Poll: As of 8.1.5, how likely is a huge factional paradigm shift?

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  1. #1

    Question 8.1.5 factionometer readings! Are we in for a huge change?

    So I know I've asked this before, and I will ask it again until we have a definitive answer, because it is an evolving issue, a growing story:

    We are in the midst of being barraged with 8.1.5 datamining. Without getting too deep into spoilers, and taking said datamining into account, where does your personal "factionometer" stand on whether or not something big and transformative will happen to the mechanical existence of the faction divide as a result of this expansion's events?

    For all my wishes and hype, I've been holding at a 5/10, as likely as not, but some of the 8.1.5 stuff has finally clicked me over to a 6! I think teasing it like this and not going all the way would be a dick move that might actually be beyond Blizzard. If the recent datamining makes it live anything like it's looking now, I'm calling it more likely than not: My paladin will, more likely than not, be a bloodelf while still tanking for void elf friends by or within the next expansion.

    I still think we will have an alliance and horde, I still think every race will be rooted in one faction or the other, but I don't think that will separate players, as a result of BFA. I'm convinced now. Anything else would be a dick move, and mean *NEVER*, which isn't an option when you look at future proofing the game.
    Last edited by Omedon; 2019-01-09 at 10:23 PM.

  2. #2
    Mechagnome etheldald's Avatar
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    status quo is king, not happening.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by schmonz View Post
    My choice is "I have no idea".
    I give them a lot of credit for keeping their cards to the vest, but I do think they’re taking up a lot of time in an uncomfortable story beat (basically war of thorns until, what, 8.2?) to set up what I assume will be a more enjoyable future.

    But yeah, right now “no idea” is probably more widespread than any time in the game’s history, for good or ill!

  4. #4
    The odds of Alliance and Horde teaming up dropped to virtually nothing the second this expansion launched. I cannot fathom them working together ever again.

    Imagine undead fighting alongside worgen, or how about undead fighting alongside night elves?

    Never going to happen. Not ever.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by therealbowser View Post
    The odds of Alliance and Horde teaming up dropped to virtually nothing the second this expansion launched. I cannot fathom them working together ever again.

    Imagine undead fighting alongside worgen, or how about undead fighting alongside night elves?

    Never going to happen. Not ever.
    I certainly see why that opinion exists, it’s why I included it in the poll, but one of the core themes of everything since Before the storm is individuals not "being" their factions. "The warchief is not the horde" is brought up a lot, and there would be no better way to manifest this individualism than by letting us choose whether we are the tree hugging hippie nigthelf who doesn't condemn every forsaken by default, or the bloodelf that will never forget how the humans weren't reliable in their time of need. That's an individual choice, for individuals. It's time.

  6. #6
    Danuser said something of the likes in an interview he linked on his Twitter, just saying.


  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by therealbowser View Post
    The odds of Alliance and Horde teaming up dropped to virtually nothing the second this expansion launched. I cannot fathom them working together ever again.

    Imagine undead fighting alongside worgen, or how about undead fighting alongside night elves?

    Never going to happen. Not ever.
    A major point of Before the Storm was Genn seeing that the undead are not a homogeneous whole that are all monstrous, and that there are decent human beings among them and it is Sylvanas who is the problem. It also set up Calia as the potential leader of an undead faction more aligned with the Alliance.

    You don't need everyone to get along within a faction to have a faction to begin with. If anything you can just go in the opposite direction, neither the Alliance nor Horde are doing great organizationally right now. If they splinter into smaller factions more worried about their own problems, then you could very easily let heroes do whatever they want, or even turn faction identity as a whole into a more dynamic, multi-faceted system.

    e.g. in 9.0 there could be a "Forsaken" reputation, and a "Night Elf" reputation, and they work like Booty Bay/Bloodsail or Aldor/Scryers and regardless of what race/faction you are, doing rep with Forsaken will make the Night Elves hate you and the Forsaken like you, and doing rep with the Night Elves will make them like you and the Forsaken hate you. But doing rep stuff with the darkspear or draenei won't change either the Forsaken or Night Elf opinion of you. Perhaps some factions are influenced more than others, so doing Forsaken stuff will make the Night elves despise you (-100 rep per quest) but the Gilneans just dislike you for doing it (-10 rep per quest); and doing Night Elf quests makes the night elves like you (+100 rep) and the Gilneans think better of you (+10).

