United Horde Vs Alliance

[Amaterasu65]

The Horde are technically weaker right now. The Alliance should never lose with op heroes and tech in their ranks. For story's sake however.... There will never be a clear winner.

[Niroshi]

Even without the overpowered lore characters the Alliance would still probably win, assuming they weren't nerfed for the sake of the story.

Just think of all the stuff they wrote the Alliance as having in BFA alone. Helicarriers, Gnomish aircraft, Gnomish spider tanks, unmanned drones in Stormwind, the same kind of Azerite tank that the Horde have, standard siege tanks capable of supporting an entire squad, and light based shields they can deploy at fixed points. They also have Dwarven golems, both Ironforge and Dark Iron variants. That's ignoring their space ship.

Racially the Alliance has the only real Light infused race, and the only Void infused race. Void Elves seem to specialize in troop movement and assassination and their mode of travel has so far had no counter. Very few others seem to be able to even access the Void like they can. Lightforged just murder things really well. Dark Iron have the ability to summon lava elementals. Night Elves are either crazy forest warriors or people who can literally be bears. Worgen are actual Werewolves. Kul'Tirans are almost big enough to match Orcs in size. Humans in general are crazy strong spell casters, probably the most gifted spellcasters in the franchise. Gnomes are an entire species of geniuses.

An Alliance not written to be stupid and useless is ridiculous.

[RangerDaz]

I think this poll is a bit silly, especially as it is too basic and the context that is being polled. That is why i won't vote on it.

Right now i think the Alliance will win, simply because the Alliance has no inner fracture and the horde has (again).

It was such a bad move turning Sylvanas into a Garrosh II, i mean, what was Blizzard thinking? That people wouldn't notice the MoP faction war plot all over again? They are ruining great Warcraft characters with this nonsense war.

I do get that they wanted to make a cool faction war for the theme of the expansion, but hey, they could have been much more creative with much more consistent and innovative ideas, without changing the consistance of the character of each faction leader.

"You can't kill hope Sylvanas!" "Can't I? Burn it!" .... I still didn't get over this badly written concept of the destruction of Teldrassil.

[Saverem]

Hi , I'm want to ask a question about the outcome of the war in BfA if The Horde was united and their goal was to make the Alliance bend the knee or to wipe it out ( yea yea i know for game play no faction will be wipe out). Why I make this post is because in the last two wars MoP and BfA the Horde never stood as one, always to have a rebellion inside of it when was the war against the Alliance.
So united Horde against the Alliance in BfA, i do not think the Warchief matters as long the goal is to kneel or wipe the Alliance, do you think the Alliance will stand a chance or will be a more balance war ?

I voted Horde because I'm a fanboy, but lorewise, the Alliance is a lot stronger right now. They have A LOT of powerful lore heroes behind their banner.

Jaina alone literally froze an ocean and then peaced out without a scratch on her during our RAID against her and is the strongest Mage. Malfurian is arguable the strongest Druid in lore. Turalyon the strongest living Pally. Velen the strongest Priest. Tyrande is like 10k+ years old and is a powerful Priest/Hunter. Alliance even technically has the Black Prince on their side since he chose to side with them over the Horde.

[Newname1234567890]

I mean at this point the Horde in BFA really hasn't had a large defection of troop's and their being destroyed.

Maybe if Jaina didn't show up in the Seige of Lordereon the Horde might be winning but she did and they're not.

[Dakhath]

The Horde wouldn't stand a chance against the Alliance if the game being an MMO didn't dictate how things have to go.

[Friendlyimmolation]

A United Horde pre mop would win, a United Horde in BFA would only win if Anduin continues to kneecap his own faction.

[Toho]

Whichever side stops being stupid will win.
No question about it.

If they both stop being stupid then I would say the Alliance will win.
They just have too much going for them.

Territory, resources, numbers, OP assets like the Wild Gods or Vindicaar and of course OP characters.

The Horde might sneak in some good gut punches and do some real damage but there is no way they can keep it up consistently.

[TheFirstOnes]

I hate what if's. Alliance bolos either way.

[MikeBogina]

If everyone fell in line with Garrosh, Horde would have won. If everyone fell in line with Sylvanas, Horde would have Malfurion and Anduin killed and stand a far better chance against the Alliance, but not sure if they can stomp anymore.

