Bull Market officially over!! Year heading negative.

[Zan15]

Apple reported strong revenue of its internet service sector (iCloud, Apple Pay, App Store, etc.) which more than make up its iPhone losses. To put it into perspective, total size of Apple service sector is twice that of AWS and Netflix. It is a huge money making machine. Apple is preparing to shift to its own main processors in Mac computers, replacing Intel chips, which could lead to long-term sustained profit margin improvement. Apple 5G iPhone premiere in third quarter 2020 is highly anticipated. Not only in the US, but globally.

Etc.

No idea why apple is doing the processor dance again.
Maybe the 11th time is the charm?

Out of the gate they always start strong with a current processor then they have problems keeping up with the constant cycle of competition and chip improvements.
They are dealing with monsters of capital spending that is almost 100% on processors.

Apple could keep up but it would be so very costly.
Even Intel got leap frogged (surprisingly and unpredicted) on their small component processors and desktop type processors by companies like AMD.

I can't imagine they can continue to provide capital spending and huge profits on processors if they can't get any other clients other than themselves.

[Rasulis]

No idea why apple is doing the processor dance again.
Maybe the 11th time is the charm?

Out of the gate they always start strong with a current processor then they have problems keeping up with the constant cycle of competition and chip improvements.
They are dealing with monsters of capital spending that is almost 100% on processors.

Apple could keep up but it would be so very costly.
Even Intel got leap frogged (surprisingly and unpredicted) on their small component processors and desktop type processors by companies like AMD.

I can't imagine they can continue to provide capital spending and huge profits on processors if they can't get any other clients other than themselves.

From what I understand, the bolded above is the reason why. Intel development has grown stagnant. As it is, Apple is already starting to design their own iPhone chips and graphic chips which are currently provided by Qualcomm and Imagination Technologies. It will probably give Apple more negotiating power also.

[Zan15]

Personally I would not consider what the retail traders are doing in Robinhood as investing. More speculation akin to gambling at Las Vegas. I took a quick look at the top stocks bought at Robinhood traders in May according to Robintrack. Many are headscratchers. Luckin Coffee? WTH! Nikola Corp? Its market cap now is higher than Ford or Fiat Chrysler despite not having sold a single electric car. Hertz is going bankrupt. Draftking lost 68M first quarter of 2020.

A lot of those investments, unless they get out at the right time, is going to cost their investors a lot of money. Many of those companies are not even going to have positive ledger well until late 2021. Maybe even 2022.

Could it be the W stock market everyone was talking about but started to discount??



Did you look at those people who are stuck with those stocks?? Or how many retail investors are stuck with the bag full of nothing companies?

All those 1200 dollar checks propped up the market for the few who were smart enough to get out and for professional traders to get in and get out with a good profit instead of gambling for triple digits.

And they don't know how to cut their losses.
Does robinhood even allow for things like limits, stop gaps, etc etc??


Take this for example:
https://www.robintrack.net/symbol/GNUS

at the peak 147,000 accounts were invested in GNUS @ 7.00
Today 171,000 accounts were invested @3.2 Down another 24% today.


145,000 additional accounts invested in American airlines @16.50 +. Now it dropping like a brick @ 14.66-14.90

On 6/8 hertz went from 90k holders to 160k. price tanked 5.60 to sub 2.00.


It just seems like it became organized gambling like you said.



Damn good thing I got out of Citibank, its back below 50 from 62 in a matter of days.

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From what I understand, the bolded above is the reason why. Intel development has grown stagnant. As it is, Apple is already starting to design their own iPhone chips and graphic chips which are currently provided by Qualcomm and Imagination Technologies. It will probably give Apple more negotiating power also.

Ya intel dropped the ball because they thought AMD was near dead. They became too complacent.

But I am just worried that apple has spent years making the best they can, blowing their wad then they will lose interest again and drop out of the processor/secondary controller market.

its almost like they do this so for the next 5-7 years they can negotiate amazing deal by saying "don't make us build our own chips again"

[Breccia]

Remember when "DOWn 1700" was news? It's barely denting the headlines.

Oh, and pretty sure that's 2017 territory now. Thread's title back in full force.

[Zan15]

Remember when "DOWn 1700" was news? It's barely denting the headlines.

Oh, and pretty sure that's 2017 territory now. Thread's title back in full force.

but but I was told this thread would not age well....


