1. #1
    Deleted

    A bunch of Arms questions

    Hello. It's been awhile since I've played Arms and while going through the Icy Veins guide I've compiled a bunch of questions I have that I'd really appreciate some answers to.

    Test of Might
    1. I'm assuming test of might stacks?

    2. Are multiple traits of ToM required to make Bladestorming outside of CS better than in CS or is 1 trait enough?

    3. Is it recommended to BS during CS in the opener even if you have test of might? With Test of Might I try to spend as much rage as possible in CS but the results of bladestorming during ToS are nowhere near as good simply using BS in CS on the opener.

    4. I'm having a really hard time understanding this line on Icy Veins. I can't yet figure out the reasoning for missing out Mortal Strike, especially when it seems to imply that filler should only ever be used above 60 rage even when CS has a long cooldown left. 'When using Test of Might, Rage should only be spent on Slam or Whirlwind when above 60 Rage or during Colossus Smash.

    My best guess right now is that the line above in bold doesn't change anything about CS, the aim is still to dump as much rage as possible. However outside of CS you should only use whirlwind or slam when above 60 rage. Is the point of the line meant to be that it lessens the chance of rage starving and not being able to mortal strike on cd?

    Execute
    5. I expected to see something on Icy Veins about the 20-40 rage range of execute and maybe saving execute for 40 rage max damage but I couldn't find anything. Do you execute no matter your rage?

    Skull Splitter
    6. Why is it said to only use Skill Splitter when under 60 rage? My guess would be it has something to do with not overcapping but skullsplitter only gives 20 rage meaning if you used it at around 60 you'd only go to 80.

    Mortal Strike
    7. Is it correct to use MS on cooldown even if it overlaps deepwounds?

    Overpower/Seismic Wave
    8. Are 3/3 traits of SW needed for it to be worthwile swapping out other traits like test for might?

    Optional
    9. Does anyone know a macro or a trick I could use to only use one keybind by having something swap slam for whirlwind when I have fervor for battle talented?

    Thanks a lot for any help.
    Last edited by mmoc30274401ab; 2018-09-04 at 11:55 AM.

  2. #2
    1. strength bonus stacks duration does not.
    2-3. depends on how much rage you can spent during CS. When I try, one is not enaugh so I use BS during CS.
    4- only guessing: it is because you want to go in CS window with high rage to spent more during it.
    5- if you don't have executinor's precision it is recomended to use at 40 rage. if you do have EP then whenever available.
    6. because an auto attack may happen at the same time which will overcap. If you have AA swing timer then you can use skul spliter at or above 60. still below 80 though
    7. yes
    8. not sure
    9. I don't think so. I just move them on action bar with shift+left mouse button. EDIT: apperantly there is a way to macro it. see below comment.
    Last edited by LazyCoding; 2018-09-04 at 02:38 PM.

  3. #3
    Dreadlord kraid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarithus93 View Post
    9. Does anyone know a macro or a trick I could use to only use one keybind by having something swap slam for whirlwind when I have fervor for battle talented?

    Thanks a lot for any help.
    #showtooltip
    /cast [talent:3/2] Whirlwind; Slam

    There you go buddy

  4. #4
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by LazyCoding View Post
    1. strength bonus stacks duration does not.
    2-3. depends on how much rage you can spent during CS. When I try, one is not enaugh so I use BS during CS.
    4- only guessing: it is because you want to go in CS window with high rage to spent more during it.
    5- if you don't have executinor's precision it is recomended to use at 40 rage. if you do have EP then whenever available.
    6. because an auto attack may happen at the same time which will overcap. If you have AA swing timer then you can use skul spliter at or above 60. still below 80 though
    7. yes
    8. not sure
    9. I don't think so. I just move them on action bar with shift+left mouse button. EDIT: apperantly there is a way to macro it. see below comment.
    Thanks for the reply.

    2-3. I have 2 traits of ToM at the moment and usually I seem to get around 1300 strength on the buff after using charge -> skullsplitter -> cs -> and dumping rage. I don't know if that's considered a lot (I think the max I've had is around 1500) and it still feels weak compared to just cs -> bladestorm

    4. I can understand that but surely the answer is to pool rage when CS is coming off cooldown only. Seems unnecessary to only ever use slam/whirlwind at >60 rage all the time.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by kraid View Post
    #showtooltip
    /cast [talent:3/2] Whirlwind; Slam

    There you go buddy
    That works great. Thanks!

    I didn't think that was an option since slam isn't a talent.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Sarithus93 View Post
    Thanks for the reply.

    2-3. I have 2 traits of ToM at the moment and usually I seem to get around 1300 strength on the buff after using charge -> skullsplitter -> cs -> and dumping rage. I don't know if that's considered a lot (I think the max I've had is around 1500) and it still feels weak compared to just cs -> bladestorm

    4. I can understand that but surely the answer is to pool rage when CS is coming off cooldown only. Seems unnecessary to only ever use slam/whirlwind at >60 rage all the time.
    1300 is good enaugh to save BS for after CS. On my character it gives more than 30% increase. Your ilvl can't be too different than mine. Another thing to consider is that Deep wounds does not benefit from CS debuff but does from Strength. So with Strenth bonus, on AoE fights BS applies bigger DW to all targets for nearly double duration. On ST it is still better idea to use abilities that do get benefit from CS debuff over BS(BS's own damage is increased but the DW it constantly applies is big part of BS).
    That Archi guy must have done some math or sim stuff for all this. You can check his guides in discord. The guide on Icy-veins is also his. But it is not detailed.

