Thread: Joe Biden- why?

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  1. #481
    The Undying Butter Emails's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    Shouldn’t you guys be honest and at least tell us these conspiracies you guys believe Obama was hiding? Is it his birth certificate? Education? Wiretapping Trump’s campaign? 45% unemployment? What conspiracy theory are you guys banking on, in knowing Obama’s hidden bullshit? You know... since it’s hidden and you know about it...

    I really want to know... Which lie of Trump’s are you believing about Obama, while recognizing Trump is a liar?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Come on guys... no need to be shy. Trump just used executive privilege to, once again, hide his bullshit about the citizenship question on the census. You got to give us something tangible about Obama being the same. It can’t be just bullshit to make what Trump is doing seem normal... after all, you seem to have no trouble of attacking Biden on his stupid commentary...
    Neither of them will answer, and if one does, it will be Ghostpanther with a non-answer. Theo has fallen into the right wing political circle jerk about how evil and two faced Obama and Hillary were, while Republicans are "at least honest about their dishonesty". But these two and more have quite often proclaimed that they'd rather have a Republican whom they knew was lying to them than someone who THEY THINK was lying to them but claimed to be telling the truth.

    The sad part is, they can only ever cite conspiracy theories that have been debunked long ago, or were never proven one way or another, so their false mistrust for Obama and Hillary hinge entirely on their hate boners and not actual reality. Meanwhile, Republicans ALWAYS pretend they're telling the truth, and Ghostpanther himself even loves to slurp up every word Republicans make as truth, and then a year or two later, pretend he knew he was being lied to. Theo herself was pulled in even by some of Trump's lies, and has also done a complete 180 there, suddenly recognizing them as lies.

    This all reminds me of 2000-2008. I will, with great fondness, remember all the folks on this forum who decided to give Trump a chance because he seemed like he was the real deal and the best person for the job, only to 180 and say that they knew the whole time he was a fraud, a hack, and a criminal, and they never really supported him or defended him. Just like how Bush enjoyed a close to 100% approval rating among Republicans early in his term, who almost all now claim that they hated the Bush Jr administration from day 1 and were NEVER EVER FOOLED.
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  2. #482
    Conservatives have fully embraced feels over reals, the very thing they clowned on just a few years back.

  3. #483
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostpanther View Post
    That is sooooo true. Well said.
    I like it how being presidential and respectful is two faced while the compulsive liar is hailed as honest. The guy who bangs porn stars, bribes them while his wife is pregnant is your champion the level of cognitive dissonance Trump supporters have is mind blowing. /facepalm.

  4. #484
    2 years ago I think Biden would have certainly won against Trump. Now I think he is a trap candidate for the dems and doesn't stand a chance. He has become about as liked and trusted as Hillary and isn't doing anything to pull people away from Trump. Dems have a lot of poor choices right now which might make hime more appealing for some, but he is a mistake.
    "Privilege is invisible to those who have it."

  5. #485
    Biden Leads New Nevada Poll, as Warren Surpasses Sanders

    Biden - 36%

    Warren - 19%

    Sanders - 13%

    Buttigieg - 7%

    Harris - 6%

    Things aren't going so well for Bernie. Biden is demolishing it tho.
    Your problem is that you’re more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right.

  6. #486
    Quote Originally Posted by Alvito View Post
    2 years ago I think Biden would have certainly won against Trump. Now I think he is a trap candidate for the dems and doesn't stand a chance. He has become about as liked and trusted as Hillary and isn't doing anything to pull people away from Trump. Dems have a lot of poor choices right now which might make hime more appealing for some, but he is a mistake.
    How so?

    Right now The Hill shows in a general election poll Biden wining by 13 points, 53% vs 40%.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...-national-poll

    Even when all polls are averaged in they all show Biden beating Trump by a large margin, this including the conservative Fox and Rasmussen polls.
    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep...iden-6247.html

  7. #487
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobb View Post
    How so?

    Right now The Hill shows in a general election poll Biden wining by 13 points, 53% vs 40%.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...-national-poll

    Even when all polls are averaged in they all show Biden beating Trump by a large margin, this including the conservative Fox and Rasmussen polls.
    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep...iden-6247.html
    Alan Moore calls it magic, but it’s a way of repeating something, until people believe it’s true. In effect, changing ones reality, like magic... It’s why we keep hearing that majority voted for Trump...
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    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
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  8. #488
    Only way for this primary to actually be a race would be for Bernie or Warren to leave it early and endorse the other. If that did happen, it could get interesting.

  9. #489
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Only way for this primary to actually be a race would be for Bernie or Warren to leave it early and endorse the other. If that did happen, it could get interesting.
    I could see Bernie endorsing Warren, but not vice versa, considering she didn't endorse him in 2016. But who knows different times, she could surprise me.

