Raider.io and Curve are ruining the game, wake up people.

[neescher]

I play the game not the addon. Look how many extra "rules" you made:
1. You choose your keys avoiding what you are not skilled enough to play. Then you call skipping keys "skilled decision making" and it's clearly just dodging the challenging content.
2. You built score by pushing low keys. You said it not me.
3. You choose to banish players from specific servers because reasons.

All the above "rules" exist just in your brain and don't reflect how the game is supposed to be played. Also funny how as one of the advocates of rio you use the same provocative language pretending you are some sort of elite player and everyone who doesn't like rio must be scrubs.
Breaking news buddy: pushing 3-5 dungeons back and forth for an entire expansion just to justify an arbitrary score at a third party website does NOT mean you are a good player. You are as bad as those who claim a 2.4K in 2s and then come play RBG and don't have a clue.
It has been proved in this thread that a high rio is combination of choosing easy keys and spamming them as low as possible. So nothing else to discuss here. Players are en masse turning their backs on this shit, the website itself admitted defeat by adding privacy mode, you are all alone in this, the game will move
on.



Exactly what I have been saying. It can't log everything due to technical limitations so the people are obliged to spam keys between Wednesday and Friday else regardless what they do on weekends if the board is full they just don't register.

So once again (lost count how many times I said this): Fix the damn website by allowing it to register everything or render it obsolete because it's not working fairly and it promotes a falsified elitism that is disproportionate to the actual value of content played and doesn't promote the good players but those who can spam low/medium keys on Wednesdays.

And yet again you have proven that you have no idea how the system works. For the 17th time: You can't increase your score by "pushing 3-5 dungeons back and forth"

It has been proved in this thread that a high rio is combination of choosing easy keys and spamming them as low as possible.

Where has that been proven? I'm really interested in that proof, because you know, it's just not true. Another made up fact by you

[klepp0906]

the whole progression system atm prior to 375 is not a great environment in teaching players how to play. There is no point getting irate about Raider.io.

the reason people use it is because item level means nothing these days. someone who has no idea what they are doing can be 370 if they do the warfront enough times. the only way to measure a players skill on the surface level now is by using raider.io / wow prog / parses(to some extent).

back in days gone by there was no TF / Ezmode gear if someone had a particular collection of items in their character you knew they were decent, now newer / less skilled player have access to higher power levels (which i guess is fine) but in doing so blizzard has made ilevel mean very little and so something else has to become the new metric.

def not fine, considering it creates all the aforementioned and many not - issues. In contrast,what issues does it being so - solve?

[dragnipur]

People really need to stop using Raider.io and Curve, in fact, Blizzard should just shut them down or block APIs to keep them from scanning chars. People are turning into litteral mongoloids using this and it ruines the game. It's just like the mess the game became at WOTLK when the addon Gearscore was introduced, people went ape shit with delirious prerequisites to enter raids or M+. Just look at Uldir, the next week after it's opening, people were already checking Raider.Io, Curve, or whatever aids was invented to scan progression, and if you didn't down G'huun the first week, well you are fucked.

I don't know if Blizzard guys get onto this forum, but really, Raider.io and Curve need to be put down for the sake of the game not being ruined by morons that can't bear to just be decent people and just play without being monkeys and ask for every dungeon to be a literally a carry.

There already exists an option for you.You can not use them at all.Score and curve are not so important.But don't expect to be invited to anyones run without them knowing have you done the specific raid or M+.Have you done the dungeon on time,how many times and your M+ leves done.Because ilvl right know is a useless criteria.

[Mercane]

Because it's not accurate. It doesn't cover the playerbase. It takes snapshots of the top percentile at any given moment over a week.

If I wait until Saturday to do M+, because that's when I have the time, even if I make the timer, if the time's not high compared to the top-percentile of all the runs from the Tuesday reset to the Saturday, my data will not be recorded by Raider.io because that data's not available on the leaderboard.

If the tool had better coverage, it'd have more value. But since the data can be easily manipulated under certain conditions, it's at best useless and at worst detrimental.

I've had a few runs not register before, but throughout the rise of r.io in Legion, I never experienced this much (being on a smaller, connected realm)- but even on Mal'ganis it wasn't really that big of an issue. The limitation isn't on the Addon, it's in Blizzard's API and the number (and frequency) of API calls addons are allowed to make.

