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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathasil View Post
    In Legion, i was ganked two times while doing the FFA WQs on a freshly dinged Alt. I did them regurarily because they were quick and sometimes even fun. In BFA i would never enable WM unless Blizzard litterally removes the ability to log in without it.

    So, from my PoV, Legion did a much better job to get me exposed to wPvP than BFA.
    They did a better job because they exposed you to almost zero pvp?

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Yunaqt View Post
    They did a better job because they exposed you to almost zero pvp?
    Almost zero is infinetly more than zero, is it not?

    In Legion i did multiple FFA PvP WQs every day. I would like to see a sum of hours time played over Legion that i spent flagged for PvP, attackable for everyone...but there is no such statistic. It would be multiple hours. Both on geared mains that could pretty much one-shot other questers and on undergeared Alts that could be one-shot by almost anybody else.
    In BFA i have had WM enabled ~2mins on every char to hand in the "look, that's where the PvP vendor is"-quest in Boralus...that's it. And even if they started handing out ilvl500 for ganking players at flightmasters next time: I don't want to be a part of it.

    WPvP has never been for me. I'm not looking for it, i'm not wanting to do it, i see no appeal in it. BUT if they manage to offer gameplay that drags me in without totally putting me off? Win-Win, i guess.
    Warmode has not done that. At all. For multiple reasons:
    #1: Locking away fun utility class abilities in a time where many specs are in dire need of more "fun stuff" is bad desing. I still remember when they first announced the system and here on these forums a BLOOD DK wrote: "I don't see why this is a problem. The only things you gain from PvP talents as a Blood DK is self healing and CC; why would i need that?"
    #2: The reward structure of the game is not to my liking right now....but the PvP reward structure in particular pretty much means that everything except the transmog-set-vendor is completely pointless to me.
    #3: The entire system is bribing people into playing the game a certain way. Why? If the mode was actually FUN, it would not need a bribe. To equal out the "time lost due to PvP"....hello? Shouldn't people playing in this mode play for the fucking sake of doing PvP? How can they LOSE TIME doing what they play this game for to do?!
    #4: It's faction based. BFA has made me remember which aspect of the game (that was pretty much dormant since WC2) i dislike the most. Yep, this one.

    So, again, from my PoV: If you are somebody who likes and enjoys wPvP the Legion WQs gave you the opportunity to lurk there and hunt people. Since it was FFA PvP (for the "bigger" quests, not the towers, obviously) all you needed was ONE other player...and there was PvP.
    The Legion version of wPvP made me participate - Wamode does not. That's just the kind of "data point" i can add for me personally.

    Edit:
    Also, i'm playing on an extremely small German RP server in nightly-morning hours. Of course there was very little PvP going on at these quest locations for me - and i STILL was ganked twice! That's quite remarkable, really.
    IF i were to enable warmode, the kind of server i play on would still limit the amount of players i see. It would be more, obviously, but still limited. So not even that is a point that warmode is able to score fully.
    Last edited by Nathasil; 2019-04-02 at 04:20 AM.

  3. #23
    The Lightbringer therealstegblob's Avatar
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    Legion WPVP was, in my experience, an infinite amount of times superior to BFA. I mean, BFA is okay I guess because of War Mode but it's a far cry from the PVP world quests and Dalaran Sewers. I could log on at literally any time of day and there was active, concentrated WPVP happening somewhere literally 24/7. I log onto BFA and search relentlessly for a few flagged Alliance and I'm lucky to run into any; and a good 3/4ths of the time I find some, it's because it's 60 of them in a rapesquad farming gear.
    i am not the real stegblob. My blog where I review books and crap.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalorakk View Post
    Only issue I have with it is on OCE realms Alliance is dominant but gets the increased bonus from being outnumbered on the NA servers, so alliance in OCE is double incentivised to have WM on and camp all the turtle quests
    Same seems to happen in EU RP realms. Alliance is dominant in RP realms and at the same time we get the buff because it is region wide.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by therealstegblob View Post
    Legion WPVP was, in my experience, an infinite amount of times superior to BFA. I mean, BFA is okay I guess because of War Mode but it's a far cry from the PVP world quests and Dalaran Sewers. I could log on at literally any time of day and there was active, concentrated WPVP happening somewhere literally 24/7. I log onto BFA and search relentlessly for a few flagged Alliance and I'm lucky to run into any; and a good 3/4ths of the time I find some, it's because it's 60 of them in a rapesquad farming gear.
    Legion WPvP was a few specific specs with proper legendaries being one man armies. I don't think WPvP was as broken at any time as much as in Legion, maybe for tanks during mid Cata.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlae View Post
    Not sure I'd consider outnumbering stuff via numbers in group to be 'good wpvp', especially when the servers are in a place to where when you fight 40v40 you can hardly do anything from the server lag or respond at all.
    This is wpvp as it has always been. Always been ganking, always been outnumbering people. Do with that info what you will.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by nyc81991 View Post
    It's definitely not at it's peak right now. Nothing about WoW right now is at it's peak right now.
    wpvp is, m+ is, pug culture in general is, open world is.