    There are a million ways to mix up how factions work without going full "everyone loves everyone and gets along now."

  8. #8
    The Insane Aeula's Avatar
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    Way too much effort for what it's worth imo. Plus it'd erode the game's core fantasy.

    I'd rather not have to specify 'No Alliance' when I make a raid group.

  9. #9
    I am Murloc! Sting's Avatar
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    I felt more like "Not happening, ever" but I voted "Actually possible but unlikely" since you never know what Blizzard will pull out of their asses.
    ( ° ͜ʖ͡°)╭∩╮

    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    The fun factor would go up 1000x if WQs existed in vanilla

  10. #10
    People keep talking about factions disappearing...yet no one gives an argument as of why.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Omedon View Post
    So I know I've asked this before, and I will ask it again until we have a definitive answer, because it is an evolving issue, a growing story:

    We are in the midst of being barraged with 8.1.5 datamining. Without getting too deep into spoilers, and taking said datamining into account, where does your personal "factionometer" stand on whether or not something big and transformative will happen to the mechanical existence of the faction divide as a result of this expansion's events?

    For all my wishes and hype, I've been holding at a 5/10, as likely as not, but some of the 8.1.5 stuff has finally clicked me over to a 6! I think teasing it like this and not going all the way would be a dick move that might actually be beyond Blizzard. If the recent datamining makes it live anything like it's looking now, I'm calling it more likely than not: My paladin will, more likely than not, be a bloodelf while still tanking for void elf friends by or within the next expansion.

    I still think we will have an alliance and horde, I still think every race will be rooted in one faction or the other, but I don't think that will separate players, as a result of BFA.
    I'm convinced now. Anything else would be a dick move, and mean *NEVER*, which isn't an option when you look at future proofing the game.


    Wut? Wanna try that again... without hedging your bets to both sides?

  12. #12
    Faction reconciliation would make no sense at this point without literally destroying the Horde and Alliance. And that would be pretty risky to radically change the identity of WoW at this point.

    BfA entered the area of no-return for faction peace. Its no longer feasible that Night Elves would want peace with the Horde or Forsaken want peace with the Alliance.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    People keep talking about factions disappearing...yet no one gives an argument as of why.
    There are a number of reasons:

    •The expansion is being set up as a war to end wars between the factions, so it is unlikely they will just go back to default and working together but hating each other.
    •Unlike with MoP's Garrosh/Vol'jin, players are being given choices and the devs have said, with regard to those choices, that they want them to exist where they matter, which creates a divide Horde side between players in contrast to MoP. Essentially making it a lot harder to just shift Sylvanas to villain and reset to the default factions.
    •The factions are growing increasingly murky. It's clear that Baine is totally willing to work with the Alliance peacefully (which the Tauren have been doing forever on some level anyway), at the same time, the Night Elves have effectively stepped back from the Alliance. This again, makes clear resolution to the default more difficult.
    •Similarly, there are storythreads that appear to be opening the factions to increased mingling, stuff like the Horde-aligned humans in the Horde war campaign, and Calia being an Alliance-aligned potential forsaken leader
    •On a gameplay level, there is an increasing sense that the faction barrier for content should just be done away with. People are concerned with the differences in raiding environment, there's longstanding issues in PvP, both in levels of engagement and racial advantage that would be easily dealt with if you could just group with whoever, whenever
    •Blizzard has been increasingly relaxing the divide to begin with, with things like Merc mode,

  14. #14
    Mechagnome Kemsa's Avatar
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    No... probably this could also being the process to reach the last expansion. SO if someday Horde and Alliance stop existing as 2 factions fighting each other, it should be

    WoW 2

    Now consider this points:
    WoW has always been the Game of Factions, since the firsts patches Horde started to hate alliance because of Theramore, the alliance against the Blackrocks Orcs, Faction War has always existed, but!!! the plot tickens, and somehow somewhat the "adventurers of Azeroth" started to work together, instead of "THE HORDE SLAYED NEFARIAN OR ONYXIA KILLED BY THE ALLIANCE" now the 2 factions work together with the NAARUU to destroy Illidan and friends.....

    but then the true enemy lies on Sunwell, SO A NEUTRAL FACTION WITH THE PLAYERBASE ENTERs IN ACTION and every single fricking expansion beyond that uses that excuse

