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  1. #1

    Great to See Shaman DPS DOMINATING.... Finally!

    My Boy Chase M from Baytown Texas, now living in Houston sent me a text message today. As it turns out, we're golden shammy family.

    You see I've always played Shaman, sometimes with my buddy Craig outta , and sometimes without him, but always to the best of the class ability. Unless I was drunk, which I was, for the last 5 years.

    I battled addiction like anyone else, and for a time even helped lead a Realm First Guild. Something Sneak I L wasn't there for because he usually quits to early in expansions. He'll quit again this expansion, he's married now, family changes everything, especially with a game like WoW.

    Anyways I gave up drinking. And what a perfect time.

    Shaman back on top!

    https://simulationcraft.org/reports/PR_Raid.html
    Last edited by Stormbreed; 2018-09-18 at 02:12 AM.

  2. #2
    You shouldn't really look at pure sims for realistic damage, here's damage from prepatch for raiding. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/17

  3. #3
    Moderator -aiko-'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boraal View Post
    You shouldn't really look at pure sims for realistic damage, here's damage from prepatch for raiding. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/17
    Why would pre-patch numbers matter for BFA raiding?

  4. #4
    looks fine, although i think elemental needs more nerfs.

    "you're OP but you just don't know it"

    one of those fabulous mighty blunders just like "you think you do but you don't"

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Socialhealer View Post
    one of those fabulous mighty blunders just like "you think you do but you don't"
    Difference is that they changed their stance there.

  6. #6
    The Insane Thage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Socialhealer View Post
    looks fine, although i think elemental needs more nerfs.

    "you're OP but you just don't know it"

    one of those fabulous mighty blunders just like "you think you do but you don't"
    I think Blizz was trying to channel Indalamar (sp? that warrior bro from Classic who proved Fury was insanely OP if you knew what you were doing) and, like most times they try to be cheeky, it just comes off as tone-deaf douchebaggery... mostly because Ion's a tone-deaf douchebag.
    Battle for Azeroth: Now with more Morally Grey™!*

    ​*Morally Grey is about as morally complex as an episode of Whacky Racers.



  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Boraal View Post
    You shouldn't really look at pure sims for realistic damage, here's damage from prepatch for raiding. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/17


    I'm talking BFA BABY!

    Shaman, we taking over!!!

  8. #8
    I am Murloc!
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    See you in four weeks when you're in here bitching about being wrong or the class getting nerfed.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormbreed View Post
    I'm talking BFA BABY!

    Shaman, we taking over!!!
    Name 3 important differences between level 120 and 110.
    Azerite traits aren't extremely impactful barring a few exceptions for a few specs.

    Because unless i'm missing some serious OP Azerite traits, the statement "wait until max level" is bullshit in BfA, you have the same talents, same skills, there is nothing new except those boring / low impact Azerite traits.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Difference is that they changed their stance there.
    haha true, 2017 - we're bringing you classic!

    2018 - ELEMENTAL IS STILL TRASH HAHAHAHA!

    best part is, in classic....elemental will still be trash, it must be a universal constant.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    I think Blizz was trying to channel Indalamar (sp? that warrior bro from Classic who proved Fury was insanely OP if you knew what you were doing) and, like most times they try to be cheeky, it just comes off as tone-deaf douchebaggery... mostly because Ion's a tone-deaf douchebag.
    yeah that was celestalon, when he left WoW i lit a candle in his honour, then took a shit on it, just like he shit on elemental in WoD.

  11. #11
    Obviously a big, OP. Give Blizz a moment to rectify that issue.

  12. #12
    The Insane Puupi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Name 3 important differences between level 120 and 110.
    Azerite traits aren't extremely impactful barring a few exceptions for a few specs.

    Because unless i'm missing some serious OP Azerite traits, the statement "wait until max level" is bullshit in BfA, you have the same talents, same skills, there is nothing new except those boring / low impact Azerite traits.
    Even if Azerite bonuses are more or less meaningless, the lvl 120 is vastly different from lvl 110; no set bonuses, no legendaries, no Antorus trinkets, scaling differences, emphasis on main stat vs secondaries on gear.
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    i've said i'd like to have one of those bad dragon dildos shaped like a horse, because the shape is nicer than human.
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    I prefer "enclosed creationist" but yeah, I'm a flat earther.

