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  1. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    I literally received last piece I care about for now yesterday, this means it took me almost 2 months to replace my gear and I still don't really have raid azerite proper, I just lucked out on vendor rolls, so I am not that much in need.

    3 weeks hardly any effort? Guess if you are talking about ilvl 400 trash then like maybe?
    I wasn't talking about getting your BiS. I was talking about replacing your Uldir gear. And even before this, you weren't hitting BiS in mythic within 2 months. I'm guessing you got 80% of what you needed a month ago anyway through M+ chests and the first 4 bosses of mythic.
    Last edited by harruin; 2019-03-14 at 09:19 PM.

  2. #222
    Any treadmill preach steps on is bound to break a few gears.

  3. #223
    The Undying Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by justandulas View Post
    You absolutely had more buttons back then as a lock. just so happened that 90% of them were worthless.

    It was my personal opinion that i enjoyed the way warlocks played more back then vs now. It's just my opinion that they had a better class identity overall. Most of them did, good and bad.

    I just really dislike the way warlocks are designed currently. I didn't say they were badly designed, weren't more complex, or any of that.

    Just that i personally enjoyed my lock a hell of a lot more even as sbolt spam than i do now.
    Buttons you do not click are the same as buttons you do not have.

    Though I'll agree I have complaints about current warlock design. The expansion of the Soul Shard system was pretty much a big L for Blizzard. It doesn't make Affliction play better, I'd argue it makes it play worse. It works for Demonology, but the old Burning Ember system worked for Destro way better than the current implementation of Soul Shards.
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  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    My thoughts exactly.

    I totally don't understand this titanforging boogeyman either. It used to be somewhat a thing, but it's not now.

    Mythic raiders raid mythic first and foremost because raid challenge is fun for us. Raids is my cup of tea since Vanilla and last several expansions, aside from some oddball raid, raids were stellar and the quality is top notch there and BfA is not exception here.

    Our purple pixels becoming obsolete with new raid tier is something that is a thing from bloody TBC already. WoTLK simply streamlined the thing.

    That's why I don't understand this shit, it's as if some people are good ten years late with their bull about how this is an issue.
    So happy to have someone make some sense. A mythic raider will have better gear and ilvl than 90% of the wow population, just like always. Maybe the gap will be smaller, but that is due to m+ being added as another form of character gear progression.
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  5. #225
    Legendary! Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    Preach needed some more money? Time to make another shitpost video!
    Preach's channel is 100% demonetized, so there you go with your strawman.
    Quote Originally Posted by Danuser
    we created a story structure for Sylvanas that, on the surface, echoed many broad strokes of the road Garrosh took (...). These parallels were intentional. But it's within the nuance that we sought to show the story grow and change.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    BFA was about as nuanced as a golf club to the testicles/ovaries.

  6. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by harruin View Post
    I wasn't talking about getting your BiS. I was talking about replacing your Uldir gear. And even before this, you weren't hitting BiS in mythic within 2 months. I'm guessing you got 80% of what you needed a month ago anyway through M+ chests and the first 4 bosses of mythic.
    And why is that such an issue? Basically I understand your problem is that people get new gear with new raid tier then? Sorry, that's how works all the way from WoTLK. Heck TBC even, but I go easy on you.

    You could say then, OK, so let's give less gear to players Or make new raid come once in 8 months. Wonder what would happen if either would become a thing - that would be like at least 10 more preach videos right there.
    Last edited by Gaidax; 2019-03-14 at 09:25 PM.

  7. #227
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    And why is that such an issue? Basically I understand your problem is that people get new gear with new raid tier then? Sorry, that's how works all the way from WoTLK. Heck TBC even, but I go easy on you.
    Are you purposely being retarded? Keep "going easy on me" when you clearly can't read my post.

    Infracted: It's OK to disagree. It's not OK to call people retarded. {MoanaLisa}
    Last edited by MoanaLisa; 2019-03-14 at 09:28 PM.

