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  1. #21
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    I'm waiting for our resident China apologists to show up to spin this in China's favor.


    Will they:

    A) Say that the Tibetan controversy is a conspiracy theory
    B) Say that the world is being unfair to China, and provide Chinese sources as to outline why
    C) Say that Tibet should be thankful to China

    or

    D) Blame the US

    Double your money on betting "all of the above!"
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  2. #22
    And here we can see the true face of China.
    Also a good example of what happens when you have propaganda for decades and you think you are the best shit after sliced bread and are always right.

  3. #23
    Herald of the Titans Alex86el's Avatar
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    Oh no, any Canadias better cancel your plans to visit China. Or just leave if you're there.
    And stop dealing meth! wtf you guys.

  4. #24
    Why some Taiwanese are "open" to rejoining the cesspool that is China I'm not sure. Haven't they seen what's happening in Xinjiang or Tibet? Or even Hong Kong? What were the British thinking when they gave Hong Kong Back to China anyways, they should have given it to Taiwan.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Collegeguy View Post
    And do what? Swim over to the United States?
    Why would they go to another continent?
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    Nah nah, see... I live by one simple creed: You might catch more flies with honey, but to catch honeys you gotta be fly.

  6. #26
    I am Murloc! bungeebungee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raptor With a Saber
    Hi chose to stay, Tibet didnt. Thats all that matters
    Who chose? Do you mean the theocrat who represented a slave holding minority and was in the pay of the CIA didn't choose to stay? My sources could well be biased, but as far as I can tell the descendants of Tibet's serfs aren't keen to go back to those days and they would have been 90% or so of the population.

    Do you mean that the native Hawaiians, after being decimated by foreign diseases and outnumbered by the descendants of foreign workers brought in by the same wealthy people who overthrew the kingdom, somehow choose to stay despite the fact that there is a current, active attempt to regain native rights? The US government doesn't seem to agree with you there:

    Whereas the indigenous Hawaiian people never directly relin-quished their claims to their inherent sovereignty as a people or over their national lands to the United States, either through their monarchy or through a plebiscite or referendum;
    Source: https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/...107-Pg1510.pdf

    Pay particular attention to the bolded portion there. There was a plebiscite vote in 1959, however, it did not comply with the relevant portion of the UN Charter because it only listed statehood or remaining a territory as options. The required option of opting out and becoming sovereign was not included in that plebiscite.

    In 1945 Hawai`i was placed under Article 73 of the UN Charter, under the administering authority of the United States of America. The United States directly violated the "sacred trust" obligations of this article in their relations with Hawai`i. This led to the illegal plebiscite vote in 1959, which was used by the United States as the basis for Hawai`i's statehood, but which failed to provide the option of independence as required by international law, and only allowed American citizens to vote, including many servicemen and their families who had been stationed in Hawaii as part of the military occupation, and excluding those Native Hawaiians who chose not to integrate into America.
    Source: http://www.hawaii-nation.org/art73.html
    The UN seems to have confirmed that the plebiscite did not comply with those requirements in 1999. (See http://mauimama.com/to-move-forward-...know-our-past/ and others).

    Your position appears to be a bit thin on facts and historically inaccurate.
    Last edited by bungeebungee; 2019-02-17 at 04:55 AM. Reason: attribution .. and typo
    "No one -- however smart, however well-educated, however experienced -- is the suppository of all wisdom"

    Quote Originally Posted by Katie N
    Wtf? No weapons? xD What is this? Restricted training environment?
    Commenting on "anything goes" for martial arts and self defense

  7. #27
    I am Murloc! Logwyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bungeebungee View Post
    Who chose? Do you mean the theocrat who represented a slave holding minority and was in the pay of the CIA didn't choose to stay? My sources could well be biased, but as far as I can tell the descendants of Tibet's serfs aren't keen to go back to those days and they would have been 90% or so of the population.
    Why the need to justify what China does with Tibet by using an example of something the US did in the past. Are you going to say because the Belgians treated people in the Congo that its ok for such and such country to murder the Kurds for instance? There is no need as both are bad.

  8. #28
    I am Murloc! bungeebungee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn
    Why the need to justify what China does with Tibet by using an example of something the US did in the past.
    The question posed by OP was "Do you care that China is occupying another country?" You've put things upside down in your example, it isn't that two wrongs make a right but rather that "He who seeks equity must do equity."

    Hubcap is specifically an American posting from America. It smacks of hypocrisy to hold as legitimate an American act in 1959 (Hawaii being made a state without being given the option of sovereignty) while calling China out as occupying another country in 1959. That goes to your point "both are bad", we're simply looking at it from different angles -- if one is bad, then both are bad. It should not be possible, with a straight face, to level accusations against one situation while ignoring the other.

