View Poll Results: Is buying tokens and boosts from Blizzard considered cheating in WoW?

Voters
929. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, this is clearly cheating

    108 11.63%
  • No, cheating has a very specific meaning

    788 84.82%
  • Other - My answer is way too convoluted, see below

    33 3.55%
Page 30 of 31 FirstFirst ...
20
28
29
30
31
LastLast
  1. #581
    Merely a Setback Gehco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    FEEL THE WRATH OF MY SPANNER!!
    Posts
    29,688
    Quote Originally Posted by Deficineiron View Post
    this is a good example of what I call goalpost-moving.

    Later in past expansions, when boosts are available which DO go to max level, does that change things?
    Well, when boosts do go max level, means you are at least half way through the expansion and thus the game of choice changes again.
    Stuff can be fixed, just get enough glue or duct tape!
    Roses are red, mana is blue. Suramar Guards, Will always find you!

  2. #582
    Quote Originally Posted by Deficineiron View Post
    this is a good example of what I call goalpost-moving.

    Later in past expansions, when boosts are available which DO go to max level, does that change things?
    By the time you boost at the end of the expac, you still have to complete shit, get gear, get good, and clear the raids. Hardly feesible in 2 weeks time, and hardly worth it at that point since the new greens will outweigh the old purples.

  3. #583
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Old New New York
    Posts
    9,219
    Not cheating. The competitive parts of the game can't really be bought (high end pvp/raiding/m+/etc). You can argue that using the gold you get from selling tokens to buy high ilvl gear from the AH can be considered pay2win, but just having those high ilvl items doesn't mean you're a good player that can get into a competitive guild.

    Just because you have gold to pay for a +10 carry doesn't mean you're a good player, in fact, it's quite the opposite.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  4. #584
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    Not cheating. The competitive parts of the game can't really be bought (high end pvp/raiding/m+/etc). You can argue that using the gold you get from selling tokens to buy high ilvl gear from the AH can be considered pay2win, but just having those high ilvl items doesn't mean you're a good player that can get into a competitive guild.

    Just because you have gold to pay for a +10 carry doesn't mean you're a good player, in fact, it's quite the opposite.
    Great post. You should explain it to @Mafic.

  5. #585
    Quote Originally Posted by Fitsu View Post
    Interesting how you completely skipped my question of explaining exactly how it gives an advantage or showing any sort of proof (given that nobody in the competitive scene has gained any sort of advantage from this).

    Also how you totally skipped my response regarding how you could get pretty much every relevant BoE within ~30hrs of farming gold. Even though you claim you need to play "16+ hrs/day". Stop spouting nonsense about how xyz is "economics 101" and maybe give something to backup your comments.

    Or perhaps you know your wrong, and are just to afraid to admit it so you give generic responses that hold no real argument?

    Come on mr. 101, give an answer with some substance.
    Actually I addressed in that you are not going to be able to farm $20 dollars worth of gold per hour in game. It is basic math that I feel comfortable with. Also, If you need 30hrs to farm that gold game then in real life you can buy eight times that value of gold via $20 dollars per clip working a job in real life. This is why RMT is considered cheating because the value of real life money invalidates the virtual gold and how it is made in game.
    Battle for Abilities = WoD 2.0


    Quote Originally Posted by Rekz View Post
    I'll trust blizzard over your assessment. They've been doing this for a long time. It may very well be that your class is nerfed in which case, your class will feel as if it doesn't work correctly.

  6. #586
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    Actually I addressed in that you are not going to be able to farm $20 dollars worth of gold per hour in game. It is basic math that I feel comfortable with. Also, If you need 30hrs to farm that gold game then in real life you can buy eight times that value of gold via $20 dollars per clip working a job in real life. This is why RMT is considered cheating because the value of real life money invalidates the virtual gold and how it is made in game.
    For one, that's simply not true. on EU a token is worth 175k and costs £17? The Minimum wage is £8/hr and you can easily farm 75k/hr... So on that wage you would earn £16 in 2 hours working or 150k from farming... Not that different. You would need to be earning around £65/hr for real money to have "8 times the value". That's 135k/yr... That is like a top 1% wage. So your first point is flat out wrong.