    I'd also say raiding is at one of its high points too, as is arena.

    The things suffering right now is class design, although that was helped a lot in 8.1.5 and will only get better as haste levels rise and with the azerite rework in 8.2.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Sliske View Post
    wpvp is, m+ is, pug culture in general is, open world is.
    I am not so sure about open world. People try to do the fastest world quests and then get back to other activities. The only open world is farming herbs. I think TBC and to a lesser degree Wrath and MoP had more open world activity (due to the need to do far more dailies per day for a longer time than was needed to cap rep in BfA as well as farming profession materials, particularly in TBC with Primal farming). I agree with the rest (though I don't find anything commentable about PuG culture doing great, it's imo a shit culture and the worst part of the game).
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I am not so sure about open world. People try to do the fastest world quests and then get back to other activities. The only open world is farming herbs. I think TBC and to a lesser degree Wrath and MoP had more open world activity (due to the need to do far more dailies per day for a longer time than was needed to cap rep in BfA as well as farming profession materials, particularly in TBC with Primal farming). I agree with the rest (though I don't find anything commentable about PuG culture doing great, it's imo a shit culture and the worst part of the game).
    Incursions are flooded with players every time i do them, even in the early hours of the morning. The zone with the emissary is likewise flooded as is the one with the weekly pvp quest.

    In WoTLK everyone just ran dungeons for reps with the exception being the TOTC tokens, which you rarely saw people thanks to flying. Same goes for MoP.

    In TBC, same story, but flying was expensive then so you saw more plebs about on the ground.

    PuG culture most definitely is at its peak. Raider.io has pretty much solved the problem of leeching players. Previous incarnations of it were ilvl and gearscore, which are worthless metrics. Before that it was entirely 'bring the class, not the player' or it simply wasn't viable to pug at all thanks to the lack of available LFG tools.

  8. #28
    Scarab Lord TriHard's Avatar
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    Wpvp gonna be gone next major patch though, so have fun while it lasts.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    That's unfortunate. What I am seeing is that especially during assaults, people will organize and fight over specific areas with shared world quests. If your side is getting ganked, you can always try and organize a counterattack. The other day we spend like 3 hours on the Sundered Span trading control of the area and it was so much fun.

    It really helps that the conquest system is fairly rewarding for casual players. I'll echo the sentiment that I'd like some World PvP world quests though. All the cities in this game have always had so many named NPCs, I'd love it if we could get quests to kill those.
    You can try to organize a counterattack, until you start forming the group to defend against the 15-20 people and get sharded away from that group.

  10. #30
    I like the blatantly erroneous complaints. "If you form a group to fight back you get sharded away!" No, no you don't. It's based on the leader. "It's just one raid zerging solos!" No, no it's not. Does that happen? Yes. But what happens more often specifically because AoO can't be done in a raid is people join 5 man groups that leads to small groups bullying solo players who rally and push back (often at elite invasion quests where they group up anyways) leading to a bit of a tug of war over invasion quest areas. Call to Arms also lends to people fighting over popular questing areas. It's doing exactly what it's intended to do. "Old system was better because I now opt out of wpvp entirely!" lol, wut? That's the most retarded thing I've read all week. Warmode could use improvements, no doubt, but no system is perfect. We can always find something to complain about. But if you (generally) think Warmode is a failure that's because you're delusional. I pvp a little every day in Warmode bouncing between alts doing the quests and I've seen more wpvp in BfA so far than I saw in the entirety of Legion.

  11. #31
    The Lightbringer therealstegblob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Legion WPvP was a few specific specs with proper legendaries being one man armies. I don't think WPvP was as broken at any time as much as in Legion, maybe for tanks during mid Cata.
    I'm not commenting on the "quality" of Legion WPVP, merely how easy and abundant it was to engage in at anytime of the day, from any server. Unfortunately ((((for everyone else)))) Rogues with the Master Assassin's Mantle killed anyone in seconds; among other stupid and broken legendaries (there were legendaries specifically made for PVP which, funny enough, were awful for PVP compared to other legendaries that were way better). But I'll take that over BFA WPVP any day of the week. I wish there was still a reason to hang out in the Dalaran sewers, or that the BFA overworld had at least one god damn FFA PVP area.
    i am not the real stegblob. My blog where I review books and crap.

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