    Any takers on that one? I'm betting not, despite the US flat out acknowledging the problem in Hawaii and similar recognition by the UN. This is a Hubcap copy paste with a one line comment to stir the usual shitpot of China bashing. It is made with no intent to discuss anything, it is a Tennisace style page farming post. At least Tennis sometimes made an effort to throw more fuel on the fire.
    "No one -- however smart, however well-educated, however experienced -- is the suppository of all wisdom"

    Quote Originally Posted by Katie N
    Wtf? No weapons? xD What is this? Restricted training environment?
    Commenting on "anything goes" for martial arts and self defense

  9. #29
    Of course they are enraged. They are all brain washed cunts. China has no place in the civilised world and horrible human rights abusers. The West has a made a grave mistake setting up business and trading with them for pure greed while turning a blind eye to they horrible genocidal tendencies.

    There will be a bunch of Chinese shill that will show up I this thread soon to defend their glorious regimen. It is sad to see so many brainwashed nationalist infecting the world's universities.
    Why join the navy when you can be a pirate

  10. #30
    I am Murloc! bungeebungee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mavfin
    Of course, since you're living in the PRC, I just figure you're another Red China shill trying to muddy the waters, for whatever reason.
    Red China, seriously? What the hell is up with the recycled Cold War language? Did you guys, probably not having been born yet, fail to get the memo that the Cold War is over? So is the 20th Century by the way.

    I could secretly be Xi Jinping drunk posting for giggles, but the point I've raised would still be valid. How about you actually engage your brain and defend a position. To paraphrase Hubcap -- do you care that the US is occupying another country?
    "No one -- however smart, however well-educated, however experienced -- is the suppository of all wisdom"

    Quote Originally Posted by Katie N
    Wtf? No weapons? xD What is this? Restricted training environment?
    Commenting on "anything goes" for martial arts and self defense

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Khelek View Post
    I look at Hong Kong, South Korea, Taiwan, etc. and can hardly imagine how much better the world would be had China not succumbed to communism.
    Those are some shit examples. All of those have entered the post-WW2 era in a much, much better state than mainland China, and then SK and Taiwan were both uplifted by the West to combat communism. China uplifted itself, and that was despite the West, and despite having a far, far longer way to go.

    As for Tibet, well, you may as well be calling for Australians to GTFO from Australia and leave the place for Aborigines and emus, since that's about how long China has controlled Tibet. In any case, listen to Bungee here, because he speaks the truth here. Not that I understand the Chinese outrage over electing a Tibetan for a student president position, but to say that those evul Chinks are occupying Tibet and did nothing good for it is just wrong.
    Last edited by Airlick; 2019-02-17 at 05:18 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxos View Post
    When you play the game of MMOs, you win or you go f2p.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    Those are some shit examples. All of those have entered the post-WW2 era in a much, much better state than mainland China, and then SK and Taiwan were both uplifted by the West to combat communism. China uplifted itself, and that was despite the West, and despite having a far, far longer way to go.

    As for Tibet, well, you may as well be calling for Australians to GTFO from Australia and leave the place for Aborigines and emus, since that's about how long China has controlled Tibet. In any case, listen to Bungee here, because he speaks the truth here. Not that I understand the Chinese outrage over electing a Tibetan for a student president position, but to say that those evul Chinks are occupying Tibet and did nothing good for it is just wrong.
    except every speech in school's in Australia starts acknowledging not only the Aborigines but the group that lived in the area. they get a lot of support and most education is free for them.

    the difference is Australia is trying to fix the problem they caused

    China on the other hand puts you into "reeducation centers" for practicing your native traditions at funerals

    There is a big fucking difference

    also you clearly have not met anyone who has actually lived there. They are not "uplifted"
    Last edited by Goat the SpaceMage; 2019-02-17 at 05:33 AM.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    Those are some shit examples. All of those have entered the post-WW2 era in a much, much better state than mainland China, and then SK and Taiwan were both uplifted by the West to combat communism. China uplifted itself, and that was despite the West, and despite having a far, far longer way to go.

    As for Tibet, well, you may as well be calling for Australians to GTFO from Australia and leave the place for Aborigines and emus, since that's about how long China has controlled Tibet. In any case, listen to Bungee here, because he speaks the truth here. Not that I understand the Chinese outrage over electing a Tibetan for a student president position, but to say that those evul Chinks are occupying Tibet and did nothing good for it is just wrong.
    China lifted itself? Are you fucking kidding me? If not for US and Japan opening factories in China it would still be absolute shit.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    Those are some shit examples. All of those have entered the post-WW2 era in a much, much better state than mainland China, and then SK and Taiwan were both uplifted by the West to combat communism. China uplifted itself, and that was despite the West, and despite having a far, far longer way to go.