I am sure its on foxnews.com


hmm...finance...nope...personal finance...nope....Your money...nope...hmmmm its gotta be somewhere....


maybe soon.....

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Geeze we are back to the crazy last 30 minute status again, I was enjoying not having to watch the carnage for the last month and a half...

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oh i am sure Oan has details on the drop of the markets

umm, nope...nope and nope....

under business they have

Wall Street hammered by fears of spurt in virus infections, economic worries

lol no details or numbers in the title...

[Breccia]

lol no details or numbers in the title

If it ends right now, it's the 4th biggest drop in points, but just shy of the top 20 biggest percentage drops, of all time.

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Oh, right, forgot to mention: the 4th highest drop in all time, is the lowest "since March".

At time of writing, the biggest number drops of the DOW are March, March, March, March, March, Feb, Feb, Feb, Feb, April.

Yes, this year.

While the increasing nature of DOW numbers meant Trump was probably going to have the top/bottom 10 anyhow, it's worth noting that every record-breaking gain he has, he has a record-breaking drop that's bigger. Trump is a net loser.

[Zan15]

If it ends right now, it's the 4th biggest drop in points, but just shy of the top 20 biggest percentage drops, of all time.

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Oh, right, forgot to mention: the 4th highest drop in all time, is the lowest "since March".

At time of writing, the biggest number drops of the DOW are March, March, March, March, March, Feb, Feb, Feb, Feb, April.

Yes, this year.

While the increasing nature of DOW numbers meant Trump was probably going to have the top/bottom 10 anyhow, it's worth noting that every record-breaking gain he has, he has a record-breaking drop that's bigger. Trump is a net loser.

Ya the only record he cant break is #1 because the market automatically closes at -20% now for the day...so its a record that will never be broken.

[Breccia]

Ya the only record he cant break is #1 because the market automatically closes at -20% now for the day...so its a record that will never be broken.

It truly boggles the mind how he broke records set in October 1929.

Twice.

And still thinks he's doing a good job. Incidentally, I caught his earlier tweet where he was sobbing in a corner, bawling like a child "PLEASE DOW GO BACK UP PLEASE PLEASE PLUH-PLUH-PLUH-EEEEASE" In that CNN poll he challenged on the basis of he didn't like it, he's ahead of Biden in the economy...barely. And that was before yet another record broken.

This is set to be #4 worst point drop ever, could be #3 with just a little push.

[Rasulis]

Remember when "DOWn 1700" was news? It's barely denting the headlines.

Oh, and pretty sure that's 2017 territory now. Thread's title back in full force.

The sectors that gained the most, ended up losing the most.

Oil & Gas Equipment and Services -12.28%
Oil, Gas & Consumable Fuels -8.88%
Banks -9.64%
Aerospace & Defense -8.86%
Airlines -14.3%

Funny thing about airline stocks. Somebody in the Oval Office mentioned that Warren Buffet was wrong for dumping BH airline stocks. That comment does not age well at all.

Yowza. Every single airline stocks experienced double digit losses in a single day. Spirit Airline which ranked in the top 10 Robinhood holding lost 17.5% today and a total of 37.5% since Monday.

[Breccia]

That comment does not age well at all.

Speaking of, I updated the earlier graph.



That is how little the world of economics values the word of Donald "John as in he hired a hooker" Trump.

[Rasulis]

Speaking of, I updated the earlier graph.



That is how little the world of economics values the word of Donald "John as in he hired a hooker" Trump.

Lol.

Anyway, if anybody is looking for a long-term investment stock. I highly recommend DocuSign. It is probably a bit overbought right now. However, in 10 years I think it will be worth at least 10 times over. Unlike the video teleconferencing market which is pretty crowded, DocuSign has no competition in the legal document field. Every single contracts, purchase orders and task orders I signed this year were done through DocuSign.

[Omega10]

Guess as it turns out robinhood traders are driving much of these mega movement stocks.
they have forums and a site dedicated to show where the herd is moving next.

they are organizing huge pump and dump actions.

crazy its like the penny stock craze of the 1990s all over again.

Chesepeak opened at 18....after closing at 68. sitting around 20-25 right now.

a lot of those "robinhood" folks lost their shirts

its almost like a pyramid scheme and only the people who got in at the start are making the money

This was one heck of a pump and dump activity. I did not expect the dump part of it (the part where they cash in their profits) to be done is so little time.