When Garrosh was in charge, he understood that a faction needs powers and he amassed quite a few before he downfall. The Horde seems to have not put any of it to use or focus on powers until Sylvanas took charge, who is going to put Forsaken methods first and rightfully so since none of the other bigger players in the Horde have brought any powers to the table.

If a Horde was truly unified, no questions or doubts and worked together, the Alliance probably would never stand a chance. Blight and Necromancy support would turn the tide of every battle.

[Dagoth Ur]

Secret purpose behind this poll was actually to find out whos vote to detract from the other new warchief poll. Op is a genius!

[etheldald]

The horde united at the time of pandaria would have won.

it's funny, garrosh got the upper hand after his attack on theramore and the bomb that was a military success with bringing elite forces and commanders to one place.
and then he decided to throw his advantage by turning the horde against him later on.

is more or less what sylvanas is doing, after capturing the city she randomly decided that there was nothing of value (resources and hostages after capturing and enemy capital) and literally burned her advantage
Basically, both warchiefs decided to escalate the war under their terms and to their advantage, only to throw it away.

Now? the alliance gained so much powers up and military forces that is not even funny.
jaina got buffed after surviving the mana bomb, absorbing part of their powers and the power of the thunder king and became arguably the most important person in the alliance who literally saved it like 3 times and being now the leader of another nation.

Tyrande went ultra instinct
malfurion is basically the most powerful mortal in azeroth.
velen is THE priest.
Alleria became the first void elf... ect.
not even speaking of the forces that joined.

the difference being.. probably is that the alliance don't have their minds focused only in war, by example the gnomes uses their tech for mundane things,for battle? not so much.
and strategy as well, anduin is not looking for ways to conquer the world but rather in how to save it.

in another note, they aren't resorting to "dishonorable" tactics" and yet, as for now (8.1.5) they still are winning
i feel like the alliance is pulling their punches for bfa.

[Super Dickmann]

in another note, they aren't resorting to "dishonorable" tactics" and yet, as for now (8.1.5) they still are winning
i feel like the alliance is pulling their punches for bfa.

In WoW, moral rectitude is a form of reality warping. A bad guy will have to face logistical problems, like Sylvanas worrying about how Org is more exposed than Stormwind or the importance of taking Teldrassil before reinforcements arrive. Her troops will still be on the field when she gives the order for the gas to fall, even if she told them not to overextend, and that'll be commented on. Attacks on the capital of her new ally will actually damage that ally's ability to wage war. When she does things that annoy her allies, this will be brought up and they may even betray her (eventually).

On the other hand, muh honor allows Rexxar's azerite bombs to home in, so even when you drop them on your own side and can't avoid it because of the quest design, inanimate metal can differentiate and only hit Alliance so that he's not stained. Need to get to another continent? Don't worry, no messy conquest here, the fleet will teleport there and Brill will just vanish. The people there? Eh, who cares, it's probably Sylvanas' fault anyway. When Anduin needs a diversion, an army of void elves, worgen and night elves will spontaneously materialize who are all too glad to kill themselves to enable this attack on the city that isn't even meant to decisively defeat the Zandalari. No dealing with the consequences of troops being sent to die here. Oh, the races are completely incompatible, including two cosmically competing forces? Meh, we're all buddies in the end.

It's an incredibly cowardly narrative, which does get us to the point where the Alliance are winning and not even too fussed about all that genocide or the shit the Horde have done since the pre-patch, whereas the Horde is imploding while failing to accomplish anything.

[dekal]

The united horde had trouble in the war of thorns against just the night elves. Its hard to see them winning against the Alliance.

[ausoin]

If a Horde was truly unified, no questions or doubts and worked together, the Alliance probably would never stand a chance. Blight and Necromancy support would turn the tide of every battle.

Jaina alone countered the Blight in 1 second and she almost destroyed Ogrimmar, united Horde or not. Wide spread necromancy and blight would have turned every neutral organization like the Argent Crusade, Cenarion circle and Dalaran against the Horde, the people will never submit to being slaves and exterminated, they will destroy the world to prevent that.

[Varodoc]

Sylvanas herself in A Good War notes how the Horde must quickly break the Alliance, otherwise they would most likely not be able to resist against Alliance retaliation.

[MikeBogina]

Jaina alone countered the Blight in 1 second

There's a city full of it that says otherwise.

she almost destroyed Ogrimmar

using an artifact that she no longer possess.