    But that's irreverent because even if that was the case you can't "pay to win" with gold because there's a very small amount you can get from gold. There's a few BoEs and unless your going nuts buying 395 with socket ones then you'll get them all at around 370 - 375 within like 10 hours of gold farming. Even then, if we was for a moment to agree with this insane pay to win notion your talking a net gain of maybe 3 overall ilvls? That's what, 500 dps? How is that Pay to Win?

    You can't pay excessive amounts of gold to get a decent: Helm, Shoulders, Neck, Chest, Weapon, Trinkets. Which are all your most important slots.

    So I'll ask again, what exactly is this apparent "competitive edge" buying gold is giving people?

    Oh on a side note, there are no top players that have bothered to buy these massive BoEs because they simply aren't worth it due to how little the gain would be compared to much cheaper or easier to obtain options which further proves how futile your argument is that the game is pay to win.

    Also, tokens have greatly benefited the game because for the most part they have snuffed out a lot of online shops that abused bots & account hacking to gain materials effectively meaning that a player couldn't compete when it came to farming because the mass bots would sell everything at ludicrously low prices so ironically tokens have made the game even more accessible for a player who doesn't want to buy gold because they can again farm materials at a decent value.
    Last edited by mmoc2bf1948faa; 2018-10-16 at 11:42 PM.

  7. #587
    This thread is still going?

    Why?


    Blizzard decides if you are cheating. If you want to look at it personally as cheating? Great, who cares? More power to you. Ignorantly think of it however you want.

    In the end Blizzard's opinion on this subject is the only one of value, and they state its not cheating. You obviously wont be banned for using Blizzard's services.

    /thread (except I am sure I'll see this pop up in another month's time with people still bitching at each other over a completely pointless topic).

  8. #588
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    That argument was made already if you read the thread or you can go a few pages back. Cheating as defined by the merriam webster? That is elementary. Anything that grants a competitive advantage or edge outside the intended purpose of the original game design is cheating.

    Imagine what the token would do to the classic WoW and the how the gold would destroy server economies. And server economies are more personal and unique in classic compared to retail.
    Once again, the token is not against rules, and therefore not cheating. That's a fact. It's indisputable.

  9. #589
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    If only the cheaters had their own separate servers they can play on. That way legit players can play on servers not tainted by the boosts and gold token.
    Obvious troll is obvious, in all my wow life, I've bought one token because I had no gold because I stopped for some time. 380K gold at the time, you could earn this in litterally hours if you had a ton of alts, I don't have alts.

    You cant buy stuff (or you can the first week, then every BOE is useless) with gold and most importantly, you cant buy skill. But you can buy "PL" which I consider more "cheating" than any gold token... And these happen even without tokens.

    Why are you raging ? Because people had to farm less to get gold ? I know a friend who sold a BOE the first day of BFA and got more gold than 3 tokens, with only LUCK. I've yet to loot a single BOE in bfa.
    Last edited by vashe9; 2018-10-17 at 06:08 AM.

  10. #590
    Quote Originally Posted by GnomeWarlock View Post
    Wow. What an incredibly inciteful post. Unless of course I am smelling sarcasm.
    Dripping with sarcasm. Oozing with it.

    Honestly I couldn't care less about the issue of 'cheating'. World firsts? High Warlord/Grand Marshal? Gladiator? Who cares.

    It's a game people. If you get famous playing it, good on you, but otherwise it's just a game.
    You're not to think you are anything special. You're not to think you are as good as we are. You're not to think you are smarter than we are. You're not to convince yourself that you are better than we are. You're not to think you know more than we do. You're not to think you are more important than we are. You're not to think you are good at anything. You're not to laugh at us. You're not to think anyone cares about you. You're not to think you can teach us anything.

  11. #591
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Laerrus View Post
    It is legalized and monetized cheating.

    It's really not that much different from plopping down the $50 you earned mowing lawns over the Summer for a brand new Game Genie.

    90% of you whipper snappers probably don't even know what one of those is.
    It's like going to a games competition then paying the organisers to put a game genie in the console to give you extra stats.