[Zan15]

This was one heck of a pump and dump activity. I did not expect the dump part of it (the part where they cash in their profits) to be done is so little time.

problem is...it seems like a lot of the people who were pumping all got caught in the lock period overnight when trading was halted after the bankruptcy charges.

all those after market hour sale request were not processed till open and by then it dropped to 18 from 60.


waiting for Citibank again around 40 to jump back into the market
I will just keep playing this bank for the next year

[Breccia]

I did not expect the dump part of it to be done is so little time.

The Fed's warning was a wake-up call. They realized how little time they had left. The party's over and the last one to leave gets stuck with the check.

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Dow tanks 1,861 points as stocks post worst session since March

U.S. equity markets plunged Thursday with the selloff accelerating in the final hour of trading as investors reacted to a resurgence in COVID-19 infections as more states reopened and also after the Federal Reserve warned of a slower economic recovery.

The Dow Jones Industrial Average fell 1,861 points or 6.9 percent, the fourth worst one-day point drop on record. The S&P 500 and the Nasdaq Composite sank 5.89 percent and 5.27 percent, respectively. The selling marked the sharpest one-day decline for the major averages since March 16.

All of the S&P's sectors fell, led by financials, energy and materials. Oil took a sharp turn lower with West Texas Intermediate crude oil sliding 8.23 percent to $36.34 a barrel.

The major averages finished mixed on Wednesday, with the Nasdaq closing above 10,000 for the first time, after the Federal Reserve said interest rates would remain near zero through 2022 to support the economic recovery.

President Trump, a frequent critic of the central bank who has long pushed for low-interest rates, nonetheless disputed the Fed's prediction that the comeback would be prolonged; he promised Twitter followers an upswing as soon as this fall.

In the meantime, initial jobless claims for the week through June 6 totaled 1.5 million, the government said Thursday, boosting the total number of job losses to 45 million since the shutdowns began in mid-March.

Meanwhile, Arizona and Texas were among the states that saw the number of new COVID-19 cases hit a fresh high on Wednesday while others, like California and Florida, saw infection counts near their previous peaks.

Mouseover that link to see where I found it. Seeing that source post this article, I think my own stock futures have peaked, AHWINK

[Omega10]

The Fed's warning was a wake-up call. They realized how little time they had left. The party's over and the last one to leave gets stuck with the check.

I guess the Fed's warning was as good an excuse as any to get Wall Street out of their record breaking Wall Street bull market while the US is in a recession scenario.

The oil market has turned out quite interesting.

Originally: YAY GOOD ON TRUMP he got the rest of the world to cut back on oil production so WE CAN HAVE HIGHER OIL PRICES.

Oil rises to mid 30s.

Rest of the World: STOP. No further increases.

Basically, the US taught the world that if oil goes over $50, then the US will dramatically ramp up oil production and take all of the profits from this.

Oil went down to teens, and the US was successful in negotiating Saudi Arabia and Russia into production cuts without any US cuts. But at these low prices, the US can't profitably drill for oil and US production fell by quite a bit anyways.

Peak Oil DID come to the US. We don't HAVE any $30 a barrel oil left. It did not come to Russia or Saudi Arabia, not for quite a while.

So what we taught them is that for them to maximize their profits, they need oil to be between $35 and $45 a barrel. Enough for them to make good profit, not enough for the US to do so. I suspect that this will be the new trading range.

[Kasierith]

problem is...it seems like a lot of the people who were pumping all got caught in the lock period overnight when trading was halted after the bankruptcy charges.

all those after market hour sale request were not processed till open and by then it dropped to 18 from 60.


waiting for Citibank again around 40 to jump back into the market
I will just keep playing this bank for the next year

People with minimal knowledge of stocks who only got into it during march get screwed over for putting heavy in moderate-high risk plays at the behest of those much more knowledgeable than them? Color me pikachu faced.

Personally I sold heavy on any stocks I don't want long term Monday morning once I got the slightest whiff that this week might be turning

[Rasulis]

I guess the Fed's warning was as good an excuse as any to get Wall Street out of their record breaking Wall Street bull market while the US is in a recession scenario.

The oil market has turned out quite interesting.