Wide spread necromancy and blight would have turned every neutral organization like the Argent Crusade, Cenarion circle and Dalaran against the Horde

And yet none of them have stepped forward to stop Sylvanas who has used it quite a few times over the years. And a unified Horde, who has members in those organizations would just be an easier way to sabotage those organizations with blight. But really, they don't seem to care of the Horde's use when they do it to the Alliance. Dalaran regretted aiding Theramore, because they never intended to actually take action against the Horde only ever did when the dictator got in charge.

the people will never submit to being slaves and exterminated

that's the beauty with necromancy and blight. Necromancy doesn't care if you want to be a slave or not(and from what we've seen, people change their minds once they're resurrected) and the blight doesn't care if you want to be exterminated or not

they will destroy the world to prevent that

The Alliance would go nuclear to stop the Horde, is that what you're saying? xD

All those neutral factions and characters who don't care about the faction conflict all of a sudden would care if Jaina was trying to blow up the world.

[ausoin]

There's a city full of it that says otherwise.

That's the second wave of blight at that point both sides left the battlefield, the first wave was countered easily by Jaina. Shamans too can counter the blight with the wind like what Thrall did during the first siege.

using an artifact that she no longer possess.

So? If the Horde was united in Mop how would that prevented Jaina from destroying Ogrimmar? Besides its in Dalaran, and they are not going to stay neutral forever if entire races are being exterminated, especially since most of the population is human who are Sylvanas number 1 target.

And yet none of them have stepped forward to stop Sylvanas who has used it quite a few times over the years. And a unified Horde, who has members in those organizations would just be an easier way to sabotage those organizations with blight. But really, they don't seem to care of the Horde's use when they do it to the Alliance. Dalaran regretted aiding Theramore, because they never intended to actually take action against the Horde only ever did when the dictator got in charge.

If the blight is used in far more quantities against everyone, they are not going to do nothing, for example, the Silver hand order joined the war despite being neutral before.

that's the beauty with necromancy and blight. Necromancy doesn't care if you want to be a slave or not(and from what we've seen, people change their minds once they're resurrected) and the blight doesn't care if you want to be exterminated or not

Good luck against countless other world ending threats with a small force after defeating an enemy who would fight to the last person because of the acts of a certain genius. And hoping the resurrected people don't backstab you like when Godfrey did with Sylvanas.

The Alliance would go nuclear to stop the Horde, is that what you're saying? xD

Yep, mana bombing everything and summoning elementals of fire to burn everyting, like what the dark irons did.

All those neutral factions and characters who don't care about the faction conflict all of a sudden would care if Jaina was trying to blow up the world.

If they are losing and extinction is the result of defeat, then no.

Right now the Horde is lorewise weeks from defeat, despite the fact their forces are united, Baine didnt turn against Sylvanas until after the siege of Zandalar, and Saurfang is one man. There arent yet any actuall rebellions inside the Horde, and yet they are losing the war, hm....

[Linkedblade]

Current horde vs current Alliance would still have the horde lose even if they were united, Jaina has become OP, the Vindicar and now with a buffed Tyrande, Malfurion and Alleria which even in the hypotetical case they aren't near of the level of Jaina, those 3 are still more powerful than Baine, Saurfang or even Thalyssra. However the alliance lacks strategy which always comes back to bite back their ass so probably the outcome will be a long and bloody war with heavy casualties but the alliance win because they have many instant win buttons

Yeah all of the horde leaders are muggles. Baine, Saurfang, Lorthemar, Geyarah are all warrior or rangers. Only real power is Sylvanas.

I don't think the Vindicar is anywhere near combat ready. I'm not exactly sure how compatible azerite and argunite are, but if it can be retrofitted to work with azerite then we can talk

[zlygork]

I'm generally not into comparing power levels because there is more to fights/wars than dick size.... A simple peon can kill a war hero if the pitchfork hits the right spot.

That said, the alliance simply has an overwhelming advantage this time around, arguably even if the Zandalari hadn't lost its fleet. I assume the wild gods of the nelves and the troll loa cancel each other out, the horde's superior physical strength (in terms of individuals) gets cancelled out by the alliance's technological superiority...

In the end it kind of comes up to the god-like leaders of each faction, with just about every alliance leader but Gelbin being super powerful, and the horde only having Sylvanas (And Thrall?). For the sake of fairness, I'll assume that the Vindicaar is indeed rendered useless for whatever reason.

Now, if the horde was able to turn the alliance against itself, then they could win regardless of how much of a military disadvantage they are at. Wars are not won with military might alone.