(Loot Box's) Number of child gamblers quadruples in just two years....

[Logwyn]

I still have yet to hear a good argument other than you have a physical item so it's OK.

Are these boxes guaranteed to give you the same value as you pay for them? Like if you box costs you 20 dollars you will get 20 dollars of stuff 100% but with the chance to get more than 20 in some boxes?

That's the only thing I can think of that makes it not gambling.

[luciano]

Yeah because cancer warnings sure as hell work against smokers.

Never underestimate "Im special so it won't happen to me" mindset.

Actually, cigarette cancer warnings result in more smokers quitting. The better the message, the more effective its results.

Here's a study to read up on: https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...1212105317.htm

Key point: "Among the smokers who viewed the text-only labels, 7.4% of smokers attempted to quit in the subsequent five weeks. Those who viewed the testimonial photos from real smokers, however, had a quit attempt rate of 15.4% -- roughly double -- and were four times as likely to have been successful."

In other words: they work.

[Varvara Spiros Gelashvili]

I don't really mind loot boxes, I really don't get the big deal. The only change I'd make is combing loot boxes with direct purchases. Also parent should watch there kids better and this is also what refunds are for.

[Onikaroshi]

In actual casinos, yes it's illegal. Would you stop your kid from "gambling" in Chuck E Cheese or Dave&Buster's? Would you prevent them from buying any TCG booster pack? That is the equivalent of in game loot boxes as neither of them award money (which casinos and lottery games do).

That's the kind of messy "slippery slope" I worry about with these things... where does it end?

Let the ratings boards handle it, not the gov't, gov't always fucks it up.

[Varvara Spiros Gelashvili]

I often leave my card surrounded by turrets to ensure no one ever sneaks around while I'm sleeping to take it.

Kids aren't stupid, and you shouldn't expect people to actively hide their card to ensure its not found.

If this is true a refund should be triggered.

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Loot boxes only need to exist because 95% of the content that is made to fill them is dogshit.

If companies had to sell those items on their own merits, they wouldn't sell. So instead they have people gamble so they can feel like they won something even when everything else was shit... Which is what the gambling addicts mindset is. "Who cares if I lost 90% of the time, that 10% is THRILLING!"

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People use rubbing alcohol
People use alcohol in mouth wash
People use alcohol to eat honey buns
People use alcohol to clean

Stop being a fucking alcoholic 4head use moderation 4head

Nah they fill the loot boxes to extend the content. There is more than enough things worth a direct purchase. It's just about getting more for less.

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Yeah, I agree, that's why this sort mechanic should impact the game rating.

You can still play them, just as kids can still play them as long as the parents assume the responsibility and buy it for them, you just have to ignore the warnings.

It should be marked on the box of the game or on the website in big bright fucking letters honestly. Educating parents is always a good thing. I would also legally force them to have direct purchases as well. So you can gamble and save money or just buy what you want no risk.

The hammer should come down on companies that enforce loot box purchases only though.

[Jester Joe]

If this is true a refund should be triggered.

Why, the turrets were a good investment.

And I'm sure you could chargeback the card or ticket a refund yeah, but the point is the behavior is still encouraged at that point either way, regardless.

[Orange Joe]

Yeah, life is a gamble anyway, do everything, as long as you know moderation! It’s exactly what daddy told me when I was just a boy, right before giving me some pocket money and sending me to the local underground casino to play some blackjack, snort some coke and do some hookers, all of course, in great moderation, those were the days…

Not sure why you think hyperbole will help your point any?

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People use rubbing alcohol
People use alcohol in mouth wash
People use alcohol to eat honey buns
People use alcohol to clean

Stop being a fucking alcoholic 4head use moderation 4head

Your post makes literally 0 sense.

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Why, the turrets were a good investment.

And I'm sure you could chargeback the card or ticket a refund yeah, but the point is the behavior is still encouraged at that point either way, regardless.

Honest question. What is the best way to teach someone how to handle something?

[Jester Joe]

Honest question. What is the best way to teach someone how to handle something?

In what way?

I mean, I'm not claiming to know an answer to this, I just do acknowledge that by having these systems in games it does encourage kids playing said game to support that system.

And it's far too easy for kids to be exploited by it.

[Orange Joe]

In what way?

I mean, I'm not claiming to know an answer to this, I just do acknowledge that by having these systems in games it does encourage kids playing said game to support that system.

And it's far too easy for kids to be exploited by it.

imo only if parents aren't involved in their kids lives. You can't shelter kids and hide away all the bad things till they are 18. Then expect them to be able to handle themselves properly when they haven't been taught how to handle such situations.

