1. #1921
    Bloodsail Admiral Krawu's Avatar
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    Considering how much cheaper Jacksons trilogy was than this series it's kind of hilarious that they were able to employ real armor smiths who, while not necessarily using proper steel to make the props, at least made them with the proper techniques, resulting in an authentic look even in close-up shots. They were also very much trying to base their armor designs in functional ones from history, not just on what the cheapest costume designer they could find thinks might look cool.
    The costumes in Rings of Power all look like some weird mix between the worst the later seasons of GoT had to offer and the costumes in the current run of terrible Marvel shows and movies.

  2. #1922
    Quote Originally Posted by Krawu View Post
    Considering how much cheaper Jacksons trilogy was than this series it's kind of hilarious that they were able to employ real armor smiths who, while not necessarily using proper steel to make the props, at least made them with the proper techniques, resulting in an authentic look even in close-up shots. They were also very much trying to base their armor designs in functional ones from history, not just on what the cheapest costume designer they could find thinks might look cool.
    The costumes in Rings of Power all look like some weird mix between the worst the later seasons of GoT had to offer and the costumes in the current run of terrible Marvel shows and movies.
    To be fair, if you adjust for inflation all three Peter Jackson movies combined only were a few millions cheaper. But yeah, your point still stands. They had an entire team of people who would do nothing but make mail armor for the extras and the extra effort was really noticeable.
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

  3. #1923
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    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    Is The Boys a good adaptation? It differs wildly from the comics. What about Game of Thrones? Even in the first four seasons which were pretty book accurate, some things, like Arya meeting Tywin Lannister, were made up for the show. The whole Ros storyline as well.

    Usually, it being a quality piece of media, and following the themes and narrative through-lines of the original work, is what makes a show a good adaptation. Not it being a word for word translation onto the screen.
    The Boys is a fine enough adaptation, for something that is pretty obviously woke too. Because it's still entertaining and funny. I do think those things can work out well, being topical and bringing up current day issues and I think it's actually done a good job in that respect.

    Frankly, I don't even consider this "LOTR" show to have anything to do with it. LotR is literally it's own thing, it's own trilogy. Amazon uses that name because it's a brand, yet Tolkien never labeled all of his books with Lord of the Rings on the front except for the trilogy. That might seem like semantics but it's sensible.

    It's no a real adaptation, in my mind since most of it is clearly just made up or doesn't follow Tolkien's lore.and timelines properly.

  4. #1924
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    exactly it doesn't matter what property it is attached to good casting and being hot will get people to go see a movie no matter if they are race swapping characters or not.

    FF4 should have just gotten a hotter actor.
    Michael B Jordan is objectively hot as hell. The difference is the change was attached to a property people actually care about.

  5. #1925
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    Michael B Jordan is objectively hot as hell. The difference is the change was attached to a property people actually care about.
    except that falls apart instantly when you look at the new batman which also swapped the race of a main character is more cared about then the FF and still did great.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  6. #1926
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    Frankly, I don't even consider this "LOTR" show to have anything to do with it. LotR is literally it's own thing, it's own trilogy. Amazon uses that name because it's a brand, yet Tolkien never labeled all of his books with Lord of the Rings on the front except for the trilogy. That might seem like semantics but it's sensible.

    It's no a real adaptation, in my mind since most of it is clearly just made up or doesn't follow Tolkien's lore.and timelines properly.
    Well, technically they’re drawing a lot from the LotR appendices, so while it’s not the LotR narrative it’s still derived from the book.

    As for the timeline, the change makes sense given that they’re trying to make a more or less continuous narrative from what is essentially a loose set of notes.

    “The biggest deviation the writers made from Tolkien's works… was to condense these events from taking place over thousands of years into a short time period. This was to avoid the human characters frequently dying throughout the series due to their relatively short lifespans, and to allow major characters from later in the timeline to be introduced earlier in the series.”

    Whether you like it or not, it’s still a real adaptation. What Tolkien left for the FA and SA was pretty barebones in terms of overarching narrative so adapting it to a show that works requires a lot of changes and added material. The bones (the characters and events) are still there, though.