  10. #490
    For his name ID, Buttigeig is doing fantastic... Sanders is actually doing pretty terrible when you consider his universal name ID.

  11. #491
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Only way for this primary to actually be a race would be for Bernie or Warren to leave it early and endorse the other. If that did happen, it could get interesting.
    That's assuming they will continue to split the progressive vote as opposed to one overtaking the other, which I think is more likely. Polling at the moment tells us a couple of things:

    - While electability is a major concern among Democrats, there is still a very strong interest in policy.
    - Age remains an issue for candidates, something plaguing Biden as well as Sanders.
    - The actual number of Bernie or Bust voters plateaus at 8%, with most polled having an interest in multiple candidates.

    All of these are factors against Bernie and in Warren's favor; I also happen to think her campaigning strategy is vastly more effective than his. If it should come down to a contest between the two, Warren may very well end out on top.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainbow Capitalist View Post
    Biden Leads New Nevada Poll, as Warren Surpasses Sanders

    Biden - 36%

    Warren - 19%

    Sanders - 13%

    Buttigieg - 7%

    Harris - 6%

    Things aren't going so well for Bernie. Biden is demolishing it tho.
    Case in point.
    φιλοκαλοῦμέν τε γὰρ μετ᾽ εὐτελείας καὶ φιλοσοφοῦμεν ἄνευ μαλακίας
    We are lovers of wisdom without excess, and lovers of beauty without weakness

    - Pericles' Funeral Oration


  12. #492
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post

    All of these are factors against Bernie and in Warren's favor; I also happen to think her campaigning strategy is vastly more effective than his. If it should come down to a contest between the two, Warren may very well end out on top.
    But it's not a contest between the two, it's a contest between them and Biden. Even if Warren does better and pulls the progressive Democrats who are policy first, as long as Bernie is around he will take enough of the vote for Biden to win states. Yet if Bernie was out and possibly endorsed Warren who is a much better version of Bernie when it comes to actual policy (but just has little charisma) then she'd have a real shot as everything Biden is not.

    Plus I think Warren actually has the policies that could help her win back the states the Dems lost to Trump.

  13. #493
    Anung un Rama Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beanman12345 View Post
    I could see Bernie endorsing Warren, but not vice versa, considering she didn't endorse him in 2016. But who knows different times, she could surprise me.
    Frankly, fuck Bernie Sanders.

    I applauded his run in 2016, his decision to swallow his independence and caucus with the Democrats to try and achieve something.

    And then he lost the primary, and demonstrated he'd never had a change of heart, went back to being an Independent, and kept on doing his thing.

    Now he's trying to caucus with the Democrats again, and it's become clear that he has only one reason for doing so. Because he thinks he can use their party to help him maybe win the Presidency. He doesn't want to be a Democrat; if he did, he'd have stayed with the Party. He just wants to use them for his own, personal, self-aggrandizement.

    Fuck that guy. If he'd stuck with being a Democrat, or ran this time around as an Independent, I wouldn't feel nearly this strongly, but he didn't, and he's not.

    There's also no way he's gonna back Warren; he only cares about his own victory. And there's no way Warren will back him; he's not a Democrat and has proven he doesn't want to work within the party unless it's to his benefit. He's only going to split votes and cause problems, and he doesn't give a shit, because he only cares about his own potential for winning. He wants the Presidency as a final feather in his cap before he retires. He's Socialist Trump.

  14. #494
    Quote Originally Posted by Rainbow Capitalist View Post
    Biden Leads New Nevada Poll, as Warren Surpasses Sanders

    Biden - 36%

    Warren - 19%

    Sanders - 13%

    Buttigieg - 7%

    Harris - 6%

    Things aren't going so well for Bernie. Biden is demolishing it tho.
    Bernie had an easier time when he was the only alternative to hillary. That is not the case now so if you just want old white guy you vote for biden but if you want somebody really progressive there are a lot of options and warren is quickly making a good case for herself. It really depends how rapidly the herd of candidates thins out the more there are the better bernie probably will do just because he has enough set base to win some states but if things winnow quickly down to a handful of candidates I think he will have a lot less luck.

  15. #495
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    But it's not a contest between the two, it's a contest between them and Biden. Even if Warren does better and pulls the progressive Democrats who are policy first, as long as Bernie is around he will take enough of the vote for Biden to win states. Yet if Bernie was out and possibly endorsed Warren who is a much better version of Bernie when it comes to actual policy (but just has little charisma) then she'd have a real shot as everything Biden is not.

    Plus I think Warren actually has the policies that could help her win back the states the Dems lost to Trump.
    This is a possibility. But it's also possible that Biden pulls a Jeb Bush and ends up fizzling out before the primary proper - it's difficult to tell prior to the debates simply because candidates have a harder time messaging in direct contrast to one another.

