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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by kail View Post
    What difference would it make really other than looks? They could allow 2H frost right now and make it still play the exact same. Granted I prefer the 2H look myself, it's still the gameplay that ultimately bugs me.

    Chains of Ice is fine, BoS is annoying and Frostwyrms fury is not my preference over GS.
    Part of it is that Frost's abilities just fit a slower 2H style. The faster pace of DW makes the spec seem like it should be more about lots of small abilities, when the spec actually focuses on 2 (3 with BoS) abilities. UH felt like the spec that should have had DW with its multitude of smaller attacks, and Scourge Strike was basically designed for MH physical/OH shadow damage from the beginning.

  2. #62
    The GCD has made Ret Paladin one of the absolute worst specs in the game.

    I raided as a paladin during alt nights during Legion and loved it... but I'm leveling my paladin right now and at 116 I'm so bored with it. I regret picking it. Already looking forward to leveling rogue.

  3. #63
    Frost is the lowest apm classes in the game.
    http://simulationcraft.org/reports/PR_Raid.html

    As frost dk main i'm seriously thinking about rerolling because its just way too boring to play.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeriel View Post
    Part of it is that Frost's abilities just fit a slower 2H style. The faster pace of DW makes the spec seem like it should be more about lots of small abilities, when the spec actually focuses on 2 (3 with BoS) abilities. UH felt like the spec that should have had DW with its multitude of smaller attacks, and Scourge Strike was basically designed for MH physical/OH shadow damage from the beginning.
    This is assuming 2h is a slower playstyle (I know it would make complete sense for that to be the case but it's still up to Blizzard's design).
    The wise wolf who's pride is her wisdom isn't so sharp as drunk.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerron View Post
    Eh been playing Frost since WotLK (had a DW frost tank) and I miss having the option to go 2h frost but I've found a way to have fun with the spec this xpac. I've just been using Obliteration instead of BoS. Need to mess with me spec a bit though now that I think about it... Anyhow I'm not doing anything serious so it's not a huge concern that I do a bit less dps.
    I miss the acclimation talent frost tanks used to have.

  6. #66
    Light comes from darkness shise's Avatar
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    Nah, Demon Hunters. I still can´t believe how a class that seems to exciting, with an interesting lore as well... even they move and look amazing.. but then you play one and they feel plain dull.

    You keep trying, but ye, 3 minutes of gameplay and that´s it, that is all you get out of it.

    At the very least on DK you have 3 specs an they are quite different from each other.

  7. #67
    Boring? Try destro warlock and get back to me. Hell, I almost fell asleep just typing that.
    Cracked polystyrene
    "Get all the trust beat outta you. And you know what the fuckin' world is" -A.S.

  8. #68
    Nah after playing Enhance shaman, Frost Dk is a breath of fresh air.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Boring? Try destro warlock and get back to me. Hell, I almost fell asleep just typing that.
    Lol so true. It's fun every 3 minutes

  10. #70
    Herald of the Titans CptEgo's Avatar
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    You guys want some cheese with that whine, holy shit.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by shise View Post
    Nah, Demon Hunters. I still can´t believe how a class that seems to exciting, with an interesting lore as well... even they move and look amazing.. but then you play one and they feel plain dull.

    You keep trying, but ye, 3 minutes of gameplay and that´s it, that is all you get out of it.

    At the very least on DK you have 3 specs an they are quite different from each other.
    but we only compare specs here.....so havoc vs frost dk...havoc is the clear winner, no contest.


    its very embarassing how obliterate hits like a wet noodle, dunno when this started......maybe legion or bfa? when a dot and auto hits do more dmg than obliterate i think we have a problem with the specs class fantasy as a melee hard hitter.

    compare chaos strike with obliterate.

    i mean obliterate hits like demon's bite..like the dhs filler, actually. Just look in any dps chart like details and see the huge gap between both abilities, that kinda are about to do the same thing.

    i play dks since wrath and remember very different times until the big class revamps in legion.

    The frost spec might be boring or easy to play for a long time now, before any class prunings, but at least, it did hit hard with obliterate and that was one of the reasions, why people liked to play frost.

    Now, i do not recognize the spec anymore and find it embarassing to bother with - unholy all day and night it is, until frost is back in melee form as a hard hitter.

    Of course, i consider all things wow not just pve alone, but my chaos strike vs obliterate example was clearly about pve dmg and numbers on pve boss mobs. How can a class designer (who probably do not bother with pvp anyways in his whole lifetime) justify this bullshit change from glorious past frost dk designs?

    Obliterate should always hit very hard, BoS should just be an addition to it.

    Actually, Obliterate should hit harder than any warrior or dh ability, because frost dk have not even half the mobility of said classes.

    Fail design, period.
    Last edited by Tyrannica; 2019-02-06 at 02:30 PM.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    but we only compare specs here.....so havoc vs frost dk...havoc is the clear winner, no contest.


    its very embarassing how obliterate hits like a wet noodle, dunno when this started......maybe legion or bfa? when a dot and auto hits do more dmg than obliterate i think we have a problem with the specs class fantasy as a melee hard hitter.

    compare chaos strike with obliterate.

    i mean obliterate hits like demon's bite..like the dhs filler, actually. Just look in any dps chart like details and see the huge gap between both abilities, that kinda are about to do the same thing.

    i play dks since wrath and remember very different times until the big class revamps in legion.

    The frost spec might be boring or easy to play for a long time now, before any class prunings, but at least, it did hit hard with obliterate and that was one of the reasions, why people liked to play frost.