Part of me wants to call bullshit on the whole 'my time didn't register' thing, because if you're truly PUGing your run has a chance to show up on at least 2-3 realms.

[Enkrypt]

Then for the love of god, why do you need a constant flow of randoms into your M+ experience? In ideal situation you find one (!) M+ group, friendlist them and schedule your time to play together. Boom, done, whole reason for raider.io score to exist is gone. But apparently, players complain about lack of information about players and rely on unreliable tool, instead of relying on solid first-hand experience of said player. And in the same sentence say that people need to work for this arbitrary score in a video game (!!), but don't want to put any work themselves (!!!) into building a M+ team (!!!!). How more ridiculous can this go?

I never said I needed a constant flow of randoms. I do add people that I enjoy playing with from time to time.

I largely do Mythic+ with guildmates, but occasionally we need a member and I enjoy using the tool at my disposal.

It really seems like some of you have an irrational problem with this addon. I can't help you.

- - - Updated - - -

Hi there, I've necrod this thread yesterday.

7/7 firelands hc
8/8 dragon soul hc
multiclass 2.6k+ arena
"farming" AD+10

Raider.io is shit.

Making claims on the internet 101.

There's a reason I said actual, proven. I could care less that you were a Heroic raider 3 expansions ago, and if you only farm +10 AD, your Raider.IO will be shit. You kinda have to do the other dungeons too...

[Leodric]

While not being someone who pushes high keys (only doing 11-12 max), Raider.io combined with looking how many mythic bosses someone killed provides a very good tool so far to determine if I want to take someone into my group or not.

It's the same issue with people advocating the usage of PL in guilds and the removal of ML. All your problems would be gone if you decide to make your own group/guild or join the groups who don't use the tools you dislike. But of course that takes effort and people wouldn't carry you anymore, sucks .

Also kek at the "arguments" against Raider.io with many being completly wrong.

[neescher]

I’m amazed that of all the posts that agree with me you just attack my posts because let’s face it they are the ones that most elaborately explain how stupid RIO works, how lackluster it is in features and how easily it can be manipulated.

That's because you're wrong 99% of the time. You clearly don't know how rio and the Blizzard leaderboards work.

I don’t mind that you pretend that doing M+ is important, I mean if that’s the maximum content you can do sure it’s important to you, but please spare as that pretentious pseudo-elitist comments that “you are carrying” anyone.

I have 382 gear atm mostly coming from high rated pvp. Even if I had zero (0) rio my gear and understanding of fights would allowed w me to overcome the very basic mechanics.

Stop trying to make it as if affixes make the fights extra hard and you must overcome. Week after week after week it’s the same old mechanics in the same old dungeons responding the exact same way. NOTHING skillful about it. Maybe you have difficulties and mirror them on others but no the dungeons are NOT hard, the mechanivs are mostly anti-afk checks and (funniest of all) players skip at least two of the dungeons namely KR and Shrine.

Oh yeah the same old arguments from PvP players. "PvE is so easy, it's always the same, so boring, just learn encounters and execute, etc. etc. etc".
However every time I have someone with high ilvl PvP gear in my group, one of two things happen:
1) They're instantly removed because the leader had bad experiences with PvP players trying to play PvE
2) They're given a chance to prove themselves, because of those arguments ("pve is so easy lel"). Then they fail horribly at even the easiest mechanics.

I don't say PvP players who are also good PvE players don't exist. I'm just saying I have never seen a player in full PvP gear doing well in PvE content... be it raids or dungeons.

[HuxNeva]

the whole progression system atm prior to 375 is not a great environment in teaching players how to play. There is no point getting irate about Raider.io.

the reason people use it is because item level means nothing these days. someone who has no idea what they are doing can be 370 if they do the warfront enough times. the only way to measure a players skill on the surface level now is by using raider.io / wow prog / parses(to some extent).

back in days gone by there was no TF / Ezmode gear if someone had a particular collection of items in their character you knew they were decent, now newer / less skilled player have access to higher power levels (which i guess is fine) but in doing so blizzard has made ilevel mean very little and so something else has to become the new metric.

