1. #3281
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    . The point is that it's completely and utterly meaningless. I don't feel i am overcoming a challenge at all. It's not hard, it's annoying as hell and frustrating to restart every single time..
    Exactly! Yes! It's not like Dark Souls difficulty, where you eventually feel a sense of accomplishment, or even pride that you overcame a challenge. You get it done and just end up thinking "Why the fuck did I just do that?".

    And the only way Massive seems to be able to get players to go through that nonsense is by exclusive rewards. It's not sustainable.

    - - - Updated - - -

    On a completely different random note:

    For some reason now I can do the Classified missions. I never bought the year pass to get it. I'm currently on the second one, and I'm not gonna question it. Bug or not.

  2. #3282
    Pit Lord Nutri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Problem is that it's not even designed around groups. Hell, if anything it seems easier to play solo/two on Legendary. Way less enemies and only a bunch of elites. The point is that it's completely and utterly meaningless. I don't feel i am overcoming a challenge at all. It's not hard, it's annoying as hell and frustrating to restart every single time.
    A while ago Massive commented on the difficulty of the game and the obnoxious AI (player words, not Massive words).
    Their reply came down to something I'd best illustrate with a picture:



    It came down to: The AI is not impossible, the enemies are not overtuned, they are not bullet sponges, all their actions can be predicted and anticipated, there is a way to defeat them but the players are just doing it all wrong.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    And that's also why they don't really adjust things in the way players desire it; they demand the players to play the game the way they want it to be played.

    Sadly thats doing them more harm then good. Massive is really pushing to find the boundaries of what is fun, they just cant have anything in the game that goes without a certain level of frustration. It feels like they believe the feeling of joy and accomplishment you get once you manage to complete something is higher when you're at the brink of punching a hole in your monitor.

    You see people moving away from the game en mass when things get beyond reasonable and return once they actually do manage to make things more accessible. And such is the cycle of Division since 2016 till date.

    I got me a new 1TB SDD during the weekend and reinstalled Div2, but you lot here keep me from booting it up again xD TU12 maybe.

  3. #3283
    Quote Originally Posted by Nutri View Post
    It came down to: The AI is not impossible, the enemies are not overtuned, they are not bullet sponges, all their actions can be predicted and anticipated, there is a way to defeat them but the players are just doing it all wrong.
    What do they want us to do? Spend 30 minutes on a single room encounter?

    The point isn't that the AI can't be defeated. We beat them all the time. It's that it's not FUN to do it. It's often tedious, obnoxious, and not worth the effort.

    I'd be real curious to know which dev said what you mentioned earlier.

  4. #3284
    Pit Lord Nutri's Avatar
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    I'd have to dig deep to find that post tbh, I think it was on Reddit. You just have to take my word on it that they made the reply.

    It also addressed the tedious and obnoxious part of the general AI annoyances. Like "you're getting rushed down because you're not aggressive enough, you're getting sniped because you sit at the same spot for too long, you're getting flanked because you're not pushing the AI away from you, you are mostly in control of AI behaviour if you approach it correctly". Such things.

  5. #3285
    From what i see, Summit solo is perfectly doable. 91-99 is basically a tank/pistol build with either deflector/full shield. Pick targets one by one, aided by drone, and dribble them down. Which makes sense, memento is really strong for this kind of game play and i like the build, so i'm gonna try again, because, why not. Also pet peeve in clearing that before the rework.

    For floor 100, it's an Eclipse foam/fire thrower build. You wait for one to come out, foam and burn it. The named AR with perfect talent against burning opponents help. And just because since they spam skill disable, you don't want to rely on skills whatsoever. Basically, again, block them long enough they die while incapacitated or you're done.

    It's doable. but it's annoying and frustrating as hell. Apparently though people are super happy about this crap so that's why nothing changes. Hell, people is asking for legendary missions. Why would you want that lol.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  6. #3286
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    From what i see, Summit solo is perfectly doable. 91-99 is basically a tank/pistol build with either deflector/full shield. Pick targets one by one, aided by drone, and dribble them down. Which makes sense, memento is really strong for this kind of game play and i like the build, so i'm gonna try again, because, why not. Also pet peeve in clearing that before the rework.

