Sylvanas Gameplay Update

[naeblis495]

sylvanas is trash since rework , end of story . and no , short video of her destroying targets with 2 billion W stack doesn't count .

before she was a good pusher with moderate damage , now she is a shit assassin with still moderate damage but even more easy to avoid .

want to play a ranged female assasin , go play vallah , she is better in every way

[caervek]

The hell does this even mean?

The game is balanced or it's not.

It's not that simple, it's not a yes/no option.

Here's an analogy: Football games kids play in school use casual rules not world cup rules, because they're just casual games and forcing the same type or rules/regulations as a world cup match would be so overkill it would limit the fun. That doesn't mean the rules are unfair/unbalanced just that they're less hardcore.

The same is true in HotS, when the new devs started balancing the game around Esports it was detrimental to the game, hence long term players hoping the long awaited end of the Esport experiment will return the game design to trying to be balanced but not so overbalanced it's detrimental to the game.

[Hollycakes]

I get what you're saying in a way. It's like arena in wow, balancing for that has far reaching implications that can affect gameplay for others. Kinda surprised the esport scene here has divided the community so much and we seem to have 2 sides. The game is fun or it isn't.

I mean we've had the pro scene this whole time and the qm circus was in full effect and watching pally just try to get his a-z done shows this. Even drafts had it's share of problems and having a pro scene didn't make any of that stuff better. Don't think we'll find out till later this year.

[Charge me Doctor]

sylvanas is trash since rework , end of story . and no , short video of her destroying targets with 2 billion W stack doesn't count .

before she was a good pusher with moderate damage , now she is a shit assassin with still moderate damage but even more easy to avoid .

want to play a ranged female assasin , go play vallah , she is better in every way

Sylvanas is great and melts 1/3rd health on tanks and completely obliterates squishies if she manages to get a flank attack. Risky play is heavily rewarded, and before rework she was used only for her passive (in some sense like Morales medivac cheese with shit like Nazeebo, Artanis and other bullshit-that-melts-buildings-quickly; or old zaggara + abathur cheese, but in case of old Sylvanas it actually worked in most games). Also 200 stacks at 20 minutes is not "2 billion" and actually a number you should aim to at this length of game.

And she is still a good pusher with good mid-range damage and an escape. She still fills the role you want her to fill. Except you can't afk push your way to victory now, you have to think when you use your passive, and your opponent have an ability to outplay you now by making you waste your passive with good defense.

Valla is shit tier right now, if you want to play a ranged female assassin you shouldn't pick valla, she is worse than Sylvanas or even Cassia in every way.

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It's not that simple, it's not a yes/no option.

Here's an analogy: Football games kids play in school use casual rules not world cup rules, because they're just casual games and forcing the same type or rules/regulations as a world cup match would be so overkill it would limit the fun. That doesn't mean the rules are unfair/unbalanced just that they're less hardcore.

The same is true in HotS, when the new devs started balancing the game around Esports it was detrimental to the game, hence long term players hoping the long awaited end of the Esport experiment will return the game design to trying to be balanced but not so overbalanced it's detrimental to the game.

There is a difference between making things balanced and having things that you can't outplay (if you don't consider PUCNH SHIT REEL HARD 'TIL IT'S DED an outplay, like it used to be with old Sylvanas). It's not a healthy thing for the game. Having Sylvanas shut down buildings and minions by simply being present near them is just broken, i was arguing that since ammo rework. The problem is not Sylvanas itself, the problem was that she had 4 other players that can also capitalize on that and if she would be a completely useless in fights (protip - she wasn't, she provided the best thing for teamfights that existed in that armour stacking meta - armour shred) it would be kinda fine, but still cheesy, but she wasn't. So they had two options - make Sylvanas useless but keep her passive, or rework her into being an actually good champion (good in sense of health of the game, not personal feelings towards her) by limiting her passive, adding complexity for her combo, adding reward for risking (have you ever used banshee as an offensive tool before? Cut down those cleanup kills, but you always held it back for a safe escape, it was too good to spend it offensively and you got too little out of it anyways), reworking her talent tree to emphasize on things you want to achieve, instead of having one build that rules it all, and most important - all of these changes gives your opponent an ability to capitalize on your mistakes.

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I get what you're saying in a way. It's like arena in wow, balancing for that has far reaching implications that can affect gameplay for others. Kinda surprised the esport scene here has divided the community so much and we seem to have 2 sides. The game is fun or it isn't.

I mean we've had the pro scene this whole time and the qm circus was in full effect and watching pally just try to get his a-z done shows this. Even drafts had it's share of problems and having a pro scene didn't make any of that stuff better. Don't think we'll find out till later this year.

That's not like arena in wow by any stretch of imagination. Arena in wow is imbalanced (and always will be) because it's an MMORPG. They literally have no ability to balance it unless they give all classes and specs all the tools everyone else has. They keep it somewhat balanced, but it's still just RMP all over the place, warriors complaining about sitting in novas, mages complaining about being deleted in a garrote silence, everyone complaining about priests, even priests.

And i'm tired of repeating this but QM - IS the circus, it's supposed to be like that since you go in completely blinded

[Acidbaron]

She actually requires some skill now and can't just bully lanes without any real risk or effort. I say that's a good thing i can still push lanes with her and and i'm only a gold player, so take some effort to learn and you'll be fine.

I don't see how anyone liked playing against her in her former form. It wasn't fun, it was chromie levels annoying where chromie actually had skill shots. This wasn't balanced for top level play this was to make her more fair on all levels. Yes you lost your one trick pony but she is by no means weak.