BfA Patch Speculation thread (8.3 and later).

[Drekmar]

Lmao, this patch made me refund all my subs. Content is fine, but the fucking bugs... not getting the essences when we are supposed to and getting told to wait for possible fix with no ETA. No bueno.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Lmao, this patch made me refund all my subs. Content is fine, but the fucking bugs... not getting the essences when we are supposed to and getting told to wait for possible fix with no ETA. No bueno.

WoW is not a very well held together game anymore. I realized that when all the cars of the deeprun tram started to just bunch together while traveling.

[EbaumsTipster]

I feel bad for the team that worked so hard on developing the Kelfin and Ankoan, as they're ultimately just "never-ever playables" in an expansion that's supposed to be about finding weird allies and recruiting them. Vulpera are a one-off minority part of the Horde story that have less significance than the Kelfin, yet because their race is a popular niche (cute anthro animal) that means they were developed from what looks like NPC-tier models below to the ridiculously detailed and obviously player-ready models we have today.



The Vulpera actually irk me a little bit and not because of the race itself, but because of how LITTLE work is put into their culture, their history or their reasoning for being with the Horde. They are a new race that at the moment has just always been in Vol'dun with no explanation for what they are and why they are there i the first place. They have a hard way of life and have to scavenge and keep caravans together to survive... and that's it. This would be fine if we time traveled back to Warcraft 3 where similar things happened with the new races that game implemented, but in a game that's absolutely a competition for "what kind of subrace is going to get in? only one at a time now" there should've been more time and effort put into developing the race and fleshing them out instead of wasting time with the Sethrak who ultimately ended up being one of the MOST irrelevant parts of BFA. The fact that they put so much love into the Sethrak shows that they fucked up because now people want to play them, and I doubt they'll ever be playable.

The fact that Vulpera have a 99.99% chance of being playable not because they've EARNED it in the game world but because "they are anthro animals" is cheap and annoying, it pisses me off how lazy of a race they are yet how popular they're going to be all the same. Maybe that's why they put such little work into them story or culture wise, because they didn't have to. Just like Void Elves they knew people would play them anyway.

TL;DR Kelfins got robbed, Vulpera are a really lazy race that shits up the Allied Race system.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

WoW is not a very well held together game anymore. I realized that when all the cars of the deeprun tram started to just bunch together while traveling.

I don't know what you see, but its not there.

[Drekmar]

WoW is not a very well held together game anymore. I realized that when all the cars of the deeprun tram started to just bunch together while traveling.

And the audacity of GM marking it as resolved while I cant get the essences was priceless. Well, atleast I got back 70€.

[Loreguy126]

I feel bad for the team that worked so hard on developing the Kelfin and Ankoan, as they're ultimately just "never-ever playables" in an expansion that's supposed to be about finding weird allies and recruiting them. Vulpera are a one-off minority part of the Horde story that have less significance than the Kelfin, yet because their race is a popular niche (cute anthro animal) that means they were developed from what looks like NPC-tier models below to the ridiculously detailed and obviously player-ready models we have today.

....

The Vulpera actually irk me a little bit and not because of the race itself, but because of how LITTLE work is put into their culture, their history or their reasoning for being with the Horde. They are a new race that at the moment has just always been in Vol'dun with no explanation for what they are and why they are there i the first place. They have a hard way of life and have to scavenge and keep caravans together to survive... and that's it. This would be fine if we time traveled back to Warcraft 3 where similar things happened with the new races that game implemented, but in a game that's absolutely a competition for "what kind of subrace is going to get in? only one at a time now" there should've been more time and effort put into developing the race and fleshing them out instead of wasting time with the Sethrak who ultimately ended up being one of the MOST irrelevant parts of BFA. The fact that they put so much love into the Sethrak shows that they fucked up because now people want to play them, and I doubt they'll ever be playable.