    For floor 100, it's an Eclipse foam/fire thrower build. You wait for one to come out, foam and burn it. The named AR with perfect talent against burning opponents help. And just because since they spam skill disable, you don't want to rely on skills whatsoever. Basically, again, block them long enough they die while incapacitated or you're done.

    It's doable. but it's annoying and frustrating as hell. Apparently though people are super happy about this crap so that's why nothing changes. Hell, people is asking for legendary missions. Why would you want that lol.
    Different strokes.
    Sunk cost fallacy.
    Addiction.

    pick your poison.

  7. #3287
    Quote Originally Posted by Nutri View Post
    I'd have to dig deep to find that post tbh, I think it was on Reddit. You just have to take my word on it that they made the reply.

    It also addressed the tedious and obnoxious part of the general AI annoyances. Like "you're getting rushed down because you're not aggressive enough, you're getting sniped because you sit at the same spot for too long, you're getting flanked because you're not pushing the AI away from you, you are mostly in control of AI behaviour if you approach it correctly". Such things.
    Which is nonsense, because I'm one of the most aggressive players I've ever seen. I'm constantly moving and pushing the enemy.

    NPCs flank even when it makes no sense for them to do so. They rush because they know they have 10x the hitpoints of the player, and can afford to take the damage while they close.

    And snipers...holy crap. These days they'll shoot the little finger off you if it's sticking out of cover, especially Elite warhound snipers. Those things are the devil.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Apparently though people are super happy about this crap so that's why nothing changes. Hell, people is asking for legendary missions. Why would you want that lol.
    Because you can form groups of 4 people all with turret/drone, or 3 turret/drone builds and a Foam/Fire build. You have wipe protection via multiple players. You have enemy fire completely unfocused as they shoot at 6-8 deployables instead of players, all while being CC'd. It's basically EZ mode, so no wonder people want more legendary missions.

  8. #3288
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Which is nonsense, because I'm one of the most aggressive players I've ever seen. I'm constantly moving and pushing the enemy.

    NPCs flank even when it makes no sense for them to do so. They rush because they know they have 10x the hitpoints of the player, and can afford to take the damage while they close.

    And snipers...holy crap. These days they'll shoot the little finger off you if it's sticking out of cover, especially Elite warhound snipers. Those things are the devil.
    I'm fully with you on that. If I ever find that post I'll remember to post it here. Made zero sense to wave away player complaints with a 'you're doing it wrong - people just need figure out how the AI works' counter argument.

  9. #3289
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Because you can form groups of 4 people all with turret/drone, or 3 turret/drone builds and a Foam/Fire build. You have wipe protection via multiple players. You have enemy fire completely unfocused as they shoot at 6-8 deployables instead of players, all while being CC'd. It's basically EZ mode, so no wonder people want more legendary missions.
    Eh, it's not like being in 4 makes it easier. At least in Summit the increased spawns are really bad when you start grouping up. But as you said, given the strategy it's still a plus since you're minimizing your time out and if you die other people can bring you up.

    In solo i played drone/turret, Hunter's, memento shield/pistol, and they're basically all equally viable as in they have all the same shortcomings.

    Funnily enough, if you fine the drones, Deflector shied is just awesome because most of the time they shoot at your body and damn if it's effective. They do a truckload of damage, so you're bouncing that in their face. It's a mostly blue/yellow build, but it works albeit at a slower pace. Hunter melts people faces, but they also melt you.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  10. #3290
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    On a completely different random note:

    For some reason now I can do the Classified missions. I never bought the year pass to get it. I'm currently on the second one, and I'm not gonna question it. Bug or not.
    This last patch, Massive accidentally gave out the year 1 pass to everyone who preordered WONY. If you played in the first 24 hours after the patch launched, you got to keep it.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/thedivision...ership_update/

  11. #3291
    Quote Originally Posted by Woogs View Post
    This last patch, Massive accidentally gave out the year 1 pass to everyone who preordered WONY. If you played in the first 24 hours after the patch launched, you got to keep it.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/thedivision...ership_update/
    Huh....well, i wont look a gift horse in the mouth. Those extra fast travel points are handy. They should do the right thing and give it to all WONY players, or include it with purchase of the next season pass or something.