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    There are smarter people than him.
    Considering your inability to refute the points in the op outside of attacking a youtuber, I'd have to assume you're not one of them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
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  9. #229
    The Lightbringer Molis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Its both fun and horrifying to watch this thread. Half the posts are "Preach just preaches bullshit and spouts nonsense for clicks." Interesting facts:
    -He's completely demonitized on youtube and crowdfunds his work so he has no reason to clickbait
    -Always asks for everyone elses opinions and re-evaluates his if the crowd tells him he's way off base
    -tells everyone that their stance isnt wrong for them, and he doesnt know their individual circumstances, but that he's making his stance by going off the data he's collected from the position he's in as a top level player and community figure who gets spoken to regularly.
    -openly acknowledges the good and bad about the game and the ideas behind it.

    All this is doing is proving how petty the people on these forums are. Popular man who is better at the game and who has a bigger voice than you is not really a direct threat to you, little forum trolls. He actually produces wonderfully balanced content and I thought his past few game mechanics videos have been great, personally this was maybe the weakest of them only because its a collection of what's already been said in his other videos, just in more direct and concise format on this topic.
    Preach is that you?

  10. #230
    Stood in the Fire Mightytasty's Avatar
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    Deeply saddened by the number of blind Preach haters and BfA supporters in this thread. I guess it makes sense because all of the people who agree with his philosophy on WoW have already quit the game and no longer browse this site.

    How anyone can argue that player progression isn’t completely broken at max level is beyond me. Chasing BiS has been replaced by grinding Azerite. As many many others have said, I can’t name a single piece of gear my character is currently wearing and it’s a HUGE problem. He brings up a really good point: why would a heroic raider continue to farm Dazaralor after killing Jaina once? His heroic gear will be replaced in 3 months by normal mode Azshara gear.

    Another great point which Preach didn’t address in this video (but has in the past): Titanforging also killed the DPS rankings scene which used to be a fun part of farm.

  11. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by Mightytasty View Post
    Chasing BiS has been replaced by grinding Azerite. As many many others have said, I can’t name a single piece of gear my character is currently wearing and it’s a HUGE problem. He brings up a really good point: why would a heroic raider continue to farm Dazaralor after killing Jaina once? His heroic gear will be replaced in 3 months by normal mode Azshara gear.
    First two points are objectively incorrect, there is a very clear bis to gun for and there are certainly items you very well know.

    The other point is quite literally how WoW is working for many many years all the way from WoTLK and even before really. Why is new raid tier obsoleting previous tier suddenly is a such a problem now? Where have you been back in 2008 with this?

  12. #232
    I am Murloc! DrMcNinja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oplawlz View Post
    Considering your inability to refute the points in the op outside of attacking a youtuber, I'd have to assume you're not one of them.
    I'd say the treadmill is stronger than ever, or rather, the treadmill changes. There's barely anything that you currently wear that will remain once the next tier (read: season) starts.

    And one of Preach's points is that gearing up after clearing your desired difficulty is completely redundant; because the power gap between tiers is so huge, and the number of sources for high-end gear is so high, that farming and reclearing for the 5 extra ilvls, the extra socket, and so forth, is just not worth it.

    There is no unique bonus on gear from a specific raid like you had with tier sets, meaning that strong bonuses could last longer and be worth playing for no longer exist. People raided Nighthold even when Antorus was out, because it still had some good loot in it. Now? Why would you raid Uldir? All the trinkets there have silly effects that aren't worth the effort, while that juicy On Use for X stat trinket comes from a Dungeon, or a lucky WQ Titanforge.

    The treadmill used to be consistent, now it's just a massive rush at the start of the season and a dip later on. I'm only 2/9 Mythic, the raid has been out for only a few months and I'm already stacked in full Mythic level gear. The gear drops from the raid barely count as an incentive or an upgrade anymore.

    And this all stems form Blizzard's desire to avoid things like the Arcanocrystal, but it only created another extreme: One where gear doesn't last long enough and is obtained so easily that it's not interesting anymore.
    Last edited by DrMcNinja; 2019-03-14 at 09:55 PM.

