[TV] The Mandalorian (*Spoilers*)

[eschatological]

as producer she is gate keeper, that she ok'd the sequel trilogy n let johnson fuck it up is on her, she should have gotten better people to make movies

Rian Johnson's film right after TLJ was Oscar nominated. Knives Out is an amazing film and Looper was pretty good. He's a great film director and makes good movies.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

How much of that work was done under Spielberg?

Orange joe linked her IMDb you are free to cross reference at your leisure.

[Shadowferal]

Rian Johnson's film right after TLJ was Oscar nominated. Knives Out is an amazing film and Looper was pretty good. He's a great film director and makes good movies.

On his own...yeah.

[eschatological]

On his own...yeah.

So who "interfered" with TLJ in your mind to make it "bad?"

Is it Kennedy? If so, why would you not give her credit for interference on her long list of other credits, which include the Indiana Jones series?

IMO, if I look at the story narrative of TLJ, it seems clear to me that Rian Johnson (who wrote the movie as well) had a very good storyline idea for Rey/Luke/Kylo, a decent one on the idea of heroes vs practicality (Poe/Holdo/Leia), and might have been told that he couldn't ignore Finn, for which he created Rose so Finn could have some storyline, idk.

[qwerty123456]

You mean the guy who lost to a Gary Stu that had minimal training, even though he was suppose to be the strongest force user ever?

Who was the Gary Stu he lost to? You mean Luke the son he kept trying to convince to turn to the dark side and refused to kill?

So who "interfered" with TLJ in your mind to make it "bad?"

Is it Kennedy? If so, why would you not give her credit for interference on her long list of other credits, which include the Indiana Jones series?

IMO, if I look at the story narrative of TLJ, it seems clear to me that Rian Johnson (who wrote the movie as well) had a very good storyline idea for Rey/Luke/Kylo, a decent one on the idea of heroes vs practicality (Poe/Holdo/Leia), and might have been told that he couldn't ignore Finn, for which he created Rose so Finn could have some storyline, idk.

I think the problem was just him needing to make a middle movie with leftovers for a third after JJ killed 90% of the galaxy in the first film. I blame JJ(and the Force Awakens writers) for all the problems with Disney Starwars film trilogy.

[Orange Joe]

As compared to Rey who had a couple of weeks...

https://screenrant.com/star-wars-luk...ning-how-long/

If Luke's time training as a Jedi starts with Yoda and ends with Return of the Jedi, then he only spends about a year practicing in the ways of the Force. It's actually a comparable amount of time that it takes Rey to go from training with Luke in Star Wars: The Last Jedi to her heightened power level in Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker, which some have complained happened too quickly. But, the truth is that Rey trained as a Jedi for just about as long as Luke did.

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Who was the Gary Stu he lost to? You mean Luke the son he kept trying to convince to turn to the dark side and refused to kill?

I mean if Ray is a Mary sue the Luke is 100% a Gary Stu

[qwerty123456]

https://screenrant.com/star-wars-luk...ning-how-long/



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I mean if Ray is a Mary sue the Luke is 100% a Gary Stu

How is he when he constantly lost dude. He even gave in temporarily to the darkside..... Its almost like you haven't even watched any of the films. The only thing he "won" was shooting shit and he had a reason for being good at shooting shit.

She was so poor she lived in a robot corpse with barely any rations and yet found a copy of microsoft flight simulator to become the greatest pilot ever then a beyond god tier force user because of some force dyad shit. Luke was a farmboy used to shooting shit.

[Orange Joe]

How is he when he constantly lost dude. He even gave in temporarily to the darkside.....

How did he lose? He saved all his friends and even turned his father back to the light side at the very end.

[Triceron]

Rian Johnson's film right after TLJ was Oscar nominated. Knives Out is an amazing film and Looper was pretty good. He's a great film director and makes good movies.

The thing is, Rian's style just didn't match what was expected of Star Wars.

If people were looking for a fresh take on Star Wars that subverts expectations, then it'd be fine. But that isn't what is expected of a movie for the mainline sequel trilogy. I think had the Last Jedi been some side story or spinoff like what they did with the Star Wars Visions animated stuff, then it'd be much better accepted.

Knives Out was completely in Rian's style with every major actor in the movie playing roles opposite of what they're known for. He embraces turning people's expectations around. The audience has to embrace it as well in order to enjoy it. If Knives Out was a sequel to a major franchise, then it'd be confusing as fuck.

I do think the onus was on Kathleen Kennedy for simply picking the wrong person for the wrong job. Not that Rian Johnson was bad, or his story was particularly bad, but he missed the ball on what everyone expected out of a Star Wars sequel. I'd say the same 'missing the ball' is happening right now with the whole Star Wars cruise thing, where it's absolutely absent of all the things fans want out of Star Wars.

[qwerty123456]

How did he lose? He saved all his friends and even turned his father back to the light side at the very end.

His father turned to the light side to save him. He didn't win because he was op he won because he was his son. He only won at blowing shit up. Every actual fight he lost. In the one fight he did "win" it was because he gave into the darkside which is what the Emperor and his dad wanted. Luke isn't even who the prophecy was about. It was about Anakin.