The fact that Vulpera have a 99.99% chance of being playable not because they've EARNED it in the game world but because "they are anthro animals" is cheap and annoying, it pisses me off how lazy of a race they are yet how popular they're going to be all the same. Maybe that's why they put such little work into them story or culture wise, because they didn't have to. Just like Void Elves they knew people would play them anyway.

TL;DR Kelfins got robbed, Vulpera are a really lazy race that shits up the Allied Race system.

For ONCE, I can get behind a rant <3

...I don't really find the Vulpera aesthetic to be "cute" or anything worth substance. Maybe if I was a Furry? lol.

Having the water goblins/Ankoan (or Mechagnomes even) be unlocked in 8.3 would be 100000x better than Vulpera.

[George Costanza]

I feel bad for the team that worked so hard on developing the Kelfin and Ankoan, as they're ultimately just "never-ever playables" in an expansion that's supposed to be about finding weird allies and recruiting them. Vulpera are a one-off minority part of the Horde story that have less significance than the Kelfin, yet because their race is a popular niche (cute anthro animal) that means they were developed from what looks like NPC-tier models below to the ridiculously detailed and obviously player-ready models we have today.



The Vulpera actually irk me a little bit and not because of the race itself, but because of how LITTLE work is put into their culture, their history or their reasoning for being with the Horde. They are a new race that at the moment has just always been in Vol'dun with no explanation for what they are and why they are there i the first place. They have a hard way of life and have to scavenge and keep caravans together to survive... and that's it. This would be fine if we time traveled back to Warcraft 3 where similar things happened with the new races that game implemented, but in a game that's absolutely a competition for "what kind of subrace is going to get in? only one at a time now" there should've been more time and effort put into developing the race and fleshing them out instead of wasting time with the Sethrak who ultimately ended up being one of the MOST irrelevant parts of BFA. The fact that they put so much love into the Sethrak shows that they fucked up because now people want to play them, and I doubt they'll ever be playable.

The fact that Vulpera have a 99.99% chance of being playable not because they've EARNED it in the game world but because "they are anthro animals" is cheap and annoying, it pisses me off how lazy of a race they are yet how popular they're going to be all the same. Maybe that's why they put such little work into them story or culture wise, because they didn't have to. Just like Void Elves they knew people would play them anyway.

TL;DR Kelfins got robbed, Vulpera are a really lazy race that shits up the Allied Race system.

Agreed /10chars

[huth]

Lmao, this patch made me refund all my subs. Content is fine, but the fucking bugs... not getting the essences when we are supposed to and getting told to wait for possible fix with no ETA. No bueno.

What are you talking about? I haven't heard about anything like that.

[Drekmar]

What are you talking about? I haven't heard about anything like that.

BotE and co. They pushed hotfix on 28th, but it didnt fix the issue. Especially if you got the Q for rank1 and obtain the achiev for rank2 before that, it fucks up the vendor.

[AngerFork]

Could be both, obviously not at the same time, but other than both of them being based on the Goblin model, I see no reason against that.

However, a good point against any of that is that Alliance doesn't really have the same amount of options. There's the Ankoan, the Kelfin equivalent story-wise, and the Vulpera equivalent in that they only share the rig, but aren't actually related to the "base race". But other than that... I'm discounting "Lightforged Undead" because there really is no buildup towards these other than Calia's resurrection in the novel and the theory that the Forsaken might need a new leader and/or will split.

I haven't personally discounted Lightforged Undead due in part to Blizz's hints about Calia in the story. I still think we're looking at them as a potential Horde Allied race, but you do bring up a good point with the lack of options for Alliance Allied Races. The only real similar ideas I could see if we were to have both Vulpera and Kelfin as Goblin Allied Races would be adding Wildhammer Dwarves onto the current Dwarf races or High Elves alongside the Void Elves (though that's another can of worms being discussed elsewhere). Otherwise, there really isn't a good fit for same race Allied Races on the Alliance. Horde on the other hand has a ton...Taunka, several different troll races, Kelfin/Vulpera, Sanlayn, Leper Gnomes (pledged loyalty to Sylvanas), Outland Orcs, etc.

