1. #1

    Are they really removing Sindragosa's Fury in BFA?

    I don't even care if they don't keep it as the same ability (although it'd be pretty cool, don't know why they'd change it, they could just tweak the numbers) but the effects of that skill are AMAZING and they should not be wasted.

    You literally call upon Sindragosa to lay down a breath of frost upon your enemies - can't get much cooler than that. Why would they remove such an ability/effect?

  2. #2
    Yep, a shame too.

    But the good news is that our tier 58 talent row and tier 60 talent row swapped places! That should fix most of the specs problems and I know everyone was asking for, and excited about, that switch....

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoeth View Post
    Yep, a shame too.

    But the good news is that our tier 58 talent row and tier 60 talent row swapped places! That should fix most of the specs problems and I know everyone was asking for, and excited about, that switch....
    How do you think Frost is looking in BFA? Playstyle-wise mostly the same or has something changed? Will haste levels affect our rotation too much?

    Also, I'm really bummed about the removal of Sindragosa if that is the case, I don't know how Blizzard can waste such a beautiful skill like that. So much work must've gone into making the skill/effects just to remove it out of nowhere.

  4. #4
    The rotation/priority seems to be the same, more or less, but could change with further tuning (lol yeah right...maybe in the second raid tier when blizzard realizes frost is dead spec). The loss of secondary stats is REALLY painful as far as resource generation goes and the spec is very slow. RA procs are less frequent, ME procs are far less frequent, lost Rune Frost, lost attack speed from Blades of Frost, and you are never going to get 10 stacks of GS without hero and/or obliteration up. Blizzard needs to buff Runic Empowerment by probably 30-60% to make the spec not feel awful to play. Horn of Winter is pretty much mandatory to not feel like you spend half your time waiting with nothing to do.

    Talents:
    - With such low resource regen you sit with fewer than 3 runes quite often, which would seem to make Frozen Pulse a viable option but it is still too undertuned and outclassed by GS for single target and FSc for multiple targets.
    - Shattering Strikes is dead without T21 4-piece and such low resource regen making RA mandatory.
    - Icy Talons might be the best choice considering auto attack damage is a MUCH higher portion of overall damage, but it would be far better if it could be combined with RA to actually increase RP generation
    - HRW on its own isn't worth it.
    - FSc would help slow down rune usage and make it feel like there are fewer open GCDs, but with such low levels of crit you won't be getting many KM procs so unless you are fighting 3+ targets (and honestly probably 4+ considering mastery levels are so low) it isn't worth using FSc
    - BoS is deader than dead since you can't keep it up at all with the miserable resource regeneration.
    - GA is still an utterly worthless talent.
    - Winter is Coming is bugged. RW both procs and breaks the root. Been this way for a while and still not fixed. Will probably go live like this
    - Blinding sheet is worthless since it breaks on damage.

