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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Grapemask View Post
    Alright, let's back up here. Like the last guy, we know you're not stupid. So you're either pretending to be or assuming that we're stupid.

    If a tax incentive is not given, that tax must then be paid. If that tax is paid, then that amount in revenue is collected, and that revenue can then be spent on other things. That includes new teachers and rebuilding the subway system.

    This is not a gaff. This is simple logic that a third grader can understand. Why do rightwing narratives revolve around a mental capacity lower than a third grader's?
    A. I'm sorry, but if I'm going to be honest I'll say you're either a troll or stupid. But my comment was not directed at you originally.

    B. A Tax incentive is not NY taking money and handing it to Amazon. So therefore if that tax is not collected then the money is just a net 0 period. It doesn't mean NYC now has $3Billion in magic money that just appeared by not doing this deal. AOC has been on record, multiple times, stating that NYC could instead use the tax incentives to repair the city and hire more teachers.

    C. This is either a gaff or AOC really doesn't understand economics. As far as your third-grader comment goes.... Well yes, this is exactly how a third grader would view things. AOC has the mental capacity of a third-grader, much like yourself, and clearly isn't capable of thinking beyond that of a third grader. See, I'm not that harsh, but if you want to call yourselves children go for it.

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashrynn View Post
    A Tax incentive is not NY taking money and handing it to Amazon. So therefore if that tax is not collected then the money is just a net 0 period. It doesn't mean NYC now has $3Billion in magic money that just appeared by not doing this deal. AOC has been on record, multiple times, stating that NYC could instead use the tax incentives to repair the city and hire more teachers.
    But, if the tax credit wasn’t given, they would have that revenue to spend on other things?

    This is either a gaff or AOC really doesn't understand economics. As far as your third-grader comment goes.... Well yes, this is exactly how a third grader would view things. AOC has the mental capacity of a third-grader, much like yourself, and clearly isn't capable of thinking beyond that of a third grader. See, I'm not that harsh, but if you want to call yourselves children go for it.
    No, this is the argument every single city that gets tax payer dollars to build new stadiums. The savings to the team, in this case Amazon, is supposed to be eventually covered by tax revenue collected from surrounding businesses and the team it self. If we use the logic that billionaires get incentives, because of future earnings in sports teams, I don’t understand how Age of Conan is the problem.

    If there is a budget short fall, since increased traffic and infrastructure needs in the area, can we blame Amazon then? Does their incentive being net 0, mean that their impact on state spending will be 0? I know it’s different... but, you should read up on what Boeing was getting away with in Seattle, before MS and Amazon. Just 10 years ago, the Puget Sound government signed off on building a new on-ramp from 405 to 167, because Boeing threatened to leave. The catch? They still are actively building, I believe, the third attempt at an “on-ramp” since then. The first was a need to act quick for Boeing, so it was a cluster fuck. I actually don’t know what happened to the second, I moved to West Seattle. But, now am back, and we are getting a freaking overpass... no more additional lanes or extending exit lanes... nope... we get an overpass... I assure you, the net loss was more than 0, but at least Boeing paid taxes.
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    But, if the tax credit wasn’t given, they would have that revenue to spend on other things?



    No, this is the argument every single city that gets tax payer dollars to build new stadiums. The savings to the team, in this case Amazon, is supposed to be eventually covered by tax revenue collected from surrounding businesses and the team it self. If we use the logic that billionaires get incentives, because of future earnings in sports teams, I don’t understand how Age of Conan is the problem.