  13. #13
    Moderator -aiko-'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Name 3 important differences between level 120 and 110
    Loss of legendaries
    Loss of set bonuses
    And yes, the addition of azerite traits

    Talking from a pure DPS numbers standpoint, these 3 things are massive in shifting the rankings. It's important to note that OP hasn't said a thing about gameplay - if you hate Shaman gameplay now, you will probably still hate it in BFA because it's not changing (in fact, it's arguably getting 'worse' since we are losing legendaries). But from a pure numbers standpoint? It is very feasible that those numbers are accurate and Enhancement Shaman will be crazy good, and Ele a lot more viable than now.

    I wouldn't put any money on it, as balancing patches are still being worked on as we speak, but he's not wrong. Currently Shaman are looking solid for raiding, if you can stomach the gameplay.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    Even if Azerite bonuses are more or less meaningless, the lvl 120 is vastly different from lvl 110; no set bonuses, no legendaries, no Antorus trinkets, scaling differences, emphasis on main stat vs secondaries on gear.
    Quote Originally Posted by -aiko- View Post
    Loss of legendaries
    Loss of set bonuses
    And yes, the addition of azerite traits
    That would mean:
    1.Enhance at least scales poorly with gear, as their damage is seemingly "not good" with high secondary stats but "really good" with low secondary stats
    2.Enhance has shit legendaries compared to other classes (Which is something i would like to have verified)
    3.Enhance has a shit set bonus (Also, source on that)
    4.Enhance scales poorly with the Antorus trinket(s) (again, source pls)

  15. #15
    how can anyone take 110 pre-patch sims serious ...well besides the OP who really thinks it means something.. see you for uldir where enhancer will be bottom mid lvl 100 pre-patch is useless with set bonus/legendary and sec stats

  16. #16
    You are looking at sims where some classes are fully implemented and some are not.

    1) Prot warrior module is just auto attacking and using Old war potion and nothing else.
    2) Enhance shaman has azerite traits enabled while some other classes dont.
    3) If you have done some actual Beta raid testing you would know enhance is mid pack, melee in general is dominating atm, and rogues and rets are on top often.
    4) Tuning is not final and none of these numbers matter. Blizzard always tunes numbers right before Mythic week after seeing numbers after one week of heroic raiding, they have done this for a few x-pacs now.

  17. #17
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    A lot of the classes aren't implemented properly, i guess one of the easier tells would be the arms warrior... Just look at it you'll understand.

  18. #18
    Moderator -aiko-'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    That would mean:
    None of those points you presented mean anything. Pre-patch has never been accurate for raiding. Stats/scaling will change, new gear gets released, balancing patches come out, etc. Pre-patch numbers mean nothing for BFA.

    Although, to be fair, sim numbers from beta don't mean much either. We won't know how classes will perform until we get to the actual raid. And, as others have mentioned, I don't think that simc has proper profiles for all the specs yet anyway.

  19. #19
    Legendary! MonsieuRoberts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    I think Blizz was trying to channel Indalamar (sp? that warrior bro from Classic who proved Fury was insanely OP if you knew what you were doing) and, like most times they try to be cheeky, it just comes off as tone-deaf douchebaggery... mostly because Ion's a tone-deaf douchebag.
    Ramaladni was an absolute madman

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by -aiko- View Post
    None of those points you presented mean anything.
    Okay.
    Why?

    Like explain it, the only way your original argument makes sense if those points somehow affect each spec differently, as then some spec would obviously "lose more" from a certain aspect.
    If Enhancement for example has a very weak set bonus, you "lose less" in comparison to someone that has a very strong set bonus, a shift in power between 110 and 120 would apply.

    In the past that argument made sense, as classes / specs picked up new spells on their way to max level, some received dps buttons, some utility, that obviously affected pre patch.
    But not in BfA, you do not gain anything impactful on your way to 120 nor is there anything on 120 that seriously reshuffles the field.

    Quote Originally Posted by -aiko- View Post
    Pre-patch has never been accurate for raiding. Stats/scaling will change, new gear gets released, balancing patches come out, etc.
    Now you're just moving the goalpost, you're basically just naming things that might change that.
    Will they happen? Obviously, but neither you nor me knows what changes, so stick to the situation on live or on beta, not on some potential scenario in the future.

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