    Overall
    Frost has lost virtually all of its M+ assets: no stuns of any kind (both Winter is Coming and Singragosa' Fury stun are gone), no offensive dispell (lost that to DHs), no debuff purge, ZERO defensive ability (lost Mirror Ball, lost the Volatile Shielding boost AMS, lost IBF/DS heal as meager as it was, IBF is still pitifully weak in PVE), our Battle Rez requires considerable resources (which we rarely have available) and will be more difficult to use than other brez's. Overall damage in raids and M+ may or may not be okay (I lean toward the latter based on Blizzards history with the spec and lack of attention so far in BfA) but I haven't been grouped with many other specs nor seen logs or performances yet. We lost mastery scaling on Obliterate, lost critical damage scaling from Nothing but the Boots, lost mastery scaling from Crystalline Swords, and lost RP generation from the artifact trait that boots OB's RP output. The spec plays VERY slow and although I don't play many other specs for comparison, it just isn't fun right now. Maybe more gear and Azerite traits will help, but I wouldn't hold your breath.
    Last edited by Hoeth; 2018-06-06 at 03:04 PM.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoeth View Post
    Overall
    Frost has lost virtually all of its M+ assets: no stuns of any kind (both Winter is Coming and Singragosa' Fury stun are gone), no offensive dispell (lost that to DHs), no debuff purge, ZERO defensive ability (lost Mirror Ball, lost the Volatile Shielding boost AMS, lost IBF/DS heal as meager as it was, IBF is still pitifully weak in PVE), our Battle Rez requires considerable resources (which we rarely have available) and will be more difficult to use than other brez's. Overall damage in raids and M+ may or may not be okay (I lean toward the latter based on Blizzards history with the spec and lack of attention so far in BfA) but I haven't been grouped with many other specs nor seen logs or performances yet. We lost mastery scaling on Obliterate, lost critical damage scaling from Nothing but the Boots, lost mastery scaling from Crystalline Swords, and lost RP generation from the artifact trait that boots OB's RP output. The spec plays VERY slow and although I don't play many other specs for comparison, it just isn't fun right now. Maybe more gear and Azerite traits will help, but I wouldn't hold your breath.
    In short they want everyone to roll unholy again this expansion. Nothing new really. I can't even get mad anymore at Blizzard, it's so transparent and happens all the time,it's just par for the course. At least I can have my skeleton glyph again.

  6. #6
    Thanks for the recap. That hugely sucks, I really wanted to play Frost with Blood as an offspec in BFA but...yeah, guess I'll have to go Unholy + Blood it seems?

  7. #7
    Got it back as a talent. really wouldnt miss it, since its a 5 minute fire and forget; I think on BETA the time has changed.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoeth View Post
    The rotation/priority seems to be the same, more or less, but could change with further tuning (lol yeah right...maybe in the second raid tier when blizzard realizes frost is dead spec). The loss of secondary stats is REALLY painful as far as resource generation goes and the spec is very slow. RA procs are less frequent, ME procs are far less frequent, lost Rune Frost, lost attack speed from Blades of Frost, and you are never going to get 10 stacks of GS without hero and/or obliteration up. Blizzard needs to buff Runic Empowerment by probably 30-60% to make the spec not feel awful to play. Horn of Winter is pretty much mandatory to not feel like you spend half your time waiting with nothing to do.

    Talents:
    - With such low resource regen you sit with fewer than 3 runes quite often, which would seem to make Frozen Pulse a viable option but it is still too undertuned and outclassed by GS for single target and FSc for multiple targets.
    - Shattering Strikes is dead without T21 4-piece and such low resource regen making RA mandatory.
    - Icy Talons might be the best choice considering auto attack damage is a MUCH higher portion of overall damage, but it would be far better if it could be combined with RA to actually increase RP generation
    - HRW on its own isn't worth it.
    - FSc would help slow down rune usage and make it feel like there are fewer open GCDs, but with such low levels of crit you won't be getting many KM procs so unless you are fighting 3+ targets (and honestly probably 4+ considering mastery levels are so low) it isn't worth using FSc
    - BoS is deader than dead since you can't keep it up at all with the miserable resource regeneration.
    - GA is still an utterly worthless talent.
    - Winter is Coming is bugged. RW both procs and breaks the root. Been this way for a while and still not fixed. Will probably go live like this
    - Blinding sheet is worthless since it breaks on damage.