    If there is a budget short fall, since increased traffic and infrastructure needs in the area, can we blame Amazon then? Does their incentive being net 0, mean that their impact on state spending will be 0? I know it’s different... but, you should read up on what Boeing was getting away with in Seattle, before MS and Amazon. Just 10 years ago, the Puget Sound government signed off on building a new on-ramp from 405 to 167, because Boeing threatened to leave. The catch? They still are actively building, I believe, the third attempt at an “on-ramp” since then. The first was a need to act quick for Boeing, so it was a cluster fuck. I actually don’t know what happened to the second, I moved to West Seattle. But, now am back, and we are getting a freaking overpass... no more additional lanes or extending exit lanes... nope... we get an overpass... I assure you, the net loss was more than 0, but at least Boeing paid taxes.
    From what I have been hearing, is that it would benefit NY(C) to the tune of $27B over ten years while getting a tax break of $3b over that same time. I dont know where they come up with that number but lets say the benefit is a third of that. $9b over ten years while getting $3b in tax breaks. That means NY(C) is getting $9b more than they would have without Amazon. If Amazon didnt get a tax break it would be $12B instead.

    Tax incentives aside and corps not paying their fair share aside. Having a multi-billion dollar companies HQ in your city has to be a huge advantage. Add to that Amazon with all the STEM jobs it could create and spin off (as employees get hired and exit). Not to mention keeping STEM grads in your state instead of fleeing for careers in other States. Lets also not forget what types of businesses would start-up or move to NY(C) to be closer or withing commuting distance to a Tech Business park located near the HQ. I think NY(C) lost a good opportunity to be generate an opportunity to be the East Coast Silicon Valley.

    Stadiums dont generate the kind of jobs(or tax revenue for that matter) a Tech HQ would generate.
    Last edited by petej0; 2019-02-21 at 03:16 PM.
    Kara Swisher: What do you think about Cory Booker saying kick them in the shins?
    Hillary Clinton: Well, that was Eric Holder.
    Kara Swisher: Eric Holder, oh, Eric Holder, sorry.
    Hillary Clinton: Yeah, I know they all look alike.

  4. #124
    Funny how big businesses want to get a break, but your local small business has to pay it's full tax.

    What's the deal? Shouldn't all businesses get the same pro rated incentive? Just another example how the wealth gap grows more and more over time.
    Last edited by Hilhen7; 2019-02-21 at 04:50 PM.

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by petej0 View Post
    From what I have been hearing, is that it would benefit NY(C) to the tune of $27B over ten years while getting a tax break of $3b over that same time. I dont know where they come up with that number but lets say the benefit is a third of that. $9b over ten years while getting $3b in tax breaks. That means NY(C) is getting $9b more than they would have without Amazon. If Amazon didnt get a tax break it would be $12B instead.

    Tax incentives aside and corps not paying their fair share aside. Having a multi-billion dollar companies HQ in your city has to be a huge advantage. Add to that Amazon with all the STEM jobs it could create and spin off (as employees get hired and exit). Not to mention keeping STEM grads in your state instead of fleeing for careers in other States. Lets also not forget what types of businesses would start-up or move to NY(C) to be closer or withing commuting distance to a Tech Business park located near the HQ. I think NY(C) lost a good opportunity to be generate an opportunity to be the East Coast Silicon Valley.

    Stadiums dont generate the kind of jobs(or tax revenue for that matter) a Tech HQ would generate.
    We are talking about NYC. This isn’t Nashville. How much would Amazon cost the city in infrastructure? What happens if Amazon flops in 7 years?
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    We are talking about NYC. This isn’t Nashville. How much would Amazon cost the city in infrastructure? What happens if Amazon flops in 7 years?
    I cant say because I am not a civil engineer in NYC. I am also not privy to the full extent of Amazons plans or the area they were targeting. Having said that, Amazon should have to pay for what every infrastructure they need for the immediate area (parking, ramps and roads to Business park etc). As for the NYC infrastructure, it isnt like NY is leading the nation in infrastructure. I am sure the $9B they get in increased revenues and additional revenues from added wealth being attracted would help cover any needed costs.

    NYC has issues heating public housing and low rent housing. I bet they could use whatever extra revenue they can get.
    Kara Swisher: What do you think about Cory Booker saying kick them in the shins?
    Hillary Clinton: Well, that was Eric Holder.
    Kara Swisher: Eric Holder, oh, Eric Holder, sorry.
    Hillary Clinton: Yeah, I know they all look alike.

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