  13. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    Can you clarify how/why did gear made you want to continue playing (after reaching your patch goal) in older days?
    I dont see how.

    The only thing i can think about is PvP.
    Having the best gear opened up a whole new world of ass kicking in random BG's.
    It was just progression. Let me step into the next tier more prepared for progress. Now I am ready for progress next tier already. No reason to keep pushing after the next to bosses on mythic die. Used to have reasons to continue. Either I could get more powerful. Or my friends could get more powerful. Now its just 3-4 months of "who will get an item level higher this week on the slot machine" because we are geared completely out already.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Slowpoke is a Gamer View Post
    TBF Youtube does not make it hard to blame the creator. In fact Youtube has fostered a business model for these people of "play for clicks." And in 2017 the hot thing was shock videos (See: the infamous Logan Paul Suicide Forest video), then in 2018 it was Rage Baiting, now in 2019 it looks like the hot thing is going to be fueling conspiracies.
    Right.. I suppose if I gave a single fuck about the business of YouTube you might have a point. I just tend to watch what I feel like it. Sometimes I get what I am looking for and sometimes I get got. Boohoo right?

  14. #234
    Merely a Setback Queen of Hamsters's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bucks01 View Post
    How many alt accounts do you have Preach?
    He's gotta fuel the controversies somehow!

    "BfA supporters", these people are as political about a PG13 game as others are about child labour, sex trafficking or partisan politics.
    Newsflash to the hatorade chuggers: There's always been people who enjoyed the game, and those who didn't. Yes, ALWAYS.
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  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by justandulas View Post
    Could it be that we just disagree with your highness? Get off your high horse.

    I agree with everything he said. the game had RPG elements to them. You remember them? Because WoW was designed after games like EQ1 and AD&D boardgames, it had actual RPG mechanics that made your character YOUR OWN.
    Did it? I do not remember any RPG element from classic.

    Levelling skills is not RPG. Using a sword rather than a mace is not RPG.
    Last edited by Sansnom; 2019-03-15 at 12:06 AM.

  16. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by Queen of Hamsters View Post
    He's gotta fuel the controversies somehow!

    "BfA supporters", these people are as political about a PG13 game as others are about child labour, sex trafficking or partisan politics.
    Newsflash to the hatorade chuggers: There's always been people who enjoyed the game, and those who didn't. Yes, ALWAYS.
    Current WoW has more in common with D3 than it's roots in MMORPG's like Vanilla WoW or EQ1. That's fine, there's obviously a big segment of players out there who enjoy that seasonal gameplay over character development over a slow time.

    There's no need for us to attack one another, there's room for both current and classic to co-exist. They appeal to two different wow gamers

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by harruin View Post
    The obsolescence has never been this fast though. We're talking old gear being fully replaced within a week with moderate effort. Fully replaced in 3 weeks with hardly any effort. Then slamming into a wall and only getting minor upgrades after that.
    Yeah I replaced my Uldir gear relatively quickly, I wouldn't say it was low effort though. Tbh it felt roughly the same as it has most tiers, potentially even a bit slower as there wasn't any split raiding done this time round.

    That was clearing BoD Norm + Heroic week 1, hitting 1800 in 2's week 1 for the 405+ chest and spamming 10+s as much as possible.

    Still very much chasing gear still using a suboptimal helm and heroic shoulders not seeing the 2 key azerite pieces in raid. Also needing cloak, ring & belt being the most key items. 412 or 413 atm, so still a tonne of room for gear improvement doing most of what I have available to me weekly to continue progressing.

    If someone's already done and over 415 then grats for getting so lucky I guess.

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by Queen of Hamsters View Post
    What was the point of playing anymore during say, WOTLK...?