This IMO is another sign of how different the storytelling throughout the years has been between the Alliance and the Horde.

[EbaumsTipster]

The lack of potential Alliance ARs is EXACTLY why they keep adding "asspull" races: because besides High Elves and Wildhammer, maaaaybe Broken, there aren't any.

[Alga]

Well we dont know where 8.3 takes us, so the Alliance or Horde could always get a new race from either Ny'alotha or the Dragon Isles, which I would prefer over Kelfins, Wildhammers or High Elves.

[EbaumsTipster]

Well we dont know where 8.3 takes us, so the Alliance or Horde could always get a new race from either Ny'alotha or the Dragon Isles, which I would prefer over Kelfins, Wildhammers or High Elves.

Dragon Isles leading to Dragonmen with the Worgen rig is what I've been wondering about for a while.

[Alga]

Dragon Isles leading to Dragonmen with the Worgen rig is what I've been wondering about for a while.

Would be interesting and I also have the theory they want to fill the final rank with ARs with something special and cool, while the second last rank is more like a Reskin/Subrace Rank aka Mechagnomes and Vulpera.

[EbaumsTipster]

Would be interesting and I also have the theory they want to fill the final rank with ARs with something special and cool, while the second last rank is more like a Reskin/Subrace Rank aka Mechagnomes and Vulpera.

Yeah, there is likely going to be one more pair with the small races, because they are generally unpopular (despite Vulpera having a big following, they still will get a lot of negative feedback) and need something "badass" to go with them.

[FlubberPuddy]

Dragon Isles leading to Dragonmen with the Worgen rig is what I've been wondering about for a while.

I'd fucken love a dragon-based race for Alliance. I'm playing through Divinity Original Sin 2 right now and that Lizard/Dragon race are amazing as fuck!

Also I agree with your Vulpera post, it's clear they're going to be popular for surface level reasons. But then it goes to show most people do play races for the aesthetics which is very understandable anyway. Dwarves for instance typically have cool lore but you'll never see me playing one as a main because they're not aesthetically pleasing to me. Just how it goes.

[EbaumsTipster]

Also I agree with your Vulpera post, it's clear they're going to be popular for surface level reasons. But then it goes to show most people do play races for the aesthetics which is very understandable anyway. Dwarves for instance typically have cool lore but you'll never see me playing one as a main because they're not aesthetically pleasing to me. Just how it goes.

It is understandable, even if I don't like it. It means there is no point trying to make anything beyond skin deep, as the money goes towards what is attractive instead. Why bother with racial lore if the race isnt going to be popular? It discourages creativity for the sake of profit.

All the work and love put into Kul Tiras and Mechagnome lore is pointless because people don't like the races. Lots of time and detail is put into them but who cares? They aren't sexy, so there's no point.

[Nathanyel]

Vulpera are a one-off minority part of the Horde story that have less significance than the Kelfin, [...]
The Vulpera actually irk me a little bit and not because of the race itself, but because of how LITTLE work is put into their culture, their history or their reasoning for being with the Horde. [...]

Just what are you talking about? It's implied the Vulpera had tentative trade ties with the Zandalari, or were at least occasional allies of the Outcasts.

And on a superficial level, the way we meet Vulpera and Kelfin are basically identical: we get attacked by the zone's baddies (Sethrak/Naga) and literally crash-land both times, shortly thereafter we're saved by a charismatic female leader figure.
Haven't played Nazjatar enough yet (too hot in my roof apartment to let the PC run for long) to draw further comparisons, albeit that's probably more along the lines of the basic mcguffin zone quest story anyway.

