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  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Skildar View Post
    on many topic you can see an answer to that question. Basically it's to avoid making the ele shaman a multi-dot spec.
    Just speculation from players however, Blizzard hasn't given any response.

  2. #82
    1. Lack of Spell interaction.

    We have one proc, Lava Surge and that's it. The rotation is simply not fun.

    2. Useless utility.

    Tremor totem is a wonderful ability that deals with easily avoidable mechanics.
    For rest of shaman utilities there's common issue: "Mage does it better and can still blink"

    3. Negative community perception.

    It's downward spiral: bad class > nobody plays it > no good shamans > noone skilled to show off shaman > less people playing shamans > people not seeing anybody playing shaman > nobody knowing how to play one > extra step > devs stopping to care, because why bother if nobody is here to play that class or give feedback

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by bargh View Post
    no good shamans > noone skilled to show off shaman > less people playing shamans
    Doubt that point because there are always been at least few decent people willing to play "unwanted" specs, those would stand out if the spec would actually do just fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by bargh View Post
    devs stopping to care, because why bother if nobody is here to play that class or give feedback
    The truth is that Blizzard developers never seriously gave a shit about dps Shaman since Wotlk.
    They can blabber all day this "no favorites" drivel, but anyone who buys that after 14 years has not taken a serious look at the "PvE Meta".

    The only people on the dev team that treat Shaman fairly are the people responsible for PvP, in my opinion the ones that are responsible for overall class design / balance are corrupt (for rather biased) as politician in a third world banana republic.

    That aside, a lack of feedback is most certainly not an issue in WoW, at least class design.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2018-12-02 at 01:31 AM.

  4. #84
    Main grievance?

    404: Fun while playing Elemental Shaman not found.
    - Battle for Azeroth is the Michael Bay of WoW expansions -

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Skildar View Post
    on many topic you can see an answer to that question. Basically it's to avoid making the ele shaman a multi-dot spec.
    Feels like this could have been solved through Fulmination tuning like they did with Legion.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Main grievance?

    404: Fun while playing Elemental Shaman not found.
    Yes....they killed pretty much everything fun about elemental shaman from Legion to BFA....like most specs.

    Also getting rid of gust of wind made the spec massively less fun with little in the way of tradeoffs.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Vlaid View Post
    Feels like this could have been solved through Fulmination tuning like they did with Legion.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Yes....they killed pretty much everything fun about elemental shaman from Legion to BFA....like most specs.

    Also getting rid of gust of wind made the spec massively less fun with little in the way of tradeoffs.

    I agree with GoW removal, i miss it dearly. It was a mistake removing it.


    Rest of the negative feedback about ele shaman is hyperbolic and ill-informed.

    Ele in Legion was the easiest, most skilless iteration in history of this game. You guys miss being OP, not the ''smooth and nice gameplay''.

    Most people have issue with FS being on cooldown again. It will be hard for you to accept this, but FS without cooldown is what made ele so brainless in Legion, which invited many fotms to try it out, i suspect.

    Back to the FS cd. It being back on cd is a PvP nerf, and a deserved one. In Legion, the only thing i ever ever casted both on bgs and arenas are Stormkeeper and occasional heal. Just spread the shit out of FS, and get 10-12 back to back LvBs, proceed to destory people with unavoidable damage, all without casting. Combined with the PvP talent Fire and Ice, it was so OP that i simply don't understand how anyone thought it will make it to another expansion.

    If there wasn't for Legion, you would say BfA is the best iteration of ele so far. Besides FS, other shocks don't share cd. Erath shock is much more clearer now on when to cast. Now you have to manage your FS with other shocks, and it feels rewarding (even with only 2 FS rolling, i am already seeing a large number of procs with my gear).


    Other than that, it is basically the same concept since Fulmination was first introduced.

    Ele is still the fun, flashy and procy spec that i felt in love with.

  7. #87
    Cannot comment on endgame, but last weekend picked shaman as next alt to level. Went out, picked up quests, realized flame shock has CD now (who would have come up with that after Legion?), and decideded to level a rogue.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    Ele in Legion was the easiest, most skilless iteration in history of this game. You guys miss being OP, not the ''smooth and nice gameplay''.
    In PvE, Elemental was far from being OP, SK was good AoE Burst after the static Overload change, that was it basically as far as "Elemental is OP" is concerned (altough a handful of specs were still stronger in terms of raw AoE burst).