    As for Tibet, well, you may as well be calling for Australians to GTFO from Australia and leave the place for Aborigines and emus, since that's about how long China has controlled Tibet. In any case, listen to Bungee here, because he speaks the truth here. Not that I understand the Chinese outrage over electing a Tibetan for a student president position, but to say that those evul Chinks are occupying Tibet and did nothing good for it is just wrong.
    Gtfo and learn some history, is Australia actively running a regimen of cultural genocide right now? No, China is though.
    Why join the navy when you can be a pirate

  15. #35
    ITT: People believing they're the good guys. (Pst, that is what the Chinese believe about themselves too)

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Goat the SpaceMage View Post
    except every speech in school's in Australia starts acknowledging not only the Aborigines but the group that lived in the area. they get a lot of support and most education is free for them.

    the difference is Australia is trying to fix the problem they caused

    China on the other hand puts you into "reeducation centers" for practicing your native traditions at funerals

    There is a big fucking difference
    I'm not aware of Aborigines commiting frequent acts of terrorism against colonists, neither, which is exactly what Uyghurs were doing, and that was before China started cracking down on them. Huis have exactly ZERO problems living and practicing islam in China, because they also cause exactly ZERO problems for the Chinese - well, they are Chinese, though.

    Ask emus what happened when they went terrorist on Australians' crops.

    Quote Originally Posted by i9erek View Post
    China lifted itself? Are you fucking kidding me? If not for US and Japan opening factories in China it would still be absolute shit.
    Except the point was exactly for China to STAY a factory for the developed world forever. Blame the West for letting CPC play a trick on them, it would still be absolute shit if things went according to their plans.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxos View Post
    When you play the game of MMOs, you win or you go f2p.

  17. #37
    I am Murloc! bungeebungee's Avatar
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    Australia and aboriginal rights. OK, that's one that I wouldn't have waded in on, but since it has been brought up. I'm out of date on this, but wasn't land rights a fairly major issue even just a few years ago? A quick check suggests that it was and may well still be: http://www.convictcreations.com/rese...nalrights.html

    This is dated, but it looks as if that free education may be of limited actual use and other social issues may be a problem.
    Aboriginal deaths in custody are still not unknown. The death of Mulrunji Doomadgee on a cell floor in Palm Island in 2004 remains the focus of endless inquiry and racial bitterness in Queensland. Aboriginal life expectancy is still 20 years behind that of non-indigenous people. Nearly one out of two Aboriginal males is dead by the age of 65. Aboriginal people account for just under a quarter of jail inmates though they are only 2.5% of the population. In the past decade one-quarter of indigenes in the cities have completed high school, and fewer than one in 10 in remote Australia. Fewer than one in 10 urban Aborigines achieves a university degree, and fewer than 3% of those in remote Australia. The figures are improving but so far by small increments.
    Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...igenous-rights

    Although not *literally* reeducation centers, don't those prison statistics have a degree of resonance? Close to one in four of inmates were Aboriginal despite being 2.5% of the population, and that is coupled with deaths in custody. Hopefully things have gotten better.
    "No one -- however smart, however well-educated, however experienced -- is the suppository of all wisdom"

    Quote Originally Posted by Katie N
    Wtf? No weapons? xD What is this? Restricted training environment?
    Commenting on "anything goes" for martial arts and self defense

  18. #38
    I can't imagine ever caring who my student union president is. Like, someone could literally bring actual Hitler back from the dead and make him student union president at my university. I still wouldn't care.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    Those are some shit examples. All of those have entered the post-WW2 era in a much, much better state than mainland China, and then SK and Taiwan were both uplifted by the West to combat communism. China uplifted itself, and that was despite the West, and despite having a far, far longer way to go.

    As for Tibet, well, you may as well be calling for Australians to GTFO from Australia and leave the place for Aborigines and emus, since that's about how long China has controlled Tibet. In any case, listen to Bungee here, because he speaks the truth here. Not that I understand the Chinese outrage over electing a Tibetan for a student president position, but to say that those evul Chinks are occupying Tibet and did nothing good for it is just wrong.
    China entered the post WWII period fairly well (considering WWII) before the communist attacked the Chinese republic which had been weakened from fighting the Japanese. This forced the legitimate Chinese government (the one that was part of the many international treaties and alliance and also why China has such a powerful seat in the UN) to flee to Taiwan. The resulting communist takeover killed 40 million people. That is quite the set back. A starving population also easier to control since the power of money that a middle class may wield is non-existent.

    Japan was nuked, fire bombed, and occupied and yet made a rapid recovery. Korea had the Korean war. Taiwan was declared a rogue province by China and has been threaten ever since. Hong Kong was, luckily, still under British rule, but was allowed significant self government. All these places have taken the lessons from Western culture applied them to their own and have been very successful.

    Imagine if all of China was not run by the communist party, but had a similar system to Hong Kong. In this case, China would be one of the greatest forces for good in the world. Free from communism and left to grown under a free market system their economy today would rival the US. North Korea would crumble without communist support. It would have completely reshaped the cold war.

    The world would be miles ahead and miles better had the communist party never existed.

  20. #40
    If China is annoyed, it's probaby a good thing.

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