    A NEUTRAL FACTION NEEDS HEROES TO FIGHT THE BIG BAD OF THE EXPANSION,,, blah blah blah and you can go
    ARgent Crusade, Ebon Blade, Circle of Cenarion, The Earthen Ring, THe golden Lotus, the shado pan, the Darkspear revolutionaries...

    then WOD was the first one in dividing the game again but they f..up so Blizzard again used the NEUTRAL FACTION but in this case... Apart from a tiny small enforcers of the Kiring Tor and Khadgar, there wasnt, and to note the awkwardly conversation of Grom screaming DRAENOR ITS FREEEEE in front of every single Draenei, that he prbably killed their families or ra*** so yeah...

    and then LEGION oh no big bad Guldan from other dimension, must the kirin Tor join forces with the Illidaris, because plot point on TBC.

    So this has been the first expansion that we finally return to the roots, but after how much 14 years? of we are TOTALLY FRIENDS YEAAAY, have change the faction pride to idk if i like this faction, i like the race, i dont like my leaders. And to be honest, its Blizzards fault, because they painted Sylvannas Horde just like Garrosh horde... but everyone hated Garrosh, but Sylvannas, yeah. The Alliance for the most part... its the same since Vanilla with some upgrades ???? but being in the Horde since Wrath has been a total rollercoaster.

    So to end my long post sorry, if we are going to stop with the factions, its the day when WoW 1 dies.. and WoW 2 starts with a new fresh story some at the part of FFXXIV,

  15. #15
    Stood in the Fire
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    Whatever requires the least possible effort and creativity at the time.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    There are a number of reasons:

    •The expansion is being set up as a war to end wars between the factions, so it is unlikely they will just go back to default and working together but hating each other.
    •Unlike with MoP's Garrosh/Vol'jin, players are being given choices and the devs have said, with regard to those choices, that they want them to exist where they matter, which creates a divide Horde side between players in contrast to MoP. Essentially making it a lot harder to just shift Sylvanas to villain and reset to the default factions.
    •The factions are growing increasingly murky. It's clear that Baine is totally willing to work with the Alliance peacefully (which the Tauren have been doing forever on some level anyway), at the same time, the Night Elves have effectively stepped back from the Alliance. This again, makes clear resolution to the default more difficult.
    •Similarly, there are storythreads that appear to be opening the factions to increased mingling, stuff like the Horde-aligned humans in the Horde war campaign, and Calia being an Alliance-aligned potential forsaken leader
    •On a gameplay level, there is an increasing sense that the faction barrier for content should just be done away with. People are concerned with the differences in raiding environment, there's longstanding issues in PvP, both in levels of engagement and racial advantage that would be easily dealt with if you could just group with whoever, whenever
    •Blizzard has been increasingly relaxing the divide to begin with, with things like Merc mode,
    Good list!

    It’s also worth noting that classic is being released this year... perhaps as a destination for the playerbase that absolutely cannot stomach a faction agnostic game.

    At the end of the day, the original premise of the faction divide is predicated on hate, prejudice and a mess of other generalistic, problematic ideals that are under direct, if subtle attack in the storylines and literature of this expansion. Also, it’s 2019, and those ideals don’t really hold water any more.

    It’s time. More likely than not it happens by 9.0 (or is announced as an eventual story goal of the next expansion) or it doesn’t happen ever, and for future proofing reasons it almost has to happen eventually.

    It’s time.
    Last edited by Omedon; 2019-01-10 at 01:51 AM.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sting View Post
    I voted "Actually possible but unlikely" since you never know what Blizzard will pull out of their asses.
    Pretty much the same thing for me. Not something I can really imagine happening, but I didn't ever imagine that the WoW devs would release WoD 2.0, either, and here we are.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Eggroll View Post
    Danuser said something of the likes in an interview he linked on his Twitter, just saying.
    The likes of which? It wasn’t clear who you were responding to!

  19. #19
    Blizzard is terrified of ever removing the faction line, or dual faction bullshit, and thus the story has suffered tremendously. Not ever going to happen, even though I'd welcome it.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Omedon View Post
    The likes of which? It wasn’t clear who you were responding to!
    Regarding the OP and the changes/transformation that might come to the factions.


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