Meerah's caravan takes us around the zone, introducing more characters later on. Meerah represents the day-to-day struggle to survive in the desert and their mercantile instincts, while Nisha as their fiercest warrior is quasi the Vulpera Warchief, leading the military pushback against the Sethrak.

I don't see how that is significantly less insight into their culture then what the Kelfin are getting.
But sadly, while 8.3 might take us back to Zandalar or other areas the Vulpera might be involved, I see little options to make the Kelfin relevant after Nazjatar, unless Blizzard sees that (and the recruitment questline) as enough introduction - which would then also count for Vulpera, too.

And again, the only reason we might not see both as Allied Races is that they share the Goblin skeleton, which Blizzard may balk at. Then again, Nightborne and Zandalari use the Night Elf skeleton, too. And like these, Vulpera and Kelfin would likely not be made available in the same patch anyway.

[EbaumsTipster]

Meerah's caravan takes us around the zone, introducing more characters later on. Meerah represents the day-to-day struggle to survive in the desert and their mercantile instincts, while Nisha as their fiercest warrior is quasi the Vulpera Warchief, leading the military pushback against the Sethrak.

As I said before, it's akin to WC3 races like Tauren and Trolls: them being tough scavengers that struggle in a fierce environment to survive is barebones ass culture, and that's all there is to the race. I'm not saying there's a lack of a culture, it's that it's incredibly small and miniscule compared to the rest of the zone that fleshes out Zandalari and Sethrak. They are almost literally shoved into one corner of the map with their small camp because Blizzard knows that they could have zero lines and zero dialogue and people would still play them because they are small foxes.

[FlubberPuddy]

It is understandable, even if I don't like it. It means there is no point trying to make anything beyond skin deep, as the money goes towards what is attractive instead. Why bother with racial lore if the race isnt going to be popular? It discourages creativity for the sake of profit.

It's a balance of both, imo. I think when they see the players from a whole game standpoint and the races they play, they probably see a lot of "oh this player mainly is on Alliance but they also play Horde sometimes too" and vice versa. So I bet when they went into this expansion they probably felt that "people play the races they'll want to play, regardless of faction" and so probably decided it doesn't ultimately matter where a race goes, players will play it as long it's in the game and made playable.

This would actually then follow the supposed theory that factions matter less and less and will be "done for" or "loosened" in the coming expansion.

What I don't appreciate is when they'll say stuff like "yeah we want your feedback on the races you wanna see" and then don't deliver on that and come out with clearly already decided on races. Like Mechagnomes, those guys were decided upon their reveal at Blizzcon. But they'll go on their soapbox and say "hey look at all these threads liking mechagnomes after we revealed em, they were asked for greatly!"

Those types of moments are what get me annoyed. Like clearly, whatever Blizzard decides to put into the game is going to be loved by someone.

All the work and love put into Kul Tiras and Mechagnome lore is pointless because people don't like the races. Lots of time and detail is put into them but who cares? They aren't sexy, so there's no point.

I don't think it's pointless at the same time. I mean Kul Tirans can basically be seen as fatties but I love their lore and aesthetics and that actually has me making Kul Tiran characters for my character ideas (Kul Tiran Warriors look extremely badass for instance, and Kul Tiran druids are an interesting concept with the death magic bits).

I can't speak much more mechagnomes though, honestly to me it's like the LFD: more of the same. Mechagnomes just come off as gnomes but more techy/mechanical. Is there more depth to them than that? I find it also perplexing that they don't even want to be mechanized, so it's like this race that people applaud for "yeah they're cyborg-y!" but the lore seems to say they don't like themselves for that same reason.

- - - Updated - - -

Blizzard knows that they could have zero lines and zero dialogue and people would still play them because they are small foxes.

Yup, same like Void Elves. Have fuck all lore other than "Blood Elves but with Void" and ofc they're popular because they use exactly the same model as the most popular model in the game, but colored blue/purple. Couldn't even get the treatment that Nightborne got of being slightly different model from Night Elves.