    Now, i do not recognize the spec anymore and find it embarassing to bother with - unholy all day and night it is, until frost is back in melee form as a hard hitter.

    Of course, i consider all things wow not just pve alone, but my chaos strike vs obliterate example was clearly about pve dmg and numbers on pve boss mobs. How can a class designer (who probably do not bother with pvp anyways in his whole lifetime) justify this bullshit change from glorious past frost dk designs?

    Obliterate should always hit very hard, BoS should just be an addition to it.

    Actually, Obliterate should hit harder than any warrior or dh ability, because frost dk have not even half the mobility of said classes.

    Fail design, period.
    Demon Hunters bring so much more utility than a frost DK.
    Especially in m+ where it all comes down to playstyle of your group which usually isn't suited for frost DK unless you have a tank specifically pulling big when BoS and frostwyrms fury is up.
    Also no aoe stun or darkness or the mobility a DH brings.

    But we have grip and single target stun plus huge aoe with 3x frozen tempest trait and all the CDs up.
    Just sucks that reforging costs so much gold if you want to play different traits or specs it just doesn't feel nice choosing generic traits.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    but we only compare specs here.....so havoc vs frost dk...havoc is the clear winner, no contest.


    its very embarassing how obliterate hits like a wet noodle, dunno when this started......maybe legion or bfa? when a dot and auto hits do more dmg than obliterate i think we have a problem with the specs class fantasy as a melee hard hitter.

    compare chaos strike with obliterate.

    i mean obliterate hits like demon's bite..like the dhs filler, actually. Just look in any dps chart like details and see the huge gap between both abilities, that kinda are about to do the same thing.

    i play dks since wrath and remember very different times until the big class revamps in legion.

    The frost spec might be boring or easy to play for a long time now, before any class prunings, but at least, it did hit hard with obliterate and that was one of the reasions, why people liked to play frost.

    Now, i do not recognize the spec anymore and find it embarassing to bother with - unholy all day and night it is, until frost is back in melee form as a hard hitter.

    Of course, i consider all things wow not just pve alone, but my chaos strike vs obliterate example was clearly about pve dmg and numbers on pve boss mobs. How can a class designer (who probably do not bother with pvp anyways in his whole lifetime) justify this bullshit change from glorious past frost dk designs?

    Obliterate should always hit very hard, BoS should just be an addition to it.

    Actually, Obliterate should hit harder than any warrior or dh ability, because frost dk have not even half the mobility of said classes.

    Fail design, period.
    Obliterate has not been a big damage ability since 2h frost had the huge modifier on it, which was all the way back in early WoD. DW focused on mastery and FS+HB while OB was just a RP generator.

    I agree its a shitty design. The theme of Frost DK just screams "hard hitting juggernaut" and one would think OB would be one of the hardest hitting melee strikes in the game, but its actually the opposite. Blizzard just has a really bizarre idea of what this spec should be, and I haven't liked it at all since they took away 2h frost.

  14. #74
    lol, i like my frost dk, just because of the "simplicity".

    i see lots of negativity about bm hunters and arcane mages, that might also be something for me?

  15. #75
    Honestly to say, making classes more and more boring to play has been somehting Blizzard are doing for quite a long while. Think about it, removing ranks from spells; reducing the amount of spells and stopping to add new spells; reducing talents in the talent trees and assigning specific roles to them; and countless more changes of such sort. Ever since Cataclysm, Blizzard are trying to make the game more simple and straightforward, and thus, resulting in such cases such as Frost DK's current state: 3 buttons to press (1 of which has 20sec cd), 2 procs, and 3 cds which you use once every 2 or 3 minutes. So that's like what? An average of 4 buttons to press? Hell, even Diablo III has more buttons than that, apart from the fact it already has 10 times better talent system.

    But yeah, Frost DK is in a terrible state right now. I still cry a little when I think about the times where DKs could tank/dps/dw/2h in any of their 3 specs.

  16. #76
    High Overlord Mightytasty's Avatar
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    Shaman main dropping in to agree with the OP. FDK might not be the most boring spec in the game, but is definitely the most boring I've played. It's basically a super slow spec but with small numbers. Most of the damage seems like it comes from auto attack, Frost Fever, and breath lol. I, like many many others, miss the huge Obliterate crits.

    Unholy is not much better.

  17. #77
    all classes are boring right now.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Hexxed86 View Post
    all classes are boring right now.
    That! Basically what I explined in my post slightly above.

  19. #79
    I agree that it's a bit boring, but there's also a place for a boring spec as well. Personally, to me DKs played the most fun during WotLK and I felt really invested in the class fantasy. I was still surprised when they made Blood the tanking tree later, as I expected Frost to be for tanking (I mean, there's just something about the image of someone strengthening themselves using ice that makes sense). Losing two-handed as Frost also felt like it was destroying the fantasy.
    So my DK has been "meh" to play ever since then, even though I love the class conceptually. Then again, I experienced the same thing going from Vanilla to TBC with my Shaman, as I liked how Enhancement played in Vanilla, though obviously from TBC on it became more viable as a spec. And since the various expansions and prunings, I've lost basically all attachment to the class.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Hexxed86 View Post
    all classes are boring right now.
    I have been playing Arcane since MoP now. Until its rework in legion arcane has been a lot of fun to play. Now its just stupid. No choice in talents because most of them are just useless garbage. The global cooldown on charged up and arcane power feels horrible. The azerite powers are all abysmal except for equipoise which makes the gameplay dull. I would love to have fun playing this game, but i just dont.

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