It is still exactly the same today if you disregard cross mode gearing (which was the same 'back in the day', you could have high ilvl PvP players that completely would ruin your PuG as they didn't know the first thing about the raid or vice versa)

If you see a raider with 385 ilvl overall, you can be 100% sure that is a Mythic raider. Don't believe me? Check Wow-progress. There's less than 500 players like that in the EU. An occasional high TF happens, but the variance is tuned so that the tiers are still nicely spread out.

What we do have now is that w have more than 1 PVE endgame path. We have M+ and Raiding, and that experience from 1 doesn't necessarily mean you know the other and so just ilvl is not a good signal. You want to know which endgame content that person has experience with. But that is completely another issue and has nothing to do with TF.

[fakaroonie]

I never said I needed a constant flow of randoms. I do add people that I enjoy playing with from time to time.

I largely do Mythic+ with guildmates, but occasionally we need a member and I enjoy using the tool at my disposal.

It really seems like some of you have an irrational problem with this addon. I can't help you.

- - - Updated - - -



Making claims on the internet 101.

There's a reason I said actual, proven. I could care less that you were a Heroic raider 3 expansions ago, and if you only farm +10 AD, your Raider.IO will be shit. You kinda have to do the other dungeons too...

What the hell, so are people THAT entitled nowadays?

"You have to do all the dungeons to get a high score on this site otherwise you shouldn't get invited"

What the fuck is this reasoning ?

Imagine you weren't invited in your first raid becauase you never raided before. You would be stuck doing world quests and that's it. Please acknowledge that it's a messed up system that pretty much sucks the fun out of the game. You want to play with people you know that play good, play with guildies.

Leave the pugs to be pugs ffs. Invite based on ilvl started in wotlk if i remember, or some other shit like that.

And yes, if someone has actually raided 3-4 expansions ago at a high level, means they pretty much know their shit. Probably more than you do.

Jesus, what happened to making a random group and hoping for the best? It's not like people 'throw games' like in multiplayer shooters / mobas. People actually want to team up to complete a dungeon or a raid. Now it's like a douchebag employee who wants you to have 5+ years of experience, when after a simple training you already learn everything there's to know about the project.

Rant over.

[Leodric]

The “Kek you are wrong” arguments are always very helpful when you wonder if to take someone seriously.

I've read the thread and discussing this topic with you is futile. You've proven again and again that you have no idea what you are talking about regarding Raider.Io + others already BTFO you more than once regarding it. Why would I waste my time?

- - - Updated - - -

What the hell, so are people THAT entitled nowadays?

"You have to do all the dungeons to get a high score on this site otherwise you shouldn't get invited"

What the fuck is this reasoning ?

Imagine you weren't invited in your first raid becauase you never raided before. You would be stuck doing world quests and that's it. Please acknowledge that it's a messed up system that pretty much sucks the fun out of the game. You want to play with people you know that play good, play with guildies.

Leave the pugs to be pugs ffs. Invite based on ilvl started in wotlk if i remember, or some other shit like that.

And yes, if someone has actually raided 3-4 expansions ago at a high level, means they pretty much know their shit. Probably more than you do.

Jesus, what happened to making a random group and hoping for the best? It's not like people 'throw games' like in multiplayer shooters / mobas. People actually want to team up to complete a dungeon or a raid. Now it's like a douchebag employee who wants you to have 5+ years of experience, when after a simple training you already learn everything there's to know about the project.

Rant over.

The entitlement is actually wanting to join a group clearly expecting someone of their own skill/experience level, while you don't fulfill the requirement. If I open a group and expect someone to have a 1k+ score then obviously I am only going to invite people having such a score. If you complain not being able to join such a group, then invest the effort to get to it. That's how everyone started by the way, it's not like there is some kind of privileged group which got an amount of score as a gift.
There is nothing wrong with not wanting to push some newbs in m+, why would I need to waste my time helping some random guy push his keys? It makes no sense.

You also say leave the pugs be pugs. Nobody is forcing you to join raider.io groups, there is no criteria set from Blizzard or anyone to only invite people who have a high score, plenty of groups search players without any kind of experience as well and at the end you can always open your own group, which again nobody is stopping you doing so.