And technically because of Disney Starwars he didn't even win at all the only thing he did in the end was kinda redeem his father.

[Triceron]

How did he lose? He saved all his friends and even turned his father back to the light side at the very end.

In Empire, he thought he was invincible enough to save his friends and beat the bad guy only to get his hand cut off and cost his incomplete training. Even by the end, he doesn't actually win, he's completely screwed and the entire rebel alliance was trapped. He risked it all on blind faith in his father resisting the Emperor, a final gambit that happened to pay off. Having that gambit pay off doesn't make Luke a Gary Stu...

A Gary Stu gives off the impression of perfection, while Luke is as imperfect as it gets. He's a typical Chosen One hero archetype. Gary Stu isn't a label you throw around at characters that win a lot or are very powerful. Even characters like Neo from the Matrix and Rocky Balboa are not Gary Stu's just because they practically win every fight they're shown fighting in. They're not characters that give off the impression of being perfect. They're ultimately flawed human characters who grow strong over the course of the story, but by no means perfect.

[Relikk]

Filoni likes the sequels.

Filoni, while working for Lucasfilm, will never give a wholly honest opinion about the sequels. We don't know what he really thinks of them. The same way that Kennedy would never admit that the sequels were a complete and utter failure on a storytelling level, under her tenure, but she'll keep mentioning them every once in a while to tell people that they still exist while plugging the latest shows that essentially have nothing to do with, or will never move past the sequel trilogy timeline, because the sequel trilogy is divisive, but not in a good way. Alienating people with a 40 year investment in the franchise wasn't a wise thing to do and they realise that now.

[Orange Joe]

He thought you were invincible enough to save his friends and beat the bad guy only to get his hand cut off at the cost of incomplete training. Even by the end, he doesn't actually win, he's completely screwed and the entire rebel alliance was trapped. Turning his father back to the light out doesn't make Luke a Gary Stu....

They were so trapped they all came out alive and killed the emperor.... Yeah thats not a Gary Stu at all....

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His father turned to the light side to save him. He didn't win because he was op he won because he was his son. He only won at blowing shit up. Every actual fight he lost. In the one fight he did "win" it was because he gave into the darkside which is what the Emperor and his dad wanted. Luke isn't even who the prophecy was about. It was about Anakin.

So he lost because he didn't win from being op... I don't even.....

Clearly a guy with a few weeks of training standing up to the emperor and the top force user in the galaxy is not op......

[Lorgar Aurelian]

TBH the only absolutely stupid thing I know she has done was basically letting JJ and Rian do what the fuck they wanted with no real plan. I guess if she was the one that got JJ hired then that would be the second stupid thing.

It’s been years so I could be wrong but I want to say there was a plan but then JJ jumped ship after the first movie leaving little to go off of and then when he came back for the last one he wanted to undo all of Rian’s choices no matter how bad the end result was.

[qwerty123456]

They were so trapped they all came out alive and killed the emperor.... Yeah thats not a Gary Stu at all....

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So he lost because he didn't win from being op... I don't even.....

Clearly a guy with a few weeks of training standing up to the emperor and the top force user in the galaxy is not op......

They didn't kill the Emperor. Lorewise he now transferred to a clone as he was falling.

And you forget that Both the Emperor and Vader wanted Luke alive and to convert him to the DarkSide. He didn't win because he was op.

It’s been years so I could be wrong but I want to say there was a plan but then JJ jumped ship after the first movie leaving little to go off of and then when he came back for the last one he wanted to undo all of Rian’s choices no matter how bad the end result was.

Pretty sure Rian said he wasn't given a plan. And JJ fucked up the whole trilogy with his nostalgia and buffing shit fetishes.

[Orange Joe]

They didn't kill the Emperor. Lorewise he now transferred to a clone as he was falling.

And you forget that Both the Emperor and Vader wanted Luke alive and to convert him to the DarkSide. He didn't win because he was op.

So you are still trying to claim a force user with a few weeks of training being able to resist the 2 most powerful darkside users is not op?

[qwerty123456]

So you are still trying to claim a force user with a few weeks of training being able to resist the 2 most powerful darkside users is not op?

Do you not understand that they didn't want him dead? He even gave in temporarily to the darkside. The only reason he isn't dead or fully gave in was that Anikin loved his son more than the darkside.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I'd say the same 'missing the ball' is happening right now with the whole Star Wars cruise thing, where it's absolutely absent of all the things fans want out of Star Wars.

Not gonna lie a starwars cruise sounds pretty bad ass.

[Orange Joe]

Do you not understand that they didn't want him dead?

That goes for turning him dark side too not just killing him fyi.


Hell, look how little it took to turn Anakin and he was trained as a child. but Luke is able to resist his father AND the emporer turning him.

Then those 2 after failing to turn him were also unable to kill him.

totally not a OP Gary Stu

[Darththeo]

As compared to Rey who had a couple of weeks...

With Luke.

Rey had more official training by the end of her Trilogy than Luke did during the OT. Luke was 90% self taught.

A few hours with Obi-wan, 3 years self taught, a couple of weeks to months with Yoda, and then another year self taught.

Rey had a year under Leia and the couple of weeks under Luke.