, nothing at all.

But lets face it: all we know about the Second Age is sketchy at best. Even if we look at Akkalabêth, in The Silmarillion, it is not much. Especially if the show's story begins after the Downfall of Númenor. You could find more information in the Book of Lost Tales or Unfinished Tales, but even then it is rather sketchy and even contradictory (especially concerning Galadriel, where she was, when and where she met Celeborn and who the heck was even Celeborn?). But the Tolkien Estate didn't give them the rights to use these sources. Which means that it gives much leeway to the creators of the show. So of course it will be different from what we know (or think we know) about that time period and what the characters were doing. We should not consider this an adaptation, but treat the show as its own thing, on its own merits. Maybe it will be good, maybe it will suck. But whatever it is, contrary to what some have said, it won't destroy Tolkien's work. The books will remain there, unsullied, for everyone to enjoy.

its sketchy because up to Tolkiens dead the changed shit. *cough Elendur says hi*

[rogoth]

Unless you’re making up your own definition of “wokeness”, it hasn’t caused the downfall of ANY franchises. That’s just the excuse of ignorant, narrow-minded people.

that's entirely your own opinion, and yet the numbers are there and there have been countless examples now over the years, but you keep believing what you want to believe.

can you please explain how anybody here is 'ignorant', when not even the showrunners themselves know what they are doing?, meaning that by definition nobody can be ignorant of anything because there's no information available to educate oneself any better, unless you're using the word as synonym for being rude, in which case there's none of that either, so it doesn't work in either context, as for being narrow minded, i wasn't aware that using past experience to form a judgement about something that looks exactly like other failed projects using the exact same playbook was being 'close minded', if anything it's called 'using your better judgement', the only time you can even dare to call someone close minded in regard to this clusterfuck of a project is if they state they dislike it and after watching maintain the exact same arguements as prior to watching, and only then does the definition of that term stick, until then you're just mad that people are calling this mess exactly what it is appearing to be and aren't blindly praising this as the next big thing for gender politics and racial diversity set in a universe created with none of those things in mind.

- - - Updated - - -

lol
10char

i'm glad you find that funny, personally i don't, i don't enjoy seeing things i grew up with taken by some upstart that thinks they are hotter than the sun with delusions of grandeur take a shit all over beloved franchises and products just to try and be 'the next big thing', but if you enjoy this sort of thing more power to you kiddo.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

as to your second point, everybody i know who has seen the peter jackson trilogy has read the books in their entirety, so that's hundreds of people straight off the bat, if you expand that based on age you get an even bigger base of people who read the books before seeing the films, so sure, if you limit your search to people born in the last 15 years sure you're more likely to find people who have seen the films first then if interested enough have then gone on to read the books, but come on, now you're just skewing the results to favour your stance, not a great look honestly and the perfect politician style response.

I mean, you're just straight up lying when you say that everyone you know that has watched the movies has also read all the books.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Based on past experience, and with the MANY examples of wokeness causing the downfall of franchises over the last 8-10 years now,

Generally curious, could you name a few? I can’t think of any actual franchise that haven’t already been on a downwards trend (terminator) or Hadn't had a new instalment in years (ghost busters) where people have said wokeness was the downfall it was actually true.

[Adamas102]

It’s pretty telling that you’re unable to provide any examples of such ruined franchises. Again, unless you’re making up your own definition, there are absolutely no negatives to “wokeness”.

And hey, if it was ever I doubt that you didn’t know what you were talking about we have this quote right here:

…gender politics and racial diversity set in a universe created with none of those things in mind.

A universe without racial diversity in mind? Tell me you don’t know jack shit about Tolkien’s writings without telling me you don’t know jack shit about Tolkien’s writings. A world filled with various sorts of humans, elves, dwarves, hobbits, gnomes, and other beings isn’t “racially diverse”? Really? Ooooh yeah, what you meant was “certain skin colors don’t belong in this fantasy world filled with such abundance of racial diversity”. You still wondering who I’m referring to when I say “ignorant and narrow-minded”?