    Leaving that aside, with Icefury, Elemental was actually reasonably difficult to play, as it led to many moments where you had to manage multiple CD's coming off CD,Lava surge procs, potentially overcapping MS, not wasting any Icefury stacks or using Frost shock w/o 20 MS.

    If the spec was OP, then i'd love to see the top guilds that used Elemental during Legion for their first kill(s), or was it just "community perception" again and Elemental was obviously OP and everybody missed it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    Most people have issue with FS being on cooldown again. It will be hard for you to accept this, but FS without cooldown is what made ele so brainless in Legion, which invited many fotms to try it out, i suspect.
    No, the FS CD and Lvb interaction is flat out awkward for any target switch situation.

    You can argue all day long about the "skill cap" of the FS CD, but unless new targets only appear in 6 second gaps, it creates the very bad situation of not being able to use Lava Burst due FS not being present on a target.

    There's a line between "skill cap" and "just plain awkward", there are plenty of situations where no amount of godlike play prevents this situation.

    You're also free to argue that this is an "intended weakness" but at this point Elemental is already filled with "intended Weaknesses" (such as the lack of mobility and rather bad defense) and has no strengths to offset those.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    Back to the FS cd. It being back on cd is a PvP nerf, and a deserved one. In Legion, the only thing i ever ever casted both on bgs and arenas are Stormkeeper and occasional heal. Just spread the shit out of FS, and get 10-12 back to back LvBs, proceed to destory people with unavoidable damage, all without casting. Combined with the PvP talent Fire and Ice, it was so OP that i simply don't understand how anyone thought it will make it to another expansion.
    This wasn't MoP, FS multidotting was nowhere as strong, especially after the change to Ice & Fire.
    The fact that you even leave out IF entirely when you talk about Elemental PvP in Legion doesn't give me the impression your opinion is educated on the matter.

    Point is, Lvb didn't do a lot of damage, it was just an MS generator.

    If Blizzard wanted to prevent the multi dotting of FS for Lava surge procs, they also could have just limited Lava surge procs to a single FS, rather than letting every FS potentially proc one.

    Leaving that aside, any caster that doesn't have loads of instant casts to apply pressure or insane control, has troubles to be competitive for quite some time now.
    Casters that have to hardcast their spells aren't any good since Legion, a melee train just sits them and they won't do shit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    If there wasn't for Legion, you would say BfA is the best iteration of ele so far.
    Please take into account that even our dear game director flat out admitted that Ele has no significant strength whatsoever and that "there's work left to do".

    The BfA version as of now, is in my opinion on the same level as WoD Elemental, while the ES / FS CD is there, you had things like Spiritwalkers Grace.
    On top of that, Earthquake did actually do bonkers damage with the Earthquake perk and you could really abuse it in some situations, whereas now you don't even have that good burst AoE anymore and your sustained AoE isn't the greatest as well.
    You actually did more a lot more ST damage in AoE / Cleave situations during WoD due to Earthquake.

    And WoD Elemental was by no means a good version of Elemental, that would most likely go to MoP.

    I cannot fathom how anyone can look at a spec that has talents like High Voltage, Exposed Elements or Unlimited Power and say "Well designed".
    And before you say that those are being removed, their replacements (Or most of the ones still left there) aren't exactly better, Surge of Power merely tells you to use your filler after ES and has an outright trap with FS, which should_never_be used.

    BfA Elemental talents feel like a random amalgamation of talents / skills from previous expansion(s), that a previously powerful, thematically fitting and visually impressive spell such as Elemental Blast will deal less damage than your filler in 8.1 shows how little thought went into the talent tree.


    My opinion on your post in general:

    If you think that Elemental was actually OP in PvE during Legion (PvP is a different story) then i have no idea what you even think about Affliction Warlock / Rogue in Legion or DH in BfA.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2018-12-06 at 03:33 PM.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by mysticx View Post
    My biggest grievance is that Elemental feels... so... bloody... slow...