[Reivur]

Not to trivialize kids in the topic's situation but older generations dealt with the same stuff but a different way. Just like kids can privately bring up a bunch of charges on loot-boxes (if they get access to your card or an account linked, anyway), people back in the day did the same thing (but worse when you factor they were landlines) with kids calling long distance. Both have similar repercussions and both are things that could eat money out of you without immediately noticing over time. I'd argue in the case of phones its a little sadder since most people back then only had one phone line, but still; its kind of about instilling fiscal responsibility.

I'll admit the lootboxes are a little more insidious since they're injected into a game, but I'm just not willing to pretend that this is some sort of unique concept that past generations didn't also have to deal with. You can also generally do a charge-back, though the kid gets banned in return (which is a fitting punishment); some phone companies were not so chill on relieving a bill from an overactive teenager.

[kail]

And it's far too easy for kids to be exploited by it.

Not with half-decent parenting. This is about as weak of an argument as restricting violence/sex in media.



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Your post makes literally 0 sense.

Think it's a satire as to how people compare lootboxes to actual gambling.

[Jester Joe]

Not with half-decent parenting. This is about as weak of an argument as restricting violence/sex in media.

This is like saying that with half-decent parenting, a kid won't want the donuts you walked past.

[Tech614]

That's the kind of messy "slippery slope" I worry about with these things... where does it end?

Let the ratings boards handle it, not the gov't, gov't always fucks it up.

The ratings board?

Now I'm not 100% sure on all of them... but some of them including the ESRB are literally ran by the industry themselves. So no, the ratings board that is funded by the EAs and Activisions of the world is not the proper thing to handle it at all.

[kail]

This is like saying that with half-decent parenting, a kid won't want the donuts you walked past.

You can explain to them what eating donuts does to them, why you won't spend money on something that is not necessary, or just give them a donut as a treat here and there. It rather proves my point, why regulate the donuts?

[Reivur]

You can explain to them what eating donuts does to them, why you won't spend money on something that is not necessary, or just give them a donut as a treat here and there. It rather proves my point, why regulate the donuts?

Insert because America is fat answer here.

[BeepBoo]

I'm less pissed at the fact that loot boxes exist and more pissed that, like most things when they get mainstream, the gaming genre got ruined by retards who don't mind dropping $1k in a game like onmyoji which clearly didn't take much to develop and is shallower than a kiddie pool.

I'm all for freedom and keeping it around, because it makes it easier to be better than everyone around you thanks to people never cease making poor choices, but man does it suck when the market takes advantage of them and it's a thing I love.

[Onikaroshi]

The ratings board?

Now I'm not 100% sure on all of them... but some of them including the ESRB are literally ran by the industry themselves. So no, the ratings board that is funded by the EAs and Activisions of the world is not the proper thing to handle it at all.

Most of the ratings boards work closely together, it's not just a simple "lol EA is a member of the parent of the ESRB" (they are, but they're not the only one, or even the richest one).

It behooves the industry to police themselves if it becomes a problem (i really don't see it as one, better parenting could solve most of the issues), because the gov't will be heavy handed.

[Jester Joe]

You can explain to them what eating donuts does to them, why you won't spend money on something that is not necessary, or just give them a donut as a treat here and there. It rather proves my point, why regulate the donuts?

I'm not saying to regulate anything though. I never even claimed anything close to that.

But it would be silly to disregard that no matter how well you teach a child, they'll still be tempted is the point of the donut comparison.

[Tech614]

Most of the ratings boards work closely together, it's not just a simple "lol EA is a member of the parent of the ESRB" (they are, but they're not the only one, or even the richest one).

It behooves the industry to police themselves if it becomes a problem (i really don't see it as one, better parenting could solve most of the issues), because the gov't will be heavy handed.

Better parenting is always the answer right?

How many kids do you have?

If you think EA would ever allow the ESRB to stick an M rating on Fifa or Madden because they have loot boxes you're kidding yourself. The ratings boards as they currently are ain't gonna do shit about it.

[Krastyn]

Are you comparing -1000$ cost pixels to physical goods in terms of value?

Anyone tries to explain that because you get a physical good somehow makes it more acceptable is completely naive to the situation. It is a completely worthless argument for two reasons.

1) If it were that simple, that because you got something tangible value it makes it ok, then a company could a literal piece of shit with every purchase, and things would be ok.

2) If you view pixels as worthless because you don't "own" anything, you are confirming that this is not gambling. You're removing the "win" condition. With that philosophy, every loot box purchase is a loss. If you argue that you can "win" because the item has subjective intrinsic non-monetary value, and thus able to "win", you then go down a rabbit hole whose logical conclusion is the removal of any random element from any game.