    4. Well if you never overcap there is no down side to staying at high rage. If you think you won't ever delay CS for the pupose of pooling rage then you can spend all your rage until the last X second of its CD. But you won't do more dps than what you would do by always staying at 60+ rage. you will just have some risk of either delaying CS or getting less Strength from ToM.
    Last edited by LazyCoding; 2018-09-04 at 04:30 PM.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by LazyCoding View Post
    5- if you don't have executinor's precision it is recomended to use at 40 rage. if you do have EP then whenever available.
    I asked this on Discord and they said just to spam Execute regarding rage

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Euroguy View Post
    I asked this on Discord and they said just to spam Execute regarding rage
    That is because now the difference is trivial from a pure DPS point of view. When you use Exe at 40 rage you do same damage in fewer GCDs. Now that cooldowns like SS,avatar, commanding shout etc are all on GCD this may be usefull sometimes.

    It used to be a bigger deal in legion when CS increased Exe damage.

  8. #8
    Deleted
    Back with another question/query.

    I'm no longer using ToM in Mythic+ so that means I'm bladestorming during colossus smash. With a charge and warbreaker (two Lord of War's) I often find it hard not to overcap rage during bladestorm.

    BS'ing after CS actually felt better and more natural but as far as I know there are better traits for aoe than ToM which is why I'm no longer using them.

    Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Any things I said that stick out as incorrect to you?

    Thanks.
    Last edited by mmoc30274401ab; 2018-09-14 at 07:19 AM.

  9. #9
    First of all, when you are not sure about your rotation or want some help to get to learn, when to use which ability, i can recommend you my WA:
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...Auras-Easy-Way!
    ToM is a good overall trait and it has very good synergy with your talents (AngerManagment f.E.). Therefore it is also good for AoE. Even using only one ToM trait is as good as some strenght buffs from good trinkets. Using more than one ToM is therefore even better. When using ToM you can also spend your rage during CS and this avoids your rage capping problem. After CS u are rage starved, so Bladestorm with ToM buff provides some rage. There are also other good AoE traits like Seismic slam or LaserMatrix. So when you Charge - Skullsplitter - CS - MS - Bladestorm it is also ok, because your CS debuff lasts long enough. But dont think to static, delaying your CDs or using Bladestorm before CS is up can be also worth sincve it depends on boss phase and situation.
    =)

  10. #10
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Rangatira View Post
    First of all, when you are not sure about your rotation or want some help to get to learn, when to use which ability, i can recommend you my WA:
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...Auras-Easy-Way!
    ToM is a good overall trait and it has very good synergy with your talents (AngerManagment f.E.). Therefore it is also good for AoE. Even using only one ToM trait is as good as some strenght buffs from good trinkets. Using more than one ToM is therefore even better. When using ToM you can also spend your rage during CS and this avoids your rage capping problem. After CS u are rage starved, so Bladestorm with ToM buff provides some rage. There are also other good AoE traits like Seismic slam or LaserMatrix. So when you Charge - Skullsplitter - CS - MS - Bladestorm it is also ok, because your CS debuff lasts long enough. But dont think to static, delaying your CDs or using Bladestorm before CS is up can be also worth sincve it depends on boss phase and situation.
    =)
    I appreciate your reply but this thread seems to point to ToM being less good than lord of war and seismic wave. Icy veins and bloodmallet also point to ToM being low for multi target. After I read it I also switched to using using more lord of war and seismic wave for M+.

    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...-can-t-sim-AoE

    I'd prefer if ToM was the way to go for aoe because of the rage issue I described, though.
    Last edited by mmoc30274401ab; 2018-09-14 at 09:42 AM.

  11. #11
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    ToM only outperform Lord of War on pure single target, assuming you actually manage it well. LoW is only slightly behind on ST, and completely dominates it on cleave and M+. Seismic Wave is slightly better for cleave, but is garbage for ST. As there are very few fights that are pathwerk style any more the correct choice overall seems to be to just stack LoW 3/3 and keep an off set for ToM for the few fights that actually are pure ST. However, since you can't change gear in M+ you might as well always run LoW.

    EDIT: Regarding the rage capping issue and BS when using LoW. The duration of CS obviously doesn't change with stats, it stays at 10. Haste makes Bladestorm go faster, so I usually find time to dump enough rage before BS to actually not overcap, or if I do just slightly. Increased rage regen from haste affecting attack speed of course negates this to a certain extent, but the rage gained from LoW + Charge obviously won't be affected. I do run Fervor though as I only do M+, so that makes it easier to dump rage.
    Last edited by Xeley; 2018-09-14 at 10:38 AM.

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