    Almost everything is hard cast, with long-feeling casting times, damage is weak too (Which while you said shouldn't be mentioned is part of the problem) so the long cast times feel unrewarding, too much RNG, when the stars align i can wipe a mob off the face of the planet before it reaches me, if they don't, i'm face-tanking it while tossing sponges at it, and our supposed finisher (Earth shock) has a near-unnoticeable spell effect, which adds to the unrewarding feeling to casting it.
    Sorry, but what is your current amount of stats? Because i can't see where you are coming from. The slowest i feel is when i am fighting 2-3 mobs, since the mastery restriction on CL makes it much weaker.

    With 20-25% haste not being a problem to reach, and with lot of azerite (and enchant proc) effects that grant you temporary haste and Hero, i don't feel ele is slow at all. With two FS rolling (and with IP azerite trait), i feel LvS procs are frequent and impactful, and when i need to move i either refresh FS, use FrS, maybe a pooled ES.

    Opinion about RNG is subjective, but i am purposley rocking Aftershock no matter the content. It is so mch fun to get multiple ES and EQ procs, especially the latter on trash.

    Regarding how ele preforms in general, i think people are giving it a lot less credit then it deserves.

    In open world, i feel ele is powerful, but WM and PvP talents are required to make it to the full potential. In Mythic+ i think ele is amazing on large aoe, decent in single and subpar in 2-3 target cleave. I adore the utility tho - knockback from EQ, purge, solid short ofhealing if needed, best interrupt, can save from wipes with Earth Ele, AoE stun (which is far more valuable in BfA then in Legion, since a lot of them were removed). I also think ele is decent at priority killing with pooled Earth SHock, and if Aftershock procs, it can 2 shot (think of the second boss in Temple of Seth, when the knot ability really starts to hurt, in general BfA dungeons have a lot of priority adds), but since Mythic+ is evidently dictated by streamers, as we currently have 10 specs considered good and others are considered trash.

    I wouldn't mind some damage being shifted from fire ele to our spells, but i don't at all think ele is a bad spec at all.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    My opinion on your post in general:

    If you think that Elemental was actually OP in PvE during Legion (PvP is a different story) then i have no idea what you even think about Affliction Warlock / Rogue in Legion or DH in BfA.
    I don't think Ele was OP in Legion PvE, and about the Aff locks - i think they are the most OP spec in history of WoW for PvE, simply because of the inherent nature of being a full multi dot spec.

    About the IF thing, i left it out by mistake - ofc i was running it, and yes it was OP, since the cast was not that hard to get off (we have 3 schools available) and it was followed by 4 strong damaging instant Frost Shocks, which also slowed the target. With zero resource cost, and nothing to pay attention to since you could just FS and ES freely aswell (also, you forgot to mention how ES was stacking up REALLY fast, so yes, multidotting was effective). Also LvB didn't hit like a truck, but it did hit decent while also being instant and frequent - like i said, the back-to-back procs were insane.

    About the talents: i agree many talents need rework. Why on earth is is Earthen rage still a thing, i don't know. Stormkeeper whould have been made baseline.

    But i also think not all of them are bad - High Voltage and Unlimited power were obviously designed with higher amount of stats on mind. Exposed Elements encourages more ''weaving'' gameplay, which some people love.

    Discussing worst states of ele, i don't know if you played first half of Cata, but THAT was so weak, that people today would kill themselves (and not this ele is 10% bellow top dps bullcrap) if ele were like that. WoD was also really bad, and i actually didn't play the majority of the expansion due to that reason, later playing Enh (giving our iconic mastery to everyone, and having spells that actually did feel like wet noodles). Even in MoP, it took some serious buffing (most notably the 25% buff to LvB during IoT patch, which turned ele to 'can kill in 3 globals' spec overnight).

    So really, in 9 years of playing ele, BfA is nowehere near it's worst version. Like i said, the only thing i really miss is GoW.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    I don't think Ele was OP in Legion PvE
    Then perhaps choose your words more carefully next time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    You guys miss being OP, not the ''smooth and nice gameplay''.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    the back-to-back procs were insane.
    They really were not, unless the target was already super low.
    Overall Damage from Elemental was rather predictable in Legion, as it was tied to IF,ES and SK primarily, all of them are trackable by your opponent.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    But i also think not all of them are bad - High Voltage and Unlimited power were obviously designed with higher amount of stats on mind.
    Not really, the gain from these talents are barely noticeable as far as gameplay is concerned.
    UP is in terms of numbers not that bad, but whether i have 2-6% Haste for some time has just no big impact on the overall flow.
    Neither does High Voltage significantly boost my MS generation, it's just there.