  12. #592
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    No. Nothing in the game is free. You have to pay to play the game, so you are sort of right. The entire game is "pay to win" because you can't possibly win without paying.

    Your mind is so tangled in nonsense that we're never going to convince you of how wrong you are, so there is no point in trying. Just know that the entire rest of the world knows that you are wrong.
    You are too close to the game to objectively assess what the rest of the world thinks. The fact that you think getting in game achievements and levels that you didn't accomplish using a currency that is completely outside the in game world is somehow within game rules tells me that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by cuafpr View Post
    do you never take a short cut on a track in racing game? the orginal super mario brothers had secrets / pipes that allowed you to skip levels was that cheating? you are entitle to your opinion but i suspect you will be in the minority
    No it wasn't cheating because its part of the in game world.

  13. #593
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffyman View Post
    It's like going to a games competition then paying the organisers to put a game genie in the console to give you extra stats.
    ... You know having a larger amount of Gold doesn't change your stats at all, right?

  14. #594
    Deleted
    It's not cheating, because it's available to everyone and provided by Blizzard.

    It's probably pay to win depending on how you define this.

  15. #595
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by LanToaster View Post
    "Cheating" is such an Easy word. Sure you can stamp the word "Cheating" on almost any Violation of the Rules.
    But if it were that easy the ToS would be a hell of a lot shorter.

    Using Exploits is a form of Cheat, and "Leveling as intended", is exactly the right words here.
    Blizzard makes the Rules for the game, it is not up to anyone else to decide what "Cheating" is.

    The LevelBoots also follows its rules. You can for example not Boost to MaxLevel.


    This is also the same as the AccountSharing ToS breach. You are not allowed to buy/sell Services/Items ingame with Real money.

    This is not neccessarily because they "dont Profit" from it, but to at least the same amount to protect the users from Scams and AccountLoss.
    (It Happens)


    What is or is not Cheating is determined by the Rules and not the Userbase. Oo
    Overall this is is rather odd thread if I think about it.
    The point you make is technically correct of course - how can it be cheating if the very company that sets the rules allows you to do it. In my view its more of a case that Blizzard are "allowing" you to cheat providing you pay them. I do not consider real life money or the shop part of the in game world and as such should not influence it. Its not fair to everyone else who plays the game properly and causing a conflict of interest for Blizzard.

    Taking this to its natural conclusion, buying gear, access to powerful classes, I win buttons or Bots if on sale from the shop wouldn't be cheating either.
    Last edited by mmoc93b0a7f85d; 2018-10-20 at 12:25 PM.

  16. #596
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    Either way it just makes things worse for legit players. Let them play on their own self contained servers and have them compete with one another on the auction house for goods instead.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Yeah but legit players like you suffer thought with expensive pots. At some point legit players should realize that cheaters are the ones least complaining about the prices of pots...
    its insane how much gold i spend and farmed this expansion even more then in legion i know that blizzard wants to remove gold out of the game but this dont hurts the rich gold moguls in wow i think its to late for blizzard to go this route but yeah i am on a point where my time i spend on farming is more then i raid and i slowly realize hey why should i do this its not worth the time or rl money would be better to stop mythic raiding i am not sure atm anymore

  17. #597
    Quote Originally Posted by GrinningMan View Post
    Dripping with sarcasm. Oozing with it.

    Honestly I couldn't care less about the issue of 'cheating'. World firsts? High Warlord/Grand Marshal? Gladiator? Who cares.

    It's a game people. If you get famous playing it, good on you, but otherwise it's just a game.
    It is definitely just a game.

  18. #598
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    ... You know having a larger amount of Gold doesn't change your stats at all, right?
    Having a larger amount of gold literally changes you starts which is then used to buy boosts or items which literally change your stats.

  19. #599
    It's only "cheating" if you and another person are doing a race to see who's the fastest to reach max level and buying leveling boosts is against the arbitrary rules you two agreed upon for said 'race'.

  20. #600
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffyman View Post
    Having a larger amount of gold literally changes you starts which is then used to buy boosts or items which literally change your stats.
    Yes, because being lvl 110 with 177 gear is a HUGE threat to a 120 with 390 ilvl.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •