What spec will you play in Mythic BFA after Demo nerfs 12/3 ?

[Liarparadox]

My sim dps went down 4k. On Oppulence it was definitely noticeable, I was usually #1 or #2, but I couldn’t even break top 5 with the nerf. I ended up just going back Affliction after a couple wipes. It’s pretty bad.

They should have fixed the pet bugs only and then later lay on the EP nerf if necessary, but they don’t know to nerf and buff classes properly.

My m+ dps went down 6k roughly. I agree they should have left EP to see how it did with just the bug fixes. It probably would have been enough and didn't mess with the feel of the gameplay all that much (I purposely avoided using the implosion/DC exploit since I figured that was getting fixed, so that didn't really impact me much). As relatively OP as EP was, it made the spec feel sooooo smooth to play. The best imo demo has ever been. Spec isn't nearly as fun to play with the lower EP haste. It's fine if there's an overwhelming proc; but yeah it's feeling yucky. Demo needed a nerf, no question; but this is a bit of an overkill. Actually never felt more disappointed in a lock nerf as this one in all my way too many years of playing.

Glad I don't raid Demo. Sad times.

[Gaidax]

EP was and still is retarded strong. If anything this should have never been a thing to begin with, it's one thing to have something like Flashpoint which uptime is both conditional and requires to be on the ball (albeit not rocket science) and EP which is just a retarded 100% uptime buff with trivial requirements.

[Shandalar]

This is the never ending story. When Demon begins to shine Blizzard destroys it.

With this nerfs the should have buffed all the dmg a 10%. But its better just making the spec unplayable, its deserved state on Blizzards eyes.

[Count Zero]

This is the never ending story. When Demon begins to shine Blizzard destroys it.

With this nerfs the should have buffed all the dmg a 10%. But its better just making the spec unplayable, its deserved state on Blizzards eyes.

"Unplayable" seems like pretty strong hyperbole

[evertonbelmontt]

"Unplayable" seems like pretty strong hyperbole

Well, for once I agree with the "doomsayers".

They've killed it for me.

After knowing how it was playing demon with tyrant into implosion combo with the same set of imps, it feels so bad having to recast imps after it once again. Still playing demon in M+ but even if it has good or comparable dps to aff/destro in raids, I went back to aff because the pace of demon changed completelly with this.

I could get behind a heavy nerf to EP as it is, and the fix to fellguard. But the Tyrant > Imp thing was more like a clever use of game mechanics than a bug. And it is not like the info was hidden, or made the spec more clunky: on the contrary, I have about 150 to 200 ms in raids and it was still easy to do.

[Sliske]

Tbh warlocks will be ignored for m+ it was our best specc for m+ with decent aoe. Now all 3 speccs sux for trash. Probably ill play destro you can be good on ST and trash

Warlocks will be ignored in M+ because they have virtually zero utility and any utility they do provide is done better by another class which also matches its DPS or does way higher.

Why take a warlock when you can take a ret paladin? You have 2 dps spots, the first is a rogue because you're a meta slave. Your healer has combat rezz. Your tank has an aoe stun.

So you have 2 dps spots.

The first is pretty easy in a ret paladin - obscene aoe damage and very good ST burst. On top of that Word of Glory is broken on bursting weeks along with their BoP for fixates and lay on hands to save the tank.

The second - probably demon hunter. Blade Dance is just broken. No two ways about it. Half the boss mechanics in the game can be taunt > blade danced or just blade danced by itself.

Another contender is Ele shaman. Great damage, Earth Elemental makes reaping / necrotic or teeming weeks a joke, they have a purge, they have one of the best stuns in the game, they have the shortest CD interrupt in the game, can self rezz, can off heal, are fast, have blood lust. Again, where is the room for warlock?

Boomkin serves a similar role to ele. Great damage, solar beam is busted, typhoon is busted, treants are identical to Earth Elemental, combat rezz, broken off healing, soothe

If you're caring about M+ comp, you're probably 1500+ I.O. at which point you're not really playing a lock anyway. Lock is a pure damage bot. People are abusing it right now, but once nerfed it will be back to the same 5-7 classes. Paladin, Warrior, Druid, Rogue, DH, Shaman.

.......... but you're probably not 1500 i.o score.. and you probably only care about the meta because you watched some streams. So for you, and literally 99.9% of the playerbase, enjoy your warlock. No one cares what you play. Only thing they often care about is lust.

[muto]

The dream team is a Prot. Warrior, Resto. Druid, Outlaw, Havoc, Windwalker. You don’t even need ranged anymore. Why bring ranged when melee do more AoE damage, and have a shorter kick?

[AwkwardSquirtle]

The dream team is a Prot. Warrior, Resto. Druid, Outlaw, Havoc, Windwalker. You don’t even need ranged anymore. Why bring ranged when melee do more AoE damage, and have a shorter kick?

So that ranged mechanics don't target the healer so that they can actually cast.

[muto]

So that ranged mechanics don't target the healer so that they can actually cast.

Resto Druid
Resto Druid
Resto Druid

Ideally it’s better that the healer get targeted anyway so the dps can push damage. That’s actually the goal.

