Echo Chambers

[Doctor Amadeus]

i see your point i think,though im not a republican, not by any stretch of the imagination, i am a UK one nation conservative, and loyal to the queen so the notion of republicanism is not in my dictionary.

but what im trying to say, is that, as we both know our party's are made up of many philosophy's. but some of those philosophy's actually find better allies in the oppositions philosophy's on individual issues, as a one nation conservative who believes in a national heath service as i gave as an example, it would debase me to go against the ideal just to fulfill loyalty and duty to a party.

were seeing this play out as we speak in the UK with 8 labor resignations and 3 conservative resignations this week to form an independent separate bloc, because they have realized that as center-left and center-right they are better friends than with the further left corbynites and further right EU-sceptic populists of there original party's. what they believe to be good and right, has more importance than blind loyalty.

Yeah well I apologize for my long post. I did it on mobile. But the only things I really wanted to convey is really what you said. I think groups like families, no matter how strong and dedicated are just that. And ther can be just as much disagreement inside as out.

I do think one can be judged by the group they belong to, I just think it requires context. I’m Liberal so for you to assume something’s even if you’re wrong it’s ok. Because I choose that association. But that might shows how loyal I am too a cause, but to a specific issues maybe not so much.

I don’t believe in communism at all however it’s for sure a kin in the wheel house of what I believe, but I reject it because it doesn’t work and I’ve seen it unchecked.

Socialism too up until a point some of it can work just like communism I suppose, but strictly no and unchecked despite intentions it causes misery and great harm.

That’s the real reason I’m not either. Like you said I support universal healthcare 100% but I recognize that’s socialism. If some call me a socialist I’ll take the damn hit. Even if I don’t agree.

However on the flip side I’m a capitalist but I’ve seen the misery that can cause also. So I’ll get called Neo Liberal for that so again I’ll take the hit. Because how True depends on where some stand. I’m Liberal but some I’m not Liberal enough food some.

See a pattern?

I recognize how that can be absurd, but I also accept even to others that’s accurate even if though im a liberal by other liberal. I’ll always fight for the values of where I stand. However that doesn’t always mean immunity on disagreement.

It’s why I don’t believe Echo Chambers exist or bubbles can work.

I think these are just loaded words we make up when people have made a choice on some level because it allows people to shut off their brains pivot to an excuse and delegitimization.

Sometimes people are ignorant but sometimes people choose stupidity which can’t be cured. By more knowledge. While ignorance will only last so long as groups can stifle curiosity which they can’t. At least forever maybe North Korea maybe Cuba but those are exceptions and they are falling.

No ideology can. So pushing isn’t needed only access some won’t take it. But so long as the access remains people should be free to choose for themselves right or wrong.

I would only agree with pushing if people don’t have that access to choose. But you have that I have that

As far as loyalty that’s a separate thing. That isn’t a choice an uninformed mind should ever have to make. But as adults when we are loyal and make a choice that’s on each of us.

I’m only loyal to the degree of specifics being a liberal or democrat neither of which is about being loyal and agreeing on everything.

But for sure some things but only core values.

That’s why I used Christian because that’s a strong belief but outside of that core we understand layers and some are very different.

[Verdugo]

Funny that it has all been predicted.

[Doctor Amadeus]

I read a lot of r/The_Donald. It's helped me realize just how batshit some of these internet people are. Also, it's really been an exciting experience in witnessing the effects of bubbles first hand, especially if you've had the opportunity to watch the thing evolve from pre-election to now. It's like watching a snowball roll downhill as the group self-selects itself to be crazier and crazier. There's probably a researcher somewhere who's working on a hell of a paper.

I agree Trump supporters in my opinion cut closest to the definition of echo chambers and regardless to whatever nuances it doesn’t matter to me they are all the same. If that’s my choice and it’s stupid well then I’ll choose it. But I still wouldn’t call it a bubble I would say they are simply all the same.

[Laerrus]

My Aunt and Uncle believe that Obama is the Antichrist (they are just a bit nuts) and I have had to keep my liberal views hidden from them when we go to visit. It's just better to keep the peace than try to help them see reality.

I do listen to both sides but, I just don't understand how people can be rabidly loyal to the great orange one, especially these people who call themselves Christians. He's cheated on all of his wives, multiple times. Been caught on tape bragging about grabbing female genitalia, yet these so called upstanding citizens turn a blind eye.

He takes claim for improving the economy, when all that was set in motion by Obama. There are many things that Trump is doing now that will lead to economic hardships in the future. I hope they some sooner than later so he fucking owns all of it. I liked Obama and Bush, but even I wasn't so fucking blind that I could not see their faults.

I can see how people loved Reagan, Bush 41, McCain and Romney, but Trump? Come on folks! Wake the fuck up!

[Blur4stuff]

Should ask them how they like their medicare and social security.

This was a mind boggling part of a conversation we had. He's convinced that dems want to destroy the country with socialism. He claims all kids want everything for free. He also doesn't believe other countries have better healthcare because his healthcare is great and he gets everything he needs at a fair price. This is, of course, because he has medicare. I point out that the most popular idea is medicare for all. Just imagine there being no age restriction.

I could see the wheels turning in his head trying to figure out how it's evil for everyone to have the healthcare he just said was great. It's like the Fox News brainwashing was tumbling around in there trying to figure out a solution.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not hating on the guy. I deal with these seniors a lot and care whether they're doing okay, but it's very frustrating dealing with the Fox nonsense.

[Kokolums]

Off the top of my head I’ve watched a lot of, read or listened to lectures from all of the above. I don’t agree with any. How about you?

Looking at polls over the past several decades, people no longer agree with nor trust the media, religion, government, the business sector, bankers, education, cops, the military, doctors, and any sort of authority figure. So you can basically list everything. In modern times, trust is gone across the board, which means people are becoming tribal and closing themselves off into various extremist factions.

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It's disheartening to see people living in an echo chamber in my area. I help seniors and am often in their homes. Many of them watch Fox News 24/7. Nothing else. No other news on TV, online or anywhere else.

They live in an alternate reality. One couple in particular (80+) are legit panicked about a dem winning in 2020 because that means the country will be destroyed by socialism. They are essentially doomsday planning. They also did this several years ago under Obama because they were convinced he was going to declare martial law, confiscate guns, end voting, etc...

The alt right is going to win over the left. Think about that.

[Grimbold21]

Well you refuse to see it from my perspective and hand wave it. It’s not a bubble or an echo chamber it’s just you not accepting reality.

This is why people occasionally doubt your dominion of the english language.

Notice in how two sentences that you probably wanted to complement each other, you end up contradict your likely original thought.

In response to my previous post, you say that I'm merely refusing to understand your perspective and dismiss it. And you immediately ground that by stating that what you live in is not an echo chamber, but reality.

Do you not see how foolishly arrogant that sounds? You're claiming that your perspective is the only correct one because it is reality.

How can you make that claim in response to the accusation I made? In response to someone asking you "Why does Peterson hate women?" you said "Why he hates women, I don't know". So let us get this straight, you say he hates women but you don't know why. You are therefore unable to make a case for your accusation, reducing anything you say - because let's be honest, this is what you usually do around here - to mere name calling.

So please, tell me again how your perspective is reality and that I'm blind to it.