You’ll have to elaborate on what you mean by “gender politics” since it’s pretty much a meaningless term tossed about by guys who feel threatened by women not sticking to their traditional gender roles. That being said, I guess you’ve conveniently forgotten about the character of Eowyn whose narrative centers around opposing gender norms.

You claim you grew up with these stories but apparently you don’t know a thing about them. A universe without gender politics or racial diversity in mind? Fuck off and maybe go read the books again…

[rogoth]

I mean, you're just straight up lying when you say that everyone you know that has watched the movies has also read all the books.

actually, no i'm not, because everybody i went through school with read the books as part of the curriculum, alongside that the films released a few years into my secondary school years, meaning that alongside HAVING to read the books, they also saw the films as they were the biggest blockbuster movies of that time period, and in my year group alone that's 230 students, everybody who i know who is older than me has read the books, as the PJ trilogy didn't exist at that point so no, i wasn't 'lying' and to even try to use that as a comeback makes you look even more desperate than you already were previously.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

actually, no i'm not, because everybody i went through school with read the books as part of the curriculum, alongside that the films released a few years into my secondary school years, meaning that alongside HAVING to read the books, they also saw the films as they were the biggest blockbuster movies of that time period, and in my year group alone that's 230 students, everybody who i know who is older than me has read the books, as the PJ trilogy didn't exist at that point so no, i wasn't 'lying' and to even try to use that as a comeback makes you look even more desperate than you already were previously.

You're not convincing annyone with this story.

"Everyone older than me read the books"

It's a bold faced fucking lie.

[rogoth]

It’s pretty telling that you’re unable to provide any examples of such ruined franchises. Again, unless you’re making up your own definition, there are absolutely no negatives to “wokeness”.

And hey, if it was ever I doubt that you didn’t know what you were talking about we have this quote right here:



A universe without racial diversity in mind? Tell me you don’t know jack shit about Tolkien’s writings without telling me you don’t know jack shit about Tolkien’s writings. A world filled with various sorts of humans, elves, dwarves, hobbits, gnomes, and other beings isn’t “racially diverse”? Really? Ooooh yeah, what you meant was “certain skin colors don’t belong in this fantasy world filled with such abundance of racial diversity”. You still wondering who I’m referring to when I say “ignorant and narrow-minded”?

You’ll have to elaborate on what you mean by “gender politics” since it’s pretty much a meaningless term tossed about by guys who feel threatened by women not sticking to their traditional gender roles. That being said, I guess you’ve conveniently forgotten about the character of Eowyn whose narrative centers around opposing gender norms.

You claim you grew up with these stories but apparently you don’t know a thing about them. A universe without gender politics or racial diversity in mind? Fuck off and maybe go read the books again…

oh, you want to be a pedantic fuck now?, ok then lets dance, since you seem incapable of distinguishing context, i used the terms i did in DIRECT RELATION to this steaming pile of shit they call 'the rings of power', 'gender politics' is having Galadriel become warrior goddess of middle earth because all of her established lore and story means nothing am i right?, i said 'racial diversity' with regards to the absolutely fucking moronic casting involved in the show with absolutely no basis in the overarching themes created by Tolkein for those fictional races he created, it has nothing to do with the utter moronic strawman arguement you're trying to peddle but nice try.

and since it's clear you're mentally indoctrinated into the woke brigade, here's a few examples of 'wokeness' that have ruined a franchise or straight up killed the potential for one to exist to begin with:

captain marvel
men in black: international
charlies angels 2019 reboot
ghostbusters 2016 reboot
star wars 'fuck you' trilogy
terminator dark fate (this has almost single handedly killed the terminator franchise from ever getting another movie release)
harley quinn: birds of prey
batwoman TV series
the 355
west side story 2021

this is just a 'small' list of shows/movies/projects that have failed both commercially and critically due to the stereotypical 'woke' hallmarks of pushing gender politics where it doesn't exit, adding racial diversity when it's not there, among other stereotypes based on the projects as a whole.

so mr pedantic fuck, wanna keep going or is this enough for you?

if you feel so inclined in future to make an ass of yourself, try and at least make it interesting.