Originally: YAY GOOD ON TRUMP he got the rest of the world to cut back on oil production so WE CAN HAVE HIGHER OIL PRICES.

Oil rises to mid 30s.

Rest of the World: STOP. No further increases.

Basically, the US taught the world that if oil goes over $50, then the US will dramatically ramp up oil production and take all of the profits from this.

Oil went down to teens, and the US was successful in negotiating Saudi Arabia and Russia into production cuts without any US cuts. But at these low prices, the US can't profitably drill for oil and US production fell by quite a bit anyways.

Peak Oil DID come to the US. We don't HAVE any $30 a barrel oil left. It did not come to Russia or Saudi Arabia, not for quite a while.

So what we taught them is that for them to maximize their profits, they need oil to be between $35 and $45 a barrel. Enough for them to make good profit, not enough for the US to do so. I suspect that this will be the new trading range.

OPEC+ keen to keep U.S. shale in check as oil prices rally

Now that crude has rallied on the back of those cuts from below $20 a barrel to $40 or more, the group known as OPEC+ faces a fresh challenge: stopping U.S. shale production delivering another surprise by recovering equally quickly.

“The plan is to stick to prices of $40-$50 per barrel because as soon as they rise any further to say $70 per barrel it encourages too much oil production, including U.S. shale,” said a Russian source familiar with OPEC+ talks on the issue.

OPEC+ sources told Reuters on Wednesday that Russia and Saudi Arabia had reached a compromise to extend into July the group’s existing output cuts of 9.7 million barrels per day (bpd), the equivalent of 10% of global output.

Those deep cuts had been due to be implemented in just May and June, before curbs were to be slowly eased.

Concerns about a resurgence of U.S. shale, which is already showing signs of revival, was one reason Moscow and Russia only backed prolonging cuts into July rather than agreeing a longer extension, two sources briefed on OPEC+ talks said.

OPEC and its partners have in the past set out policy for several months at least, but JPMorgan’s Christyan Malek said the month-by-month approach was a “lesser of the evils” as global demand picks up after crashing due to the coronavirus crisis.

“Saudi and Russia are in damage control mode. It is not only about measuring demand. It is also about tracking U.S. shale on a month-by-month basis in order not to allow shale to rebound back quickly,” he said.

In recent years, even as OPEC+ cut output to support prices, U.S. production of crude and other liquids surged, soaring to 20 million bpd. But, with breakeven for shale oil producers around $50-$70 a barrel, this year’s price collapse sent U.S. output down by as much as 2 million bpd in April by some estimates.

Global oil demand, which tumbled by as much as a third in April, has been recovering slowly with the easing lockdown measures. Demand is expected to exceed supply in June.

But global inventories are still bulging, after 1 billion barrels of oil was pumped into storage when producers struggled to find buyers.

“The market is very fluid and given the uncertainty around the trajectory of demand recovery versus the risks of a second wave of the virus, OPEC has to be nimble,” said Amrita Sen, co-founder of Energy Aspects.

“By doing this month-by-month, they keep everyone on their toes, making it difficult for others to invest,” she said.

It looks like oil states will have to find another source of revenue.

[Omega10]

OPEC+ keen to keep U.S. shale in check as oil prices rally



It looks like oil states will have to find another source of revenue.

Interesting article. One way to interpret this is:

In the negotiations between the US, Saudi Arabia and Russia let Trump "win", but in a way that allows Saudi Arabia and Russia to control oil prices without input from the US. And they are allied with each other, at least on this issue, far more than they are with the US.

Trump is perfect for the Saudi Arabian - Russian alliance. Trump props up the fossil fuel industry, weakening the US since it diverts tens of billions of dollars to a business model that does not work for the US, and slows down our progress in renewables. This both minimizes the competition to Saudi Arabian - Russian oil and also maximizes how much fossil fuels the US consumes. The US does the sacrificing for the good of the Saudi Arabia - Russia alliance.

[Zaydin]

So did a reality bomb finally hit Wall Street?

[Omega10]

So did a reality bomb finally hit Wall Street?

It seems that Wall Street bet on reopening America working, with the virus conceding defeat and going away. When it didn't, they themselves conceded defeat by making massive amounts of profit by selling their stocks for a lot of profit.

They bought Boeing at 150 or so before, it went up to 260, so they sold it and made a huge amount of money.