  7. #1927
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    except that falls apart instantly when you look at the new batman which also swapped the race of a main character is more cared about then the FF and still did great.
    Catwoman is not more cared about than FF lol. Also there is a year 1 incarnation who was black as well as Eartha Kitt. Selina has had a lot more different looks than most mainline characters.
    Last edited by Xath; 2022-07-22 at 03:54 AM.

  8. #1928
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    Catwoman is not more cared about than FF lol. Also there is a year 1 incarnation who was black as well as Eartha Kitt. Selina has had a lot more different looks than most mainline characters.
    More cared about then the FF as a whole? no probably not, More cared about then just johnny storm the only character the actually turned black? absolutely.

    and year 1's or any other alternate universes are irrelevant to the general public they aren't going to know about any thing but the most common version of the character and for catwoman that's a white woman.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  9. #1929
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    The Boys is a fine enough adaptation, for something that is pretty obviously woke too. Because it's still entertaining and funny. I do think those things can work out well, being topical and bringing up current day issues and I think it's actually done a good job in that respect.

    Frankly, I don't even consider this "LOTR" show to have anything to do with it. LotR is literally it's own thing, it's own trilogy. Amazon uses that name because it's a brand, yet Tolkien never labeled all of his books with Lord of the Rings on the front except for the trilogy. That might seem like semantics but it's sensible.

    It's no a real adaptation, in my mind since most of it is clearly just made up or doesn't follow Tolkien's lore.and timelines properly.
    The Boys initially and somewhat through the 2nd season mocked both sides fairly equally and only really got "woke" in the end of the second season and most of the third. I mean Seth's grubby paws are obviously on it way more and it was probably around the time he was having his hissy fits on Twitter about the failed Santa thing. If the mindset was the same as S1, A-Train's town would have been on fire and businesses would have been demolished while Neuman or someone else cheered them on.

  10. #1930
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krawu View Post
    Considering how much cheaper Jacksons trilogy was than this series it's kind of hilarious that they were able to employ real armor smiths who, while not necessarily using proper steel to make the props, at least made them with the proper techniques, resulting in an authentic look even in close-up shots. They were also very much trying to base their armor designs in functional ones from history, not just on what the cheapest costume designer they could find thinks might look cool.
    The costumes in Rings of Power all look like some weird mix between the worst the later seasons of GoT had to offer and the costumes in the current run of terrible Marvel shows and movies.
    Most of the reasoning for the lack of funds of the Lord of the Rings movie came from the fact that studios saw no money in 'fantasy' movies at the time, and didn't want to invest in something that was commonly known to bomb. Which is still amazing to me how they pulled it off :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    Catwoman is not more cared about than FF lol. Also there is a year 1 incarnation who was black as well as Eartha Kitt. Selina has had a lot more different looks than most mainline characters.


    To be fair Catwoman's look has never been consistent in all media, hell, there was a time in the comics where she was portrayed as a more tanned character. Which was when I started reading Batman... Outside of being Asian you could probably put any ethnicity in her role and no one would care :P
    Last edited by Orby; 2022-07-22 at 07:00 AM.
    "People fear, not death, but having life taken from them. Many waste the life given to them, occupying themselves with things that do not matter. When the end comes, they say they did not have time enough to spend with loved ones, to fulfill dreams, to go on adventures they only talked about... But why should you fear death if you are happy with the life you have led, if you can look back on everything and say, 'Yes, I am content. It is enough.'" - Wynne ( Dragon Age: Origins.)

  11. #1931
    Pit Lord Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krawu View Post
    Considering how much cheaper Jacksons trilogy was than this series it's kind of hilarious that they were able to employ real armor smiths who, while not necessarily using proper steel to make the props, at least made them with the proper techniques, resulting in an authentic look even in close-up shots. They were also very much trying to base their armor designs in functional ones from history, not just on what the cheapest costume designer they could find thinks might look cool.
    The costumes in Rings of Power all look like some weird mix between the worst the later seasons of GoT had to offer and the costumes in the current run of terrible Marvel shows and movies.
    I actually love the new costumes on the promo shots. But than again, I also love GoT and "the current run of terrible marvel shows and movies".