    Overall
    Frost has lost virtually all of its M+ assets: no stuns of any kind (both Winter is Coming and Singragosa' Fury stun are gone), no offensive dispell (lost that to DHs), no debuff purge, ZERO defensive ability (lost Mirror Ball, lost the Volatile Shielding boost AMS, lost IBF/DS heal as meager as it was, IBF is still pitifully weak in PVE), our Battle Rez requires considerable resources (which we rarely have available) and will be more difficult to use than other brez's. Overall damage in raids and M+ may or may not be okay (I lean toward the latter based on Blizzards history with the spec and lack of attention so far in BfA) but I haven't been grouped with many other specs nor seen logs or performances yet. We lost mastery scaling on Obliterate, lost critical damage scaling from Nothing but the Boots, lost mastery scaling from Crystalline Swords, and lost RP generation from the artifact trait that boots OB's RP output. The spec plays VERY slow and although I don't play many other specs for comparison, it just isn't fun right now. Maybe more gear and Azerite traits will help, but I wouldn't hold your breath.
    Thats very hyperbolic, every class lost a lot of cc potential mostly stuns, its not a dk only case, and its too early to bitch about damage for changes that arent even tuned yet and probably wont be properly until the first patch after raids are open, if resource generation is low they are going to tune it just like they did to UH few weeks ago and about defensives pretty sure 90% of frost dks dont bother hitting death strike afraid of dropping on dps, except in very extreme cases, also when you have debuffs in dungeons that so much need AMS to remove them? Ams is better used to prevent any group wide damage that might one shot you. Bitching about survavibility in pve is kinda redundant.
    Sounds to me that you just want to bitch about something you havent even tested and have the spec tuned your way to be as op as possible.
    Last edited by Kendros; 2018-06-12 at 12:56 AM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Kendros View Post
    Thats very hyperbolic, every class lost a lot of cc potential mostly stuns, its not a dk only case, and its too early to bitch about damage for changes that arent even tuned yet and probably wont be properly until the first patch after raids are open, if resource generation is low they are going to tune it just like they did to UH few weeks ago and about defensives pretty sure 90% of frost dks dont bother hitting death strike afraid of dropping on dps, except in very extreme cases, also when you have debuffs on you in dungeons that so much need AMS to remove them? Ams is better used to prevent any group wide damage that might one shot you. Bitching about survavibility in pve is kinda redundant.
    Sounds to me that you just want to bitch about something you havent even tested and have the spec tuned your way to be as op as possible.
    I'm speaking of high level M+ keys, and from the content of your post it is obvious you don't do them.

  10. #10
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    For me that skill was pretty useless, 5 min cd, like... For real? For RP purpose its a great skill. But for practical use, its just... One button I press really rare
    step into everything will gief ya nothing, mon

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoeth View Post
    I'm speaking of high level M+ keys, and from the content of your post it is obvious you don't do them.
    unless you do anything around +25 neither do you

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by salate View Post
    For me that skill was pretty useless, 5 min cd, like... For real? For RP purpose its a great skill. But for practical use, its just... One button I press really rare
    I made a gearset with the memejeans, which lowered the cooldown enough to be up around every 2 minutes or so. Definitely made a difference in higher M+ having an AoE 5s stun.

  13. #13
    Deleted
    I can't believe more people aren't posting about the terrible state of Frost right now, in particular, the cooldowns.

    Ideally, DPS cooldowns should be overlapped - but I cannot overlap ERW with Pillar (Obliteration) without wasting Runes and Runic Power. It is such a terrible design.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoeth View Post
    I'm speaking of high level M+ keys, and from the content of your post it is obvious you don't do them.
    How long do you think you are supposed to be able to keep BoS going? How long the the effects of most 2 minute cooldowns last? 30 seconds is plenty, it isn't the same talent that absolutely dominated the rest of the talent tree earlier in Legion, and rightly so.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Drayiicha View Post
    I can't believe more people aren't posting about the terrible state of Frost right now, in particular, the cooldowns.

    Ideally, DPS cooldowns should be overlapped - but I cannot overlap ERW with Pillar (Obliteration) without wasting Runes and Runic Power. It is such a terrible design.

    - - - Updated - - -



    How long do you think you are supposed to be able to keep BoS going? How long the the effects of most 2 minute cooldowns last? 30 seconds is plenty, it isn't the same talent that absolutely dominated the rest of the talent tree earlier in Legion, and rightly so.
    There are some new changes for Frost that address your first point(s). https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/...09?page=11#202

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