    They are basically another version of Totem Mastery, which is nummerically speaking the best talent, but has absolutely no impact on your playstyle or flow of the rotation because it provides 4 small passive buffs that just add up to be the best talent.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    Exposed Elements encourages more ''weaving'' gameplay, which some people love.
    What do you "weave" exactly?
    The talent boosts the next LB, which happens to be my filler, there isn't even a neccessity to press LB right after ES, you just need to press LB once before you hit the next ES, which is always bound to happens unless you specced into Aftershock (which most people don't as it worse than TM).

    Or do you press your buttons in a different order if you specced into Exposed Elements?
    Probably not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    i don't know if you played first half of Cata, but THAT was so weak that people today would kill themselves (and not this ele is 10% bellow top dps bullcrap) if ele were like that.
    I did, however your point was not that BfA Ele is the worst version, or not?

    You said above, it is "the best version", so i obviously argued about that, what the worst version was, is pretty irrelevant.

    However, remember what happened during the second tier of Cata?
    Lightning bolt on the move happened.
    Perma Fire Ele happened.

    What does Elemental get for the second tier of BfA?
    Oh well, best not compare that.

    To this day, mid / late Cata is still regarded as one of the better phases to have played Elemental.


    Sorry, but backtracking from "The best iteration" to "Not the worst one" is a rather big shift.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2018-12-06 at 04:30 PM.

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Then perhaps choose your words more carefully next time.

    ...

    Sorry, but backtracking from "The best iteration" to "Not the worst one" is a rather big shift.

    I didn't say BfA is the best iteration of ele ever...i I also think MoP was ele at it's best. Even tho MoP is my favourite expansion, i still think that today it is viewed trough rose tinted glasses - back then, the number one complaint was the abubdance of spells, everyone could do anything - people WANTED pruning.


    What i was saying is that, judging by the things people bring up, BfA ele design is an improvement over all previos iterations, up to Legion, considering the main focus is on FS cooldown, which was not a thing before Legion, but other things, which we grew to love, are present (instant chain lightning, instant EQ, more frequent Lava Surge procs, shocks not sharing a cd, and i would say even tho it's RNG,i am happy the Aftershock mechanic is still present).

    I've already stated that FS having a cd was a PvP nerf, due to all the reasons i wrote in the first post. Would you be happier if FS had no cd, but was limited to 2-3 targets?

    Going back to Cata...LB on the move, while it was fun, wasn't really that impactful since LB did (and still does, until 8.1) pathetic damage. It's role as being a on the move filler has been switched to LvS procs and frost shock. Perma fire ele was a broken set bonus, which carried ele...i don't know, but that doesn't seem like a healthy design to mee. Also, if i recall correctly, Lava surge was not a thing untill MoP (in Cata, it was a set bonus?).


    While i agree numbers should use some adjustment, and our damage should be shifted out of fire ele (or scrap the pet alltogether, i wouldn't mind), thematically, visually and gameplay i think ele is fine. And, IMHO it strenghts should be single target dps and mass aoe. Cleave and spread adds can remain weaker, as long as the encounters are diverse and let every spec and their ''niche'' shine.

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    the number one complaint was the abubdance of spells, everyone could do anything - people WANTED pruning.
    No it wasn't.
    Pruning was still a massively controversial move.

    And that didn't fix the homogenization of classes, as they mainly removed rarely used spells or backed them into other spells.

    The only thing they changed in that regard was to remove Kil'jadens cunning and Lightning bolt on the move, Penance and Scorch are still castable while moving to this day.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    I didn't say BfA is the best iteration of ele ever...i I also think MoP was ele at it's best.
    Didn't you earlier say that without Legion, BfA would be the best iteration?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    I've already stated that FS having a cd was a PvP nerf, due to all the reasons i wrote in the first post.
    To be honest, no one knows the reason for that nerf.
    Blizzard didn't communicate, for the most part of BfA's Beta, Lvb did not require FS to crit, then a few builds before 8.0, the interaction was back in place.