    Honestly, how can you people be so damn negative about this show? It's looking great so far, and it makes no sense to cry if you haven't even seen the first episode yet.

  12. #1932
    Quote Originally Posted by Adamas102 View Post
    Well, technically they’re drawing a lot from the LotR appendices, so while it’s not the LotR narrative it’s still derived from the book.

    As for the timeline, the change makes sense given that they’re trying to make a more or less continuous narrative from what is essentially a loose set of notes.

    “The biggest deviation the writers made from Tolkien's works… was to condense these events from taking place over thousands of years into a short time period. This was to avoid the human characters frequently dying throughout the series due to their relatively short lifespans, and to allow major characters from later in the timeline to be introduced earlier in the series.”

    Whether you like it or not, it’s still a real adaptation. What Tolkien left for the FA and SA was pretty barebones in terms of overarching narrative so adapting it to a show that works requires a lot of changes and added material. The bones (the characters and events) are still there, though.
    If they are changing the timeline and condensing the story then they are not doing an adaptation because this fundamentally goes against the lore. Not to mention they are doing it because they want to change the characters roles as told in the lore, not because there isn't enough information to go by. There is more than enough information to know the general outline of the 2nd age events and the core issue is that they just want to tell their own story and are using these things as justification. They wanted to show women leading the war against evil and that is pretty much the focus of everything that they wanted to do which has nothing to do with Tolkien or his work. It is just part of the mandates that companies like Amazon have for content they produce so they had to rework the lore in order to make it work. This is no different than what happened in the sequel trilogy of Star Wars. This is why they no longer say this is an adaptation but "based on" Tolkien because it literally is a different story. And this is just what Hollywood does. Most times they buy the rights to something they feel that gives them to do whatever they want to begin with. It is rare that they actually stick to the lore as close as possible even when they have all the lore and access to the author. The second age was not the story of Galadriel being this super warrior that had to drag the males kicking and screaming into a fight along side the Queen of Numenor. That is outright fan fiction. It is no different than saying I am writing a story about Superman and instead of him coming from Krypton I say he came from Whoville and was allergic to green ham. It isn't the same story so not an adaptation.
    Last edited by InfiniteCharger; 2022-07-22 at 06:32 PM.

  13. #1933
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  14. #1934
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kreuger View Post
    This trailer may have won me over more than previous ones. there are some things about it that look iffy to me, but I really need to see it to really get a understanding. But going by the trailer alone, not as bad as I thought.
    "People fear, not death, but having life taken from them. Many waste the life given to them, occupying themselves with things that do not matter. When the end comes, they say they did not have time enough to spend with loved ones, to fulfill dreams, to go on adventures they only talked about... But why should you fear death if you are happy with the life you have led, if you can look back on everything and say, 'Yes, I am content. It is enough.'" - Wynne ( Dragon Age: Origins.)

  15. #1935
    Don't care what naysayers may say, I think the trailer looks cool.

    How the show actually does is still a wait-and-see.

  16. #1936
    Now that is by far the best promo they've done for the show. Actually fucking epic. Please, just let the writing be good.

  17. #1937
    Over 9000! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InfiniteCharger View Post
    If they are changing the timeline and condensing the story then they are not doing an adaptation because this fundamentally goes against the lore. Not to mention they are doing it because they want to change the characters roles as told in the lore, not because there isn't enough information to go by. There is more than enough information to know the general outline of the 2nd age events and the core issue is that they just want to tell their own story and are using these things as justification. They wanted to show women leading the war against evil and that is pretty much the focus of everything that they wanted to do which has nothing to do with Tolkien or his work. It is just part of the mandates that companies like Amazon have for content they produce so they had to rework the lore in order to make it work. This is no different than what happened in the sequel trilogy of Star Wars. This is why they no longer say this is an adaptation but "based on" Tolkien because it literally is a different story. And this is just what Hollywood does. Most times they buy the rights to something they feel that gives them to do whatever they want to begin with. It is rare that they actually stick to the lore as close as possible even when they have all the lore and access to the author. The second age was not the story of Galadriel being this super warrior that had to drag the males kicking and screaming into a fight along side the Queen of Numenor. That is outright fan fiction. It is no different than saying I am writing a story about Superman and instead of him coming from Krypton I say he came from Whoville and was allergic to green ham. It isn't the same story so not an adaptation.
    Tell me you haven't read Tolkien's writing on Galadriel without telling me you haven't read Tolkien's writing on Galadriel.


