(Loot Box's) Number of child gamblers quadruples in just two years....

[Temp name]

Pretty much, yeah.

You'd think that by now (In current year!) we'd be past this whole, "But the spOoooOoOooOky electronics are an impenetrable mystery to me, so I just can't be responsible for it!!!" nonsense, but here we are.

Apparently businesses are now irresponsible if they...sell things?

They're irresponsible if they sell gambling to minors, yes. Because, you know, gambling regulations are a thing.

[Jtbrig7390]

Pretty much, yeah.

You'd think that by now (In current year!) we'd be past this whole, "But the spOoooOoOooOky electronics are an impenetrable mystery to me, so I just can't be responsible for it!!!" nonsense, but here we are.

Apparently businesses are now irresponsible if they...sell things?

They are irresponsible by exploiting kids....

Parents not keeping a eye on their kid 24/7 doesn't give company's the right to exploit them. You clearly have never taken care of a kid.

[Dhrizzle]

Thread's about 3 weeks old, but I feel it's relevant enough to revive for this: https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-48925623

As Hidden Artifacts doesn't use loot-boxes or "surprise mechanics," instead charging you for "energy" or whatever to continue playing, this just supports my argument that we should be looking at predatory marketing of microtransactions rather than looking into changing gambling laws.

[Jtbrig7390]

It's the parents responsibility to not let children have access to those funds.

And its not ok for Company's to exploit kids when they get ahold of said funds...

What part of both are at fault do you not get? Also you do realize there is way more ways to buy loot box's then with someones credit card.

[Jtbrig7390]

I really wish people would stop using the word "predatory" when they mean "just selling shit".

Well seeing how it is predatory, The word fits.

[Jtbrig7390]

You didn't address the point that the business can't even know that it's a kid, for one. Or that they're a kid with a credit card that's not being supervised.

If I place an order on Amazon, does Amazon know that I'm not a child using someone's credit card? I mean, there's rules and statements about it, but clearly parents are disregarding those. So is it Amazon's fault if a child is logged onto my account and orders $5000 worth of shit?

Simple Fix.

Put on the box (Game Contain's Gambling) and slap a 18+ rating on it. Boom done deal and anything beyond that is 100% on the parents.

They won't do that tho because then it cuts into their profits that they know they make from kids and people with addictive issues.

The fix is simple but company's like EA will fight tooth and nail to keep from doing it. Sooner or later it will be done for them and it doesn't matter if they or you like it.

Once again you clearly have never had a child to look after and your posts show it.

[Tiwack]

Must feel good to be outsmarted by literal 5-year-old.

Adults are quick to forget what the world was like when they were kids themselves and blindly trust their offspring even as they stuff them full of goodies or give them beatings. If anything comes back to them it's never their fault and they just need to get over it or worry about themselves. Exactly like these lecherous companies are saying to the caretakers of the kids and the disabled. It takes two to tango and they're practically begging to become regulated at this point since they keep pushing the boundaries and testing their limits. Gambling was outlawed for good reason as it goes to peoples heads just like alcohol as soon as money is involved in play.

[Dhrizzle]

I really wish people would stop using the word "predatory" when they mean "just selling shit".

Predatory is the right word, microtransactions are advertised in-game in a way designed to make people give in to compulsions. Where the audience is children regulations are stiffer as they have yet to develop proper impulse control and don't see consequences properly.

[Jtbrig7390]

Again, we're not even talking about gambling in this conversation.

Actually we are or did you not read the title and topic of the thread.

It all goes hand in hand mate, you don't get to goal post it.

[Tiwack]

I really wish people would stop using the word "predatory" when they mean "just selling shit".

They're not just selling shit, they're offering boosts to skip or get ahead of the perceived competition and that is predatory when at the same time marketing and rating their content children that are going to jump on that like candy for bragging rights in the schoolyard. It becomes toxic gambling when a game of chance is involved in the process.

[Jtbrig7390]

Well try to keep up, because a new conversation started and you're the only one that can't pay enough attention to see that, I guess.

If you want to talk about gambling, then do it, but don't keep quoting people who aren't and saying, "BUT GAMBLING, MAN!"

Not my fault that you came into a thread and don't know the topic.

Once again the fix is simple, Put a 18+ rating on the box and the problem is fixed.

[Dhrizzle]

Simple Fix.