[AwkwardSquirtle]

Resto Druid
Resto Druid
Resto Druid

Resto has a few casts afaik, particularly emergency ones. They'll keep ticking over with instants, but if something goes wrong they need to stand still for a little bit.

[Mistaziggla]

My m+ dps went down 6k roughly. I agree they should have left EP to see how it did with just the bug fixes. It probably would have been enough and didn't mess with the feel of the gameplay all that much (I purposely avoided using the implosion/DC exploit since I figured that was getting fixed, so that didn't really impact me much). As relatively OP as EP was, it made the spec feel sooooo smooth to play. The best imo demo has ever been. Spec isn't nearly as fun to play with the lower EP haste. It's fine if there's an overwhelming proc; but yeah it's feeling yucky. Demo needed a nerf, no question; but this is a bit of an overkill. Actually never felt more disappointed in a lock nerf as this one in all my way too many years of playing.

Glad I don't raid Demo. Sad times.

Demo in BRF was my personal favorite, but yeah deff agree this patch would bean easy second.

[hellhamster]

People clearly didn't play warlock in mop.

Destruction for every boss except Mekka and maybe Jaina and Opulence seems to be the way to go.

However, if you aren't pushing for world ~200, every spec is fine, even demo.

[Kaver]

For raids, Affliction and Destro are two of the best specs while Demo is in the middle.. Warlocks still complain...

Meanwhile, All Mage specs are worse than the worst Warlock spec...

This thread just shows that people will never be satisfied xD

[Raia]

For raids, Affliction and Destro are two of the best specs while Demo is in the middle.. Warlocks still complain...

Meanwhile, All Mage specs are worse than the worst Warlock spec...

This thread just shows that people will never be satisfied xD

Someone said mages are OP atm in raids? Stop being toxic

- - - Updated - - -

And frost mage still better than other 3 lock speccs in M+ so dont complain aswell

[Kaver]

Someone said mages are OP atm in raids? Stop being toxic

And frost mage still better than other 3 lock speccs in M+ so dont complain aswell

I didnt mean to offend you mate. I just find it ridiculous that warlocks are complaining right now when all their specs are completely viable and two of them are even top tier. OP said the thread was about raids.

[Liarparadox]

Demo in BRF was my personal favorite, but yeah deff agree this patch would bean easy second.

K chaos wave was sooooo much fun! But aside from Meta I felt really weak. That was my only real problem with BRF Demo, I just didn't like it out of Meta form; the swing/rollercoaster of dps was too much, or felt too much anyway. But ya I liked it especially with the set bonuses.

[Gaidax]

BRF Demo was a design nightmare - it was a soup of everything together, dots, DD, demons, forms, procs, stacks and because there was so much of everything your individual spells were super weak.

On top of that it had an absolutely backwards case of your core spells being more powerful than your meta spells, either due to mechanics (stacking HoG was almost always better than Chaos Wave, unless shit died instantly) or simply because they were just shit.

It did a ton of damage, but design was simply all over the place.

[Count Zero]

I was very surprised to see that Afflic is (still ? or again ?) largely outperforming the other specs in raid content. I thought that when everyone ("everyone") abandoned it for Demo and then abandoned Demo after the EP nerf and bug fixes that they went Destro.

So I'm having a hard time deciding what to play. We're generally not ever wiping to enrages so I doubt my personal dps is going to make a difference there, but I want to make sure to not get too rusty with Demo since that's what I'll be sticking with for M+ ... but on the other hand I like to bring as much to the table as I can, so I probably should raid as Aff or Destro.

My big problem is the muscle memory. It used to be I could spend a couple/few hours at the training dummy and I was good for the tier/xpac, but now I need continual practice and refreshers. And I'm leery about starting that over while I'm still pretty crappy at Demo lol

[Kaver]

I was very surprised to see that Afflic is (still ? or again ?) largely outperforming the other specs in raid content. I thought that when everyone ("everyone") abandoned it for Demo and then abandoned Demo after the EP nerf and bug fixes that they went Destro.

So I'm having a hard time deciding what to play. We're generally not ever wiping to enrages so I doubt my personal dps is going to make a difference there, but I want to make sure to not get too rusty with Demo since that's what I'll be sticking with for M+ ... but on the other hand I like to bring as much to the table as I can, so I probably should raid as Aff or Destro.

My big problem is the muscle memory. It used to be I could spend a couple/few hours at the training dummy and I was good for the tier/xpac, but now I need continual practice and refreshers. And I'm leery about starting that over while I'm still pretty crappy at Demo lol

Dude Demo is still performing better than half the of specs in the game in raids. I could understand if it was a bottom spec, but it is still very close to Destro and Afflic. If you want to train the rotation of Demo for m+ then just play it in the raids. If anyone gives you shit for not playing the other specs then they are idiots. It’s not like a Rogue playing Sub for example.

[Reachie]

Demo is still fucking great; I play it for raids, solo content, and Mythic+!

If you like the playstyle; I say; stick with it; I did; and after adjusting to the slower pace; it's still strong.