    Tolkien's vision of Galadriel (and Celeborn) changed over time, both before and after he wrote Lord of the Rings (where she says, "together through ages of the world we have fought the long defeat"). The Second Age has less in the Legendarium than the First or Second. None of us are in any position to fairly judge what we have not yet seen, be it good or ill. But what we have seen so far matches with what Tolkien actually wrote just fine.

    From just Unfinished Tales and confined to events of the Second Age,
    "eventually Galadriel became aware that Sauron again, as in the ancient days of the captivity of Melkor, had been left behind. Or rather, since Sauron had as yet no single name, and his operations had not been perceived to proceed from a single evil spirit, prime servant of Melkor, she perceived that there was an evil controlling purpose abroad in the world"
    "She looked upon the Dwarves also with the eye of a commander, seeing in them the finest warriors to pit against the Orcs."
    "In Eregion Sauron posed as an emissary of the Valar, sent by them to Middle-earth (‘thus anticipating the Istari’) or ordered by them to remain there to give aid to the Elves. He perceived at once that Galadriel would be his chief adversary and obstacle, and he endeavoured therefore to placate her, bearing her scorn with outward patience and courtesy."
    "In Lórinand Galadriel took up rule, and defence against Sauron."
    "she deemed it her duty to remain in Middle-earth while Sauron was still unconquered"
    And, finally,
    It may be noted here that the absence of any indication to the contrary in The Lord of the Rings had led commentators to the natural assumption that Galadriel and Celeborn passed the latter half of the Second Age and all the Third in Lothlórien; but this was not so, though their story as outlined in ‘Concerning Galadriel and Celeborn’ was greatly modified afterwards
    "In today’s America, conservatives who actually want to conserve are as rare as liberals who actually want to liberate. The once-significant language of an earlier era has had the meaning sucked right out of it, the better to serve as camouflage for a kleptocratic feeding frenzy in which both establishment parties participate with equal abandon" (Taking a break from the criminal, incompetent liars at the NSA, to bring you the above political observation, from The Archdruid Report.)

  18. #1938
    Quote Originally Posted by InfiniteCharger View Post
    If they are changing the timeline and condensing the story then they are not doing an adaptation because this fundamentally goes against the lore. Not to mention they are doing it because they want to change the characters roles as told in the lore, not because there isn't enough information to go by. There is more than enough information to know the general outline of the 2nd age events and the core issue is that they just want to tell their own story and are using these things as justification. They wanted to show women leading the war against evil and that is pretty much the focus of everything that they wanted to do which has nothing to do with Tolkien or his work. It is just part of the mandates that companies like Amazon have for content they produce so they had to rework the lore in order to make it work. This is no different than what happened in the sequel trilogy of Star Wars. This is why they no longer say this is an adaptation but "based on" Tolkien because it literally is a different story. And this is just what Hollywood does. Most times they buy the rights to something they feel that gives them to do whatever they want to begin with. It is rare that they actually stick to the lore as close as possible even when they have all the lore and access to the author. The second age was not the story of Galadriel being this super warrior that had to drag the males kicking and screaming into a fight along side the Queen of Numenor. That is outright fan fiction. It is no different than saying I am writing a story about Superman and instead of him coming from Krypton I say he came from Whoville and was allergic to green ham. It isn't the same story so not an adaptation.
    Changing the timeline means its no longer an adaptation… noted…

    Guess we never had a lord of the rings adaptation =\ PJ condensed a 60 year timeline into a year…

    All this negativity reminds me that PJ’s movies recieved a lot of hate from some folks while in production. The Arwen at helms deep thing nearly got him crucified, but he changed course on that one…

    I’m looking forward to this! I can see the consistency in architecture, music and general story beats of the lotr movies. If you consider this is the story of the rings of power coming into being through the hands of sauron, the lord of the rings the title is pretty apt too.