    That would have obviously solved the issue, but i guess that wasn't to Blizzards liking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    Would you be happier if FS had no cd, but was limited to 2-3 targets?
    Sure, why not.
    It's the same number of FS you can keep up already, just staggered and you can actually switch on target without massive issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    Going back to Cata...LB on the move, while it was fun, wasn't really that impactful since LB did (and still does, until 8.1) pathetic damage. It's role as being a on the move filler has been switched to LvS procs and frost shock.
    You do realize that 80% of your time spent (hard)casting was in fact LB?
    So you pretty much do 80% of your total damage while moving.

    Now try that on live, move around and just spam FS,FrS and Lava surge procs, the result is nowhere near the same in comparison.

    Thanks to Spiritwalkers grace, you could even fully move during Ascendance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    gameplay i think ele is fine. And, IMHO it strenghts should be single target dps and mass aoe.
    Strengths are part of the gameplay, because it was obviously fun to nuke SK into a group of mobs.

    If you mean by "mass AoE" lots of targets, then that will unlikely ever be a niche, because of the target limit of CL and its hardly a useful one.
    And generally, "Mass AoE" is a thing for DoT related classes or ones with huge ass CD's, such as Frost DK.

    I'd rather go back and shift loads of damage back into CL, so Ele can be really strong in a 2-5 Target situation, because that makes absolut sense due the target cap of CL.
    Or let Lvb jump as well, perhaps to up to 3 targets.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2018-12-06 at 07:23 PM.

  13. #93
    I agree with all of the points Kralljin is making, its been a pretty good read. I rerolled to Ele as my main for 8.1 and have been 120 for about 3 weeks now. My biggest gripes so far is the Flame Shock CD. Lower health than other classes. If Elemental Blast and Ice Fury become the goto talents. I feel like the rotation is going to get super clunky.

    Overall, I find Ele fun to play, but If were going to be a turret spec we need the damage to go with it and right now the numbers arent there.

  14. #94
    Nalaadu there were more complexities in Ele's rotation during Legion than BFA by a mile.

    - In between every frost shock from IF you had to make sure you had a 2p buff up.
    - Make sure that during your unload of IF and double ES you had an EB buff or two up.
    - You had power of the maelstrom you would line up with either SK, pot, priority target with increased damage, etc.
    - Furthermore you had a 10% buff to your next spell cast that would snapshot with flame shock.
    - And if you did get an overload proc, you always wanted to keep a LvB ready for the increased damage it provided to your ES. This was while keeping enough to spare from IF.
    - Finally if you're running shoulders and boots you needed to try and keep yet another LvB for the Earthquake procs.

    Our Current Passives:
    - Elemental fury: Crits deal 250% damage instead of 200%
    - Lava Surge: FS has the chance to make LvB instant cast
    - Reincarnation: 30 minute self Brez

    What made Ele fun to me in Legion was the extreme complexity. I try and play as many casters as I can at a mythic level and in Legion Ele was by far the most difficult to play optimally, which was a fun goal to strive towards.

    We retained almost nothing from Legion that keeps the class fun and interesting and that coupled with the fact that we bring some of the worst damage in Uldir makes the spec unbearable to play. My favorite spec in the game thematically, and I get to swap over to be a purge-bitch on Zul, but that's the extent of play my shaman will get until Blizzard takes their blindfold off.

  15. #95
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marani View Post
    I'm missing Gust of Wind, apart from that I find 2-3 target cleave a bit lacking. You would think that we'd be good at it with Chain Lightning as one of our most iconic spells, but it's just really underwhelming.
    That's because Chain Lightning is 'balanced' around hitting all five targets. If it did diminishing damage with each bounce as it used to it could be a strong cleave spell while also being worth casting in full AoE situations (to build to Earthquakes and for its own damage).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    I agree with GoW removal, i miss it dearly. It was a mistake removing it.


    Rest of the negative feedback about ele shaman is hyperbolic and ill-informed.

