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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Try to suggest to prune some CC spells without getting screeched at.

    Thing just is, almost every class has their standard toolkit consisting out of:
    Interrupt
    CC Spell(s)
    Defensive CD('s)
    Offensive CD('s)
    Yeah, it's hard to put that genie back in the bottle. Personally I much preferred cc and interrupts being more powerful but limited to the classes it made sense for. Even in bc some of the things were over the top (looking at you spriest+lock) but those can be addressed individually. Rock paper scissors is just more fun in an rpg pvp setting to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    Nah nah, see... I live by one simple creed: You might catch more flies with honey, but to catch honeys you gotta be fly.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by oplawlz View Post
    I am pretty curious about the number of people that actually watch arenas. I also find nonstop pillar humping to be really boring to watch, but I guess other people don't?
    There's a reason why WoW Arena is not popular for spectating.

  3. #23
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    you mean how pillar humping gives melee a super unfair advantage?
    Quote Originally Posted by solvexx View Post
    Having multiple pillars is unbalanced towards multiple specs already. What is the difference?
    Found the ranged DPS players! Psst, your healers also depend on the pillars to survive. Your 1200 rating is showing.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
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  4. #24
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    Found the ranged DPS players! Psst, your healers also depend on the pillars to survive. Your 1200 rating is showing.
    Yes... It does help healers.... But it still helps melee note then any other, because if an entire fight happens around a pillar, healers will be negitivly effected, ranged DPS very VERY negitivly effected. And melee not really effected at all
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  5. #25
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Yes... It does help healers.... But it still helps melee note then any other, because if an entire fight happens around a pillar, healers will be negitivly effected, ranged DPS very VERY negitivly effected. And melee not really effected at all
    It's called balance. You know what ranged have? Ranged abilities... With no LoS there would be 0 melee comps and all the matches will just be 2-3 ranged DPS just standing there freely CCing anything they want and sniping anyone they want.

    Blizz tried introducing an arena like that back in WoD IIRC (it had LoS that would randomly disappear and reappear throughout match), it lasted a few weeks before they had to delete it from the game.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    Blizz tried introducing an arena like that back in WoD IIRC (it had LoS that would randomly disappear and reappear throughout match), it lasted a few weeks before they had to delete it from the game.
    That was Ring of Valor, introduced in Wotlk, probably the most imbalanced Arena ever.

    First off, teams spawned directly within charge / Death grip range, giving a huge edge to Melee teams.
    Then, Fire randomnly spawned on the sides that dealt damage (which was quickly removed).

    Also, two sets of pillars rotated with being up, you could stand on top of them as well, if you stood on them while they moved up, putting you out of Melee Range.

    Arena was removed after Wotlk, Afaik.

  7. #27
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    That was Ring of Valor, introduced in Wotlk, probably the most imbalanced Arena ever.

    First off, teams spawned directly within charge / Death grip range, giving a huge edge to Melee teams.
    Then, Fire randomnly spawned on the sides that dealt damage (which was quickly removed).

    Also, two sets of pillars rotated with being up, you could stand on top of them as well, if you stood on them while they moved up, putting you out of Melee Range.

    Arena was removed after Wotlk, Afaik.
    Yo that actually sounds pretty fun. They should put it in a Brawl.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    Found the ranged DPS players! Psst, your healers also depend on the pillars to survive. Your 1200 rating is showing.
    I only play melee, and I am 2400 this expansion. Solvexx-frostmourne. Feel free to look me up.

    Just pointing out your logic inconsistencies. Holy fuck you are toxic.

  9. #29
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solvexx View Post
    I only play melee, and I am 2400 this expansion. Solvexx-frostmourne. Feel free to look me up.

    Just pointing out your logic inconsistencies. Holy fuck you are toxic.
    Just looked you up and you're 1457. Nice try.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  10. #30
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
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    ..you have to be pretty daft to look at that picture, look at the NAME, IE "mecha", and then not realize that the floor 99% for certain moves or shifts in some fashion, more than likely creating LoS.

    Teaser Trailer for a short film I wrote and am directing
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lkmagk8G4vM

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    Just looked you up and you're 1457. Nice try.
    What's wrong with you?

    https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/ch...mourne/solvexx

    https://check-pvp.fr/database/charac...xx-Frostmourne

    You are so unbelievably toxic.

  12. #32
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solvexx View Post
    Still waiting on that 2400 link.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by IllidankaTrump View Post
    Not sure, but when looking at the picture posted for the new Arena Map in Patch 8.2 it looks like it has no objects or structures to hide behind (LOS).
    That is unless there's something coming out of that center hole. Even then, it would be pretty unique.

    I'd like to see a map where there is absolutely no pillar hugging.

    Odds are it's going to be a dynamic map where parts of the metal chunks rise and fall forming different patterns. I honestly can't see them making a no LoS arena.
    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    Trust me.