    Sorry for those who dislike or dismiss this due to wokeness or percieved deviations of obscure lore, but I think I have a pretty damn decent shot at an incredibly high quality fantasy series with a plot deeply rooted in incredible lore.
    Last edited by Veggie50; 2022-07-22 at 10:26 PM.

  19. #1939
    I really hope androgynous Eminem here is not supposed to be Sauron.
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

  20. #1940
    Pandaren Monk rogoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Was that something the writers, actors and special effects dudes did?

    Also what do you think "political" means?
    yes, no, no, the 'super fan' trailers were made with people who were brought in to act like fans of the shit they were shown, not to mention because they picked a gay black guy for the British trailer and they liked so much his stereotypical 'gay enthusiasm' for falling in love with a 'broken yet fixable' sauron character, they had him repeat the scene and filmed it all again to get that into the trailer twice when they did the edited supercut of the whole thing, it's actually embarrassing just how much production value was put into these 'fan discussions' that were supposed to be off the cuff talking about the small teaser they were shown at the all inclusive paid for event venue where they were flown in, hospitality provided along with various gifts that they didn't disclose until it was leaked, so i would say that the whole thing pushing 'the message' was a 'political' move and one that failed for them epically.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Veggie50 View Post
    Changing the timeline means its no longer an adaptation… noted…

    Guess we never had a lord of the rings adaptation =\ PJ condensed a 60 year timeline into a year

    All this negativity reminds me that PJ’s movies recieved a lot of hate from some folks while in production. The Arwen at helms deep thing nearly got him crucified, but he changed course on that one…

    I’m looking forward to this! I can see the consistency in architecture, music and general story beats of the lotr movies. If you consider this is the story of the rings of power coming into being through the hands of sauron, the lord of the rings the title is pretty apt too.

    Sorry for those who dislike or dismiss this due to wokeness or percieved deviations of obscure lore, but I think I have a pretty damn decent shot at an incredibly high quality fantasy series with a plot deeply rooted in incredible lore.
    there's a magnitude of difference between condensing the events of LOTR and the abomination these completely novice writers are trying to push out, whereby they have come out and admitted they are condensing down millennia of time in order to make things work, in the LOTR movies it's perfectly conceivable that all the characters could have met each other within the scope of the timeline, yet here we have the utterly moronic showrunners making it so characters that are long since dead are suddenly alive and interacting with other characters that weren't even born when they were around originally, but yeah, you keep trying to compare apples to oranges, see how well that works out for ya.

    that's great that you're looking forward to it, i hope it's everything you want it to be, but based on past experience it's likely going to the shitstorm we all expect it to be so you're going to be in the extreme minority when it comes to the people who are able to put the entire world Tolkein made to one side and just enjoy this clownfiesta as a standalone fan fiction.

    about that, Sauron didn't make ANY of the rings of power save for his master ring, he imparted the knowledge of how to craft said rings onto celembrimbor who forged all 9 rings for men and the 7 for the dwarves, these are the only rings Sauron had any influence over with regards to their crafting as the 3 elven rings were made exclusively by celebrimbor alone using the knowledge that Sauron had shared, that's why the elves were able to still use their power to a degree without Sauron noticing initially, at least pretend like you know what you're talking about.

    i can't believe you said that unironically with a straight face, you genuinely believe this fan fiction excuse for a show is actually going to be an 'incredibly high quality fantasy series', and you're deluded enough to think that the scraps and morsels they are working with regarding source material is going to see a 'plot deeply rooted in incredible lore' when they can't even write the established characters properly?, i want whatever drugs you're taking if this is the delusion you're living in, because i too would like to share in some utterly deluded bullshit myself.

    retired march 2013 RIP - returned january 2016, purely because paladins finally get Ashbringer!

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