    Because I 100% remember literally "being done" for the level I played at and the gear I could obtain. Most weeks during ICC outside of raiding, was spent farming herbs of Argent Tournament, not gearing. If your only reason for playing is to get gear, you've been pretty limited since Classic ended. And during Classic you had the RNG gods shitting in your face as a hurdle.
    Yeah. I wasn't 2 bosses from the end of progress and knowing that either myself or my whole raid team was going to get next to nothing out of the raid zone for the next 5 months when a zone was less than two months old (alright, Naxx.. sure.. you got me there but not with the rest). If you want to use ICC as the example.. sure.. end of the expansion year long raid.. right.. I stopped raiding that one after about 6 months and 4-5 of my buddies got the legendary axe because they were kind enough to do some Uldar with me so all the healers could get the legendary mace. You see? Reasons...

    Now..

    Fucking nothing. Geared out to the max 2 months in. Everyone in the team. Unsub until 8.2 with everyone else in the guild until new content comes out after the last 2 mythic bosses die. Then you can just do all the time gated horse shit over a weekend too. I want to play the game more.. but it just dies after about a month if you can clear mythic fairly quickly.

    Sure I could herb. Or mine. But why.. I have like 20 million gold from the give away in the previous last 2 expansions. I get it.. gearing might not be the ONLY problem.. there are more.. but its certainly is one.

    In classic sure.. I might not be getting the item but someone is.. shit man.. I see mythic gear getting DEed on the reggie.. already.. because no one needs that shit. That is a problem. Then in 8.2 it will all be hot garbage in a week or two from shit like world quests.
    Last edited by Low Hanging Fruit; 2019-03-14 at 10:00 PM.

  19. #239
    The Video has some valid points, but other tend to stretch the truth a bit far.

    Firstly, I'm not a Mythic raider, never have been. Back in my day we didn't even have Mythic Raids... but at that level, there is always an incentive to farm the current Tier for gear, even if we ignore WF/TF drops, going into the next Tier with BiS gear and multiple sets to swap out (AoE Vs ST) is always a bonus. Yes, you might replace many of those pieces quite quickly, but you also might not.

    However, as a Casual raider (like I am these days, focusing on Heroic), there is less incentive to gear up during Farm and we see a steady drop off in attendance after getting AOTC, even more so after getting the Meta Mount. This is because you can casually gear in M+ on your terms (no set raid nights), WF's, World Boss and then Catchup gear in the next Tier. Not to mention, the average guild takes a few weeks even months to clear Heroic so there's plenty of gear to be had during progression.

    This has created a "Seasons" effect in WOW. I've seen it my guild and hear about it from others. Players re-sub, get AOTC, then un-sub till the next Tier.
    It's also made players focus more on Raider.IO (which I despise) because it's rather easier to get a decent Ilvl these days.
    Lastly, the point about the same items being BiS for the whole game is, at the moment, very Valid. Farming the same M+ dungeons hoping for the same items at the "new" ilvl is tedious at best!

  20. #240
    Quote Originally Posted by Low Hanging Fruit View Post
    It was just progression. Let me step into the next tier more prepared for progress. Now I am ready for progress next tier already. No reason to keep pushing after the next to bosses on mythic die. Used to have reasons to continue. Either I could get more powerful. Or my friends could get more powerful. Now its just 3-4 months of "who will get an item level higher this week on the slot machine" because we are geared completely out already.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Right.. I suppose if I gave a single fuck about the business of YouTube you might have a point. I just tend to watch what I feel like it. Sometimes I get what I am looking for and sometimes I get got. Boohoo right?
    So how is the first part of what you said is different now? Gear soft reset on tier launch is happening for many years, nothing changed. If you want to say you were preparing for next tier previously despite the very same reset happening back then, then why it's suddenly not same thing now?

    It's literally same, new tier comes and with it new gear that obsoleted old gear and you still can be carried a tiny bit by old gear but that's about it. I simply don't understand why you think it's so different now?

    The only thing you could say that now we get torrential rains of new gear, which is true, but then what - you want to nerf gear drops amount? I don't understand.

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