[Enkrypt]

What the hell, so are people THAT entitled nowadays?

"You have to do all the dungeons to get a high score on this site otherwise you shouldn't get invited"

What the fuck is this reasoning ?

Nah, the entitlement is thinking you should be able to join my group simply based on your item level. It's not "entitled" to vet peoples' experience and performance in competitive content to assure that MY KEY goes smoothly. People really misuse the word "entitlement". You, on the other, are displaying the feeling that you're entitled to join my +10 just because you're 365 or whatever. In the age of WF/TF, some of the worst players have the highest item level, and I don't trust it, and I'm not risking my key for you.

If you're a 1600 3v3 player trying to join a 2400 team and they say no because you're not skilled/experienced enough, does that also cause you to rant? Because it's the same exact thing, applied to Mythic+ PvE content.

I make random groups with +2-4 keys. I don't check IO for those, and believe or not, people still fuck those up.

[Grimreaper]

You can run every single +10 in time, but no one who has grouped with you in past wants to group with you again? If you are so good, why are you still pugging? Why don't you have a contact list FULL of other great players?

Because i'm a filthy casual who can do maybe 3 mythics at most during a week. I do run them with guildmates, but i would also like to have the opportunity to pug them once in a while. I dont have that opportunity.

No, i dont. Dont tell me that i do.

[Enkrypt]

I've read the thread and discussing this topic with you is futile. You've proven again and again that you have no idea what you are talking about regarding Raider.Io + others already BTFO you more than once regarding it. Why would I waste my time?

27 people could tell this dude he doesn't know what he's talking about, and he'll still think he's right. He doesn't know how the system even works yet prefers to condemn it. But don't disagree with him, he's gonna call the cops on you.

[Leodric]

The entitlment of those people reached really new levels really.

They literaly demand that people are forced to invite them in their group. You cant make that stuff up

That's the majority of WoW nowadays though and Blizzard knows very well. Look at the changes they've made in BFA, it's biting them in the ass though in the long run, very sad indeed.

[HuxNeva]

I have yet to come across an actual, proven skilled player who does +10 or higher keys, raids Mythic, and competes in a 2k rating in PvP who complains about these things. People will claim to fit that description, but then have a stupid reason for hating it like: "I'm anti-social, I want that data kept to myself"

I thought the more common MMO-C excuse was ' I only ever run M+ on the night before reset with 4 other high pop pugs, always, so all of our +17 3 star runs are never recorded'

[Enkrypt]

I’m afraid it’s all sticks and stones to me and no personal attacks will change my mind in what this third party website/addon is. At the same time I feel sorry about the state of the community that does everything in its power to make something nasty out of a game that should be played for enjoyment and not for proving oneself.

Logic hasn't been able to change your mind either. Especially when time and time again, you've proved to this entire thread you don't know what you're talking about. People have calmly tried to explain it to you, but your passive-aggressive attitude tends to make people like me not give a fuck about being nice to you. You're unwilling to accept that you're wrong, and that we have the right to use an addon to keep distance between players like you from joining our groups. Nothing you say will change my mind either, trust me.

And here he goes being wrong again. He feels "sorry" for us. Mythic+ isn't about proving myself to anyone, and neither is Raider.IO. I use Raider.IO to make sure people like you don't mess up my key, so I can keep climbing. And whether you understand it or not, completing a key on time is quite enjoyable for me. I feel sorry for you, honestly, with all these people telling you you're wrong over and over and over but you're over here pretending to be the victim of bullies. Seriously dude, grow up.

Go ahead, let's hear your next strawman argument... I'll wait.

[Leodric]

Why are all the pro-rio posters so rude? Why are all the pro-rio posters so pretentiously pseudo-elitists? Why are all the pro-rio posters so nihilist in their attitude preaching that “hur dur if you don’t like rio you are bad and need a carry”?

My arguments are backed by proof that you choose to ignore. You and your fellow pro-rio posters simply resort to some very abusive personal attacks in a desperate attempt to bully me into silence.

I’m afraid it’s all sticks and stones to me and no personal attacks will change my mind in what this third party website/addon is. At the same time I feel sorry about the state of the community that does everything in its power to make something nasty out of a game that should be played for enjoyment and not for proving oneself.