    Zyky is better than you.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    Still waiting on that 2400 link.
    It's easy to see in the second link. It says highest personal rating: 2407 in 2s, 2216 in 3s

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCorgi View Post
    It's easy to see in the second link. It says highest personal rating: 2407 in 2s, 2216 in 3s
    Just stop responding to Saverem. He's a barely-functional toxic, ignorant troll.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    I just have a hard time imagining such a revamp, even if it would happen.

    The problem is that even if you were to remove / nerf aspects that make pillar hugging a neccessity, you would create just other problems.

    You would have to revamp CC / DR heavily, which would make a lot of CC spells feel useless, imagine if almost anything has DR, high CC classes would have a good chunk of their spells basically being next to useless because they always on DR.

    Even then, you would have to talk about Burst damage, without pillars, certain Burst combo's would be very difficult to to deal with, what is a possible to disable burst combo's? CC, the one thing we wanted to nerf.

    Let's say they just flat out nerf the burst potential and CC, now you end up with a PvE hybrid where the match will almost always turn into a Mana / dampening game where the one wins that deals enough damage while also preventing the enemy healer from drinking - Because no one is able to kill each other as we nerfed CC chains and burst into the ground.

    The truth is simply is: a flat Arena floor without any obstacles is a boring battlefield, because it offers no tactical element to play with.
    There's a reason why the maps in a lot of PvP games aren't just flat circles.



    Try to suggest to prune some CC spells without getting screeched at.

    Thing just is, almost every class has their standard toolkit consisting out of:
    Interrupt
    CC Spell(s)
    Defensive CD('s)
    Offensive CD('s)
    ITs almost like trying to make WoW into a small-scale competitive PvP was a bad idea from the first time it was mentioned.

    Weird.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Kagthul View Post
    ITs almost like trying to make WoW into a small-scale competitive PvP was a bad idea from the first time it was mentioned.
    And its large(r) scale counterparts also suffer from a slew of issues.

    If you look at RBG, until they removed Massgrip from Dps DK, the Massgrip+Solar Beam+Vortex Combo was utterly OP.

    Tank DH is the supreme FC, because it has unrivaled mobility and (ranged) CC for a Tank spec.

    Then you have this amazing situation with Assa rogues and Hpally.
    Enemy has (a) Assa Rogue(s)?
    Better have some Hpally for Poison dispel, else you're going to lose any big fight.

    At least a single Rogue is mandatory for RBG, which in turn makes DH close to mandatory because they're the only serious counter to Rogues in Gilneas / EotS / AB.

    Those are just some, rather specific examples, out of RBG.

    If you look at really large scale such as Ashran or AV, it obviously turns into a brainless AoE fest for Ranged specs, which in my opinion barely resembles PvP anymore.

    Thing is, PvP is an afterthought to this game, this is the core issue, not the game mode itself.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2019-03-27 at 11:53 PM.

  17. #37
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    It's called balance. You know what ranged have? Ranged abilities... With no LoS there would be 0 melee comps and all the matches will just be 2-3 ranged DPS just standing there freely CCing anything they want and sniping anyone they want.

    Blizz tried introducing an arena like that back in WoD IIRC (it had LoS that would randomly disappear and reappear throughout match), it lasted a few weeks before they had to delete it from the game.
    1. it was wotlk not wod, also please dont make up shit "deleted after a couple weeks"
    it lasted all the way from 3.0 till 3.2 before they moved the wall of fire
    4.0 it was removed to fix bugs
    it was then readded in 4.2
    with mop it was removed

    2. yes, there would still very much be melee comps, because melee dont need pillars to absolutly lock down and fuck down a squishy caster
    please dont make up shit
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    1. it was wotlk not wod, also please dont make up shit "deleted after a couple weeks"
    it lasted all the way from 3.0 till 3.2 before they moved the wall of fire
    4.0 it was removed to fix bugs
    it was then readded in 4.2
    with mop it was removed

    2. yes, there would still very much be melee comps, because melee dont need pillars to absolutly lock down and fuck down a squishy caster
    please dont make up shit
    Careful! H'es going to start asking for your arena exp and then call you 1200 despite providing armouries that show you have more knowledge and exp than him!

  19. #39
    The Hive Mind Demetrion's Avatar
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    What I would love to see here is the random pillars appearing but staying up for the whole game. They could randomize it in the arena preparation.

    For example, you zone in, and during the arena preparation timer random pillars appear from the ground forming the arena for that match. Next game, the pillar composition would be totally different than it was.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Locutus of Borg View Post
    What I would love to see here is the random pillars appearing but staying up for the whole game. They could randomize it in the arena preparation.

    For example, you zone in, and during the arena preparation timer random pillars appear from the ground forming the arena for that match. Next game, the pillar composition would be totally different than it was.
    Much better than random pillars appearing and disappearing during game

    There will never be arena without los because of how it will affect gameplay. Healers will have no way to kite melees and casters will CC every healer much much easier

    If they will ever decide to add pillar free arena i bet they will change their mind in next patch. We already have some maps that promote specific compositons, it's better to add more balanced arenas like Nagrand Arena

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