Is the 3% holy healing nerf really needed?

[Aydinx2]

Holy finally is in a half decent spot

They were outhealing all other healers in raids by more than 3%, so I'd say it's a fair nerf.

[Nyel]

The only thing that would make sense, and that I am sadly expecting, is to keep Salvation as it is, but entirely replacing the Hymn.
I think that's the only raid cooldown in the game that is straight added through a talent, instead of being an improvement of the existing one (for example Luminous Barrier is a different version of the PW:Barrier, with different purposes/strength).

Yes. I don't really know why it's not the case already.

- - - Updated - - -

Why are you counting the Mana Hymn here? It may be a CD but it doesn't heal.

Also, this is literally the first time Holy is on top for CDs. It always used to be druid, monks or shamans. As a priest main it's quite irritating to hear people says stuff like "priest OP, pls nerf" when their main concern is that their own classes CDs are not competitive.

As an example, priest wasn't buffed when druid dominated with Tranq, which they could even channel while moving. Neither were druids nerfed when everybody cried "druid OP, pls nerf". I really don't understand why people take issue with priests being in the spotlight for CDs this once.

Well then let's remove Mana Hymn from that list; makes Holy still the only healer with two healing raid CDs which is nonsense. No class should have two healing raidwide CDs. No class. And Druids should lose Inner Peace talent as well. Tranquility already is maybe the strongest healing CD and then a CD reduction by 33%? Monk, Shaman and Paladin raid CDs are far below Tranqulity or Priests double CDs.

Salvation is just out of control with PoM + Renew + instant healing + Echo. Remove one component and I'd be fine with it but the best would, as Ophenia said, Salvation replacing Divine Hymn.

[kabshiel]

I think that's the only raid cooldown in the game that is straight added through a talent, instead of being an improvement of the existing one (for example Luminous Barrier is a different version of the PW:Barrier, with different purposes/strength).

Besides Flourish, Invoke Chi-Ji, Evangelism, and Ascendance...

[Ophenia]

Besides Flourish, Invoke Chi-Ji, Evangelism, and Ascendance...

Chi-Ji is not really comparable to Salvation though.

For the other ones, they can at best be compared to Apotheosis, as they're not "Push-to-Win" buttons. You still have to use your regular spells, these talents won't save the raid by themselves.

[Azalar]

I would just rework Salvation. The PoM effect seems nice on paper but then most of the stacks are lost since all of them will bounce and stack to a max of 10 charges in a single target, so a whole lot of healing is lost. I would remove the PoM part of Salvation and make PoM bounce again while Divine Hymn is being channeled.

(I miss the cloak self resurrect, it made us very special T_T)

[Edgekidxxx]

Well, rip m+, disc is cool in guild runs but i hate disc during m+ pugs

AMEN. Healing M+ pugs as Disc is tantamount to self mutilation.

[Deleted]

I'm fine with the 3% nerf, but I read al ot of silly things in this thread.

Holy has NEVER been a strong pick at the launch of a new expansion (at least in the last 4) and we always lacked a sort of utility flavour that could make us a better pick on another spec. Being the only healer that can bring 2 raid CDs and a mana regen tool for all healers makes us worth being taken on progress, and compensates for our weaknesses (like being squishy as fuck and less mobile than others, but I am ok with that).

I do remember years - and tons of threads - of begging to have more utility and a DH usable while moving, just to be more competitive, with the only result of Blizzard not listening and people mocking us saying "just reroll Discipline". Now we are strong and the point is taking away what put us in a better place? Totally unfair.

[Feigr]

I don't understand the logic of saying that Priests should only have one big raid cooldown because other healers only have one. Healers do not need to be exactly the same.
Priests don't have combat res, we don't have Innervate, we can't Ankh, we can't shift into bear form to survive damage spikes etc. And that's fine! We can be the healer with two huge cooldowns and great raid wide healing because we don't bring a ton of utility and survivability compared to some other healers.

As someone who has played a Holy Priest for ~13 years I am very happy with where we are right now in terms of performance and how fun it is to play.

[Ophenia]

Yeah honestly, all the complaints coming from the HPal community will grant the Holy Priest an undeserved nerf.

The Holy Priest's only Strength is his raw healing power. We don't have anything to reduce the damage taken by our mates (all the other healing specs have this possibility), we can only heal them afterward. So, if the Holy Priest has the same healing capabilities of other healers, then this spec is entirely pointless.

Beyond that, we have poor mobility, poor defensive cooldown, but yeah, we "deserve" a nerf, because we're great at raid healing on cooldowns. sigh.

[Deleted]

Yeah honestly, all the complaints coming from the HPal community will grant the Holy Priest an undeserved nerf.

The Holy Priest's only Strength is his raw healing power. We don't have anything to reduce the damage taken by our mates (all the other healing specs have this possibility), we can only heal them afterward. So, if the Holy Priest has the same healing capabilities of other healers, then this spec is entirely pointless.

Beyond that, we have poor mobility, poor defensive cooldown, but yeah, we "deserve" a nerf, because we're great at raid healing on cooldowns. sigh.

Uh, yes, that is exactly why holy needed a nerf as holy was simply healing too much. Lets not pretend that they are not viable for progress because Josh was switching between both specs during the race. All this complaining about a justified nerf is silly - holy is still one of the top raiding healing specs in the game and there is nothing wrong with holy up to +10 in m+.

[Ophenia]

Uh, yes, that is exactly why holy needed a nerf as holy was simply healing too much. Lets not pretend that they are not viable for progress because Josh was switching between both specs during the race. All this complaining about a justified nerf is silly - holy is still one of the top raiding healing specs in the game and there is nothing wrong with holy up to +10 in m+.

Josh could have killed G'huun healing as Shadow as well.

I really, really hope they're not balancing specs based on the top players world.

[Deleted]

Uh, yes, that is exactly why holy needed a nerf as holy was simply healing too much. Lets not pretend that they are not viable for progress because Josh was switching between both specs during the race. All this complaining about a justified nerf is silly - holy is still one of the top raiding healing specs in the game and there is nothing wrong with holy up to +10 in m+.

You're missing the point. Holy brings healing power only. It has almost zero utility, worst mobility, bad survivability.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh, right, you're disc.

[Deleted]

You're missing the point. Holy brings healing power only. It has almost zero utility, worst mobility, bad survivability.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh, right, you're disc.

I am not missing the point. Too much healing is....too much healing. If the other areas need to be addressed then so be it but holy was simply putting out too much raw healing. The spec I play is irrelevant but if you want to compare nerfs then disc has received 3x as many as holy and they were pretty much justified.

[Ophenia]

I am not missing the point. Too much healing is....too much healing.

But if the Holy barely heals slightly more than all the other specs, then it is pointless to even bring one, because it can't survive as easily, it doesn't bring a lot to any raid comp/encounter.

It has to heal substantially more than all the other specs, as long as he lacks tools.