"Buhuuu, why are all the people such meansies to me?" - the post. Pathethic how you try to gain some sympathy points by playing the victim.

The stuff you throw on my head or any other pro-rio poster here is actually something you do all the time. Also what kind of "very abusive" personal attacks are you talking about? I didn't even quote you and afterwards you piss on my legs expecting no counter?

[Nnyco]

Why are all the pro-rio posters so rude? Why are all the pro-rio posters so pretentiously pseudo-elitists? Why are all the pro-rio posters so nihilist in their attitude preaching that “hur dur if you don’t like rio you are bad and need a carry”?

My arguments are backed by proof that you choose to ignore. You and your fellow pro-rio posters simply resort to some very abusive personal attacks in a desperate attempt to bully me into silence.

I’m afraid it’s all sticks and stones to me and no personal attacks will change my mind in what this third party website/addon is. At the same time I feel sorry about the state of the community that does everything in its power to make something nasty out of a game that should be played for enjoyment and not for proving oneself.

complains about rude insults
uses rude insults himself

nice try tho, you really play a good victim

[Enkrypt]

First of all kindly have the common courtesy to quote me if you refer to me.
Secondly, I think you should reconsider how you address me. Get a hint when it’s offered to you. Start being nice for a change.
Last but not least there are many many complaints about how rio works, there are threads in this very forum where people state they enabled privacy mode and multiple people in this thread have stated why they dislike rio. You obviously like it and that’s fine. HOWEVER: You don’t have any right to throw abuse at strangers just because it’s the internet. You don’t have any right to disrespect and insult others.

I hope you will understand that it’s detrimental for you to continue down the personal insults road.

No thanks. I'll do what I please as long as I abide by the forum rules. You don't dictate my rights, buddy. Full stop.

Just to show how big of a hypocrite you are, I skimmed your previous posts for 2 mins and found these gems. You'll see that a person who says "be nice for a change" is actually an intensely rude person that takes shots at people, but can't handle it when someone fires back.

Im sad when I meet kids like you (I call you a kid because no grown up would be so stuck up). You still seem to struggle with the concepts. So once again for the people with diffuculties like yourself:

My fun and the way I have my fun is MY way. What is easy for me is easy for me noone gives a fuck about your hardships in game or in life.

Its no coincidence that "assuming" contains "ass" in it. Stop assuming stuff mate it makes your posts even more worthless.

I stand corrected. You are a prime example of useless posting in this forum. Putting you on ignore you re not worthy of my attention.

Your ignorance is shocking.

When you want to be taken seriously by other posters, make sure they can't quote you saying stuff like what you wrote above.

Consequently, you do not deserve to be taken seriously and your opinion doesn't matter. You are just jumping into your own conclusions, thinking black/white and ALWAYS others are wrong and you are right. No point to try and reason with you.

Are you really putting so much effort into making a group for a key that doesn't even award higher loot at that point? And literally speaking I find it laughable that players need so much "proven experience" to run such basic mechanics as those of dungeons. I mean I know the average player is a keyboard turning clicker but seriously its just dungeons with some extra "get out of the fire" requirements.

As I said, I don't respect you at all so I can't have a discussion with you. Goodbye.

Your kazzak experience does NOT reflect the average experience and you can only speak for yourself not for others. And no you can’t keep saying “if you get in my shoes you will see how wrong you are”. Well yeah and if you get in my shoes you will see how it is to drive a Porsche. See how stupid this sort of argument is? Really man stop it.

Correct yourself mate you have no rights over me.

So I still don't get what are you so aggravated about. I am right and you are wrong. Get over it.

Oh wait another case of "no Im right and you are wrong"

Just so you know, it's detrimental to your reputation to be this big of a hypocrite. And honestly if I dug deeper, I'd find many, many more instances where you personally attack people for being in disagreement with you. Truth hurts bud. Better get used to it. I want people to know that you're not worth discussing anything with, because you resort to this type of behavior each and every time.

[Great Destiny Man]

What the hell, so are people THAT entitled nowadays?

"You have to do all the dungeons to get a high score on this site otherwise you shouldn't get invited"

What the fuck is this reasoning ?

That's literally the exact opposite of entitlement.