  12. #3292
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Huh....well, i wont look a gift horse in the mouth. Those extra fast travel points are handy. They should do the right thing and give it to all WONY players, or include it with purchase of the next season pass or something.
    I mean...they already did the right thing by not revoking it despite their mistake. I don't think they're gonna just give away the S1 content, those are quite a few missions plus auto-unlocks for specializations for free. Don't get me wrong, that would be pretty righteous of them if they gave it away to everyone with WONY who played this season, but given that the game isn't apparently doing super hot financially to begin with I doubt they're going to limit revenue opportunities.

  13. #3293
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    As much as I like both Division games I genuinely wonder what turns most players away, I can only imagine it's either the bullet sponge mechanics or how incredibly squishy the player is and I'll take a guess and say it's the latter, the bullet sponge is barely a big deal but almost dying from 1 grenade is what personally boils my piss. It is a shame the game ain't more popular as there is a lot to like and they have made the game so much better with patches but if they're going to release a 3rd they need to go in a different direction because this one clearly isn't working overall.

    I also wonder if the usual Ubisoft approach works as well, if anyone played this on release and stopped after a few months they would come back now and agree the game is far far superior to then, the same also applied to Odyssey for me and now Breakpoint, it's good they patch stuff in later on but I almost get the feeling I'm better off waiting a year to buy anything Ubisoft related as I know it's going to be much better than the release.
    Last edited by Naoto; 2020-10-12 at 10:32 PM.

  14. #3294
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    I mean...they already did the right thing by not revoking it despite their mistake. I don't think they're gonna just give away the S1 content, those are quite a few missions plus auto-unlocks for specializations for free. Don't get me wrong, that would be pretty righteous of them if they gave it away to everyone with WONY who played this season, but given that the game isn't apparently doing super hot financially to begin with I doubt they're going to limit revenue opportunities.
    Include access to the missions with the purchase of season 4 or something, as an added incentive. Leave the specialization unlocks out. That's content and objectives people should do anyway, IMO.

  15. #3295
    is Jeferson center bugged for league? or I'm just lucky? cause its on a league list for me, but I don't actualy have an option to set it to timed run when AT the mission O_O
    we even cleared invasion, thinking maybe that was a problem but nope... still missing.

    edited... sigh.. and then out of sheer curiocity, I set it to hard, had the world reload and there it was... league O_O

  16. #3296
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Why are there no events in literally any zone for the weekly, except for stupid supply drops?

    I hate supply drops. "Hey lets have mobs swarm you from every direction, that's fun, right?"

  17. #3297
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Why are there no events in literally any zone for the weekly, except for stupid supply drops?

    I hate supply drops. "Hey lets have mobs swarm you from every direction, that's fun, right?"
    Did you reset all your control points? Hostile events don't generally show up if all the CPs are friendly.

  18. #3298
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Did you reset all your control points? Hostile events don't generally show up if all the CPs are friendly.
    This. Since they changed the CP reset to manual, you can just do the ones you want and reset them infinite times.

    Another note about Summit: managed to complete it and unlock Ridgeway project. Must say that it's been actually not that bad to do 91-100 for a couple of friends. The difference? They have their hands complete of all fingers in the right places. People knew what to do, we oneshot it basically. And it's been fun doing it, despite all the shortcomings.

    Now that i have the project, i don't know if i'll ever step into it ever again.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  19. #3299
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Now that i have the project, i don't know if i'll ever step into it ever again.
    QuaLitY rEPEAtabLe coNteNt

    Honestly, I've fallen off in a big way. I'll poke around a bit more once they push the Summit changes live next week, and maybe I'm setting myself up for disappointment, but nothing about the updates really gets me remotely hot and bothered. Really, Summit was the main thing I was waiting for to see how the future of the game would shape up as I'm pretty much "bored" with basic build tinkering and running the same missions a bajillion times with little to no variety. And based on this...yeah, the way they're going is not my cup-o-tea.

    Which remains a damned shame, because the core gunplay, movement, and (more or less) gear/skill building elements of the game are solid.

  20. #3300
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Now that i have the project, i don't know if i'll ever step into it ever again.
    I hope you still have hunters to kill in the open world. Otherwise, back to kenly tower.

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