Put on the box (Game Contain's Gambling) and slap a 18+ rating on it. Boom done deal and anything beyond that is 100% on the parents.

They won't do that tho because then it cuts into their profits that they know they make from kids and people with addictive issues.

It doesn't solve the problems being talked about though, the latest example in this thread didn't involve loot-boxes, Fortnite has also had similar stories of kids spending 1000s on non-surprise transactions.

We need to look at how the in-game adverts are pushing the MTX, how clear parental controls are for limiting spending and the companies involved - developers, store owners (Google, Apple etc.) and maybe even card issuers (banks) - flagging excessive spending and needing a card-holders response to continue.

[Krastyn]

What I mean is do you think its moral for a company that is going to release a new soccer game every year or two to have system in place where they can milk thousands of dollars from a single person? And its not what people "want" to spend on something, the people spending money on these games aren't fucking saying "I wish I could spend more money on random lootbox shit and get more garbage." the people spending money on this stuff "need" it(compete with others, upgrade a character,etc..) or don't realize how much they are spending in the moment because of predatory practices. If its not designed to be predatory why not just have a $1k skin with no random chance that way the people that "want" to spend the money can?

I think it is perfectly moral. Keeping up with the Jones's in a video game is no different than keeping up with the Jones's in life.

My question to you would be, what is your solution, that will hold up in court?

[Jtbrig7390]

It doesn't solve the problems being talked about though, the latest example in this thread didn't involve loot-boxes, Fortnite has also had similar stories of kids spending 1000s on non-surprise transactions.

We need to look at how the in-game adverts are pushing the MTX, how clear parental controls are for limiting spending and the companies involved - developers, store owners (Google, Apple etc.) and maybe even card issuers (banks) - flagging excessive spending and needing a card-holders response to continue.

Actually it does solve it.

After putting a 18+ rating on the box, The fault is 100% on the parents. Same as if they bought them GTAV and didn't know there was a sex scene two hours in.

Label the game as Adults Only and anything beyond that is on the parents.

[Onikaroshi]

One thing I've noticed and questioned though is... My Google play (don't know about iTunes) store is set to REQUIRE a password every time I make a purchase, this is default as far as I can tell but can be turned off. Why in God's name would you turn it off, not only for children but for accidental purchases. If you have kids make sure everything requires a password AND DO NOT TELL THEM.

Also, at least with the play store again, games do announce that they have in game transactions when you download them, best to steer clear of those if you're worried your kids may empty your life's savings

[Tiwack]

So you're saying they're not just selling shit....they're selling shit that people will want.

Sure, that's the line for "predatory" now, I guess.

You're being predatory in your interactions on this board - intent on splitting hairs or removing categorization where it suits you to fit your argument.

Please get with the program or stay away if you've got nothing of substance to add.

[Onikaroshi]

That's just it, the parents are slavering for convenience, but then don't take steps to protect their children.

They want it to be as easy as possible for them to just yell, "ALEXA, ORDER MORE DORITOS!!!" and have them appear at the door, but then act shocked and appalled when their children can spend money just as easily when there's no protections at all in place.

Yea, I'm afraid enough of accidental purchase I would never personally shut something off anyway, it's not that I don't have money, it's that life has taught me value it from the times that I DIDN'T.

[zealo]

And the question is still, as ever, "Why do these people/kids even have access to that much money to blow?"

These games are essentially vending machines. Do you give a kid your credit card and send them to the vending machine and then bitch when they come back with $500 worth of Snickers bars? No, because that'd make you an idiot, right?

I mean, how the fuck does your five year old have access to your credit cards?

Hidden Artifacts is a game that has an age rating of 4+ on iOS.

Why does a game rated for 4+ even have £3,160's worth of micro-transactions in it?

[zealo]

If it has a one cent transaction, then you can spend a million dollars if you're determined.

Which - yet again - is why the responsibility lies with parents to not let their kids have access to that kind of money.

Why does a game rated 4+ have that amount of micro-transactions allowing users to spend 3000+? Don't dodge the question like this.

[Krastyn]

Hidden Artifacts is a game that has an age rating of 4+ on iOS.

Why does a game rated for 4+ even have £3,160's worth of micro-transactions in it?

Because people older than 4 who have money play it?

The arcade down the street doesn't have an age restriction to get in, nor a restriction on the number of tokens you can spend.