    Ele in Legion was the easiest, most skilless iteration in history of this game. You guys miss being OP, not the ''smooth and nice gameplay''.
    Not everyone who is unhappy with Elemental wants to revert to Legion. Nor was it OP in Legion.

    Me, I want something more like end-of-Cata or mid-late Mists. Mobile Lightning Bolt and Spiritwalker's Grace (though I'd trade one of those for Gust of Wind), serious Chain Lightning damage via fast ChL casts (and with the GCD cap now being less than 1s, there's no need for a slow ChL to avoid GCD capping, not that that was nearly as terrible a thing as some people said it was), Lava Bursts that hit hard. Better defensives (i.e. having two of them, one usable when stunned).

    If there wasn't for Legion, you would say BfA is the best iteration of ele so far. Besides FS, other shocks don't share cd. Erath shock is much more clearer now on when to cast. Now you have to manage your FS with other shocks, and it feels rewarding (even with only 2 FS rolling, i am already seeing a large number of procs with my gear).
    Nope. Decoupled shocks is nice, but the rest is just awful.

  16. #96
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rawfury View Post
    -RNG = more RNG = more RNG = more RNG in about every talent and passive. We just need more 'straight to the point' damage skills
    -Multi-targeting/dotting is a problem. Why is our one dot even dispellable(thats a word right) for pvp?

    just a few
    It used to be that if you dispelled it I believe the shaman got a haste buff....why they did away with that is beyond me. I think all dots should be dispellable but if it is a key mechanic dot then it needs some kind of protection. In this case there should be a cost for removing the dot. Also with the addition of adding a CD to it, it really does need a dispell protection mechanic added in.

  17. #97
    Main grievances atm are.

    - meteor range. fire elemental can hit boss but can't use meteor without repositioning.
    - storm/fire elemental not resetting after a wipe.

    Besides that, elemental is very badly designed spec and developers have no clue what to do with it. eg ascendance, lavabeam, elemental blast etc...

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by woopytywoop View Post
    Besides that, elemental is very badly designed spec and developers have no clue what to do with it. eg ascendance, lavabeam, elemental blast etc...
    You mispelled forgotten.

    Besides, in my opinion, unless Ascendance also transforms ES / EQ or Ascendance blocks out MS generation entirely in favour of extremely boosting Lvb / Lava Beam, Ascendance should remain in the ditch, pressing ES / EQ during Ascendance feels awful, especially with Aftershock.

    Stormkeeper is strong and they made it pretty much "baseline", not the best solution but most certainly preferable to the 8.0 situation.

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalaadu View Post
    I agree with GoW removal, i miss it dearly. It was a mistake removing it.


    Rest of the negative feedback about ele shaman is hyperbolic and ill-informed.

    Ele in Legion was the easiest, most skilless iteration in history of this game. You guys miss being OP, not the ''smooth and nice gameplay''.

    Most people have issue with FS being on cooldown again. It will be hard for you to accept this, but FS without cooldown is what made ele so brainless in Legion, which invited many fotms to try it out, i suspect.

    Back to the FS cd. It being back on cd is a PvP nerf, and a deserved one. In Legion, the only thing i ever ever casted both on bgs and arenas are Stormkeeper and occasional heal. Just spread the shit out of FS, and get 10-12 back to back LvBs, proceed to destory people with unavoidable damage, all without casting. Combined with the PvP talent Fire and Ice, it was so OP that i simply don't understand how anyone thought it will make it to another expansion.

    If there wasn't for Legion, you would say BfA is the best iteration of ele so far. Besides FS, other shocks don't share cd. Erath shock is much more clearer now on when to cast. Now you have to manage your FS with other shocks, and it feels rewarding (even with only 2 FS rolling, i am already seeing a large number of procs with my gear).


    Other than that, it is basically the same concept since Fulmination was first introduced.

    Ele is still the fun, flashy and procy spec that i felt in love with.
    Well I think you are massively exaggerating the issues with Legion Ele, which as I said could have been solved through fulmination tuning so the trade off was more meaningful and spamming 0 fulmination flame shocks wasn't viable. It would be perfectly fine to me if they removed the CD from Flame shock but changed it so that it could only be active on one target at a time, Ele doesn't need to be a multi-dot spec in the least, even the marginal way it is in BFA.

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