    I agree that Warren has a much more solid set of policy proposals and, quite frankly, I think she's got the chops to use the Oval Office's bully pulpit to make life difficult for McConnell if the GOP maintained their majority in such a scenario. Which is why I'm backing her in the primary.

    Sanders was notable in 2016 because he was the only vocal progressive in a field of centrist milquetoasts and one big name blue dog (Clinton) - I don't anticipate as much success because all he has now is residual name recognition. He's got the likes of Warren, Harris, and Buttigieg to compete with now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kaid View Post
    Bernie had an easier time when he was the only alternative to hillary. That is not the case now so if you just want old white guy you vote for biden but if you want somebody really progressive there are a lot of options and warren is quickly making a good case for herself. It really depends how rapidly the herd of candidates thins out the more there are the better bernie probably will do just because he has enough set base to win some states but if things winnow quickly down to a handful of candidates I think he will have a lot less luck.
    Well said.

    As always, though, campaign matters as much as candidates. It's been pretty clear thus far who's doing the legwork and who's trying to cruise.
    φιλοκαλοῦμέν τε γὰρ μετ᾽ εὐτελείας καὶ φιλοσοφοῦμεν ἄνευ μαλακίας
    We are lovers of wisdom without excess, and lovers of beauty without weakness

    - Pericles' Funeral Oration


  16. #496
    Quote Originally Posted by Rainbow Capitalist View Post
    Biden Leads New Nevada Poll, as Warren Surpasses Sanders

    Biden - 36%

    Warren - 19%

    Sanders - 13%

    Buttigieg - 7%

    Harris - 6%

    Things aren't going so well for Bernie. Biden is demolishing it tho.
    They aren't going well for him because his only appeal was his unique platform. His disadvantages were his age and the fact that he's not a woman or a minority. If these younger candidates can just hijack his platform while being younger and more charismatic, he really has nothing going for him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Fuck that guy. If he'd stuck with being a Democrat, or ran this time around as an Independent, I wouldn't feel nearly this strongly, but he didn't, and he's not.
    Frankly, that's a puzzling position. If you agree with him ideologically (which you do) and think Democrats fail to be left-wing enough (which you do) then why would you give a rat's ass about party loyalty?

  17. #497
    Anung un Rama Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Frankly, that's a puzzling position. If you agree with him ideologically (which you do) and think Democrats fail to be left-wing enough (which you do) then why would you give a rat's ass about party loyalty?
    Because I have principles and ethics, to be blunt. I don't overlook unethical conduct just because it might be advantageous to those who lean closer to my ideological viewpoint. I'm not going to accept his unethical manipulation of the Democratic Party's primary system, for his personal aggrandizement, just because I agreed with some of his policy suggestions.

    Particularly not when Warren is right there on most of them as well.

  18. #498
    Merely a Setback Sunseeker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Frankly, fuck Bernie Sanders.

    I applauded his run in 2016, his decision to swallow his independence and caucus with the Democrats to try and achieve something.

    And then he lost the primary, and demonstrated he'd never had a change of heart, went back to being an Independent, and kept on doing his thing.

    Now he's trying to caucus with the Democrats again, and it's become clear that he has only one reason for doing so. Because he thinks he can use their party to help him maybe win the Presidency. He doesn't want to be a Democrat; if he did, he'd have stayed with the Party. He just wants to use them for his own, personal, self-aggrandizement.

    Fuck that guy. If he'd stuck with being a Democrat, or ran this time around as an Independent, I wouldn't feel nearly this strongly, but he didn't, and he's not.

    There's also no way he's gonna back Warren; he only cares about his own victory. And there's no way Warren will back him; he's not a Democrat and has proven he doesn't want to work within the party unless it's to his benefit. He's only going to split votes and cause problems, and he doesn't give a shit, because he only cares about his own potential for winning. He wants the Presidency as a final feather in his cap before he retires. He's Socialist Trump.
    One whiny selfish voter deserves a whiny selfish candidate.
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  19. #499
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Because I have principles and ethics, to be blunt. I don't overlook unethical conduct just because it might be advantageous to those who lean closer to my ideological viewpoint. I'm not going to accept his unethical manipulation of the Democratic Party's primary system, for his personal aggrandizement, just because I agreed with some of his policy suggestions.

    Particularly not when Warren is right there on most of them as well.
    I don't see how he manipulated the primary system. If the party doesn't like that you can be an independent all the time except when you want to run for president, then maybe they should change the rules so you can't do that. Who cares about the stupid parties anyway? Almost all liberals except the centrist ones hate the Dems and almost all conservatives except the ones sitting in Washington eating caviar hate the GOP.

  20. #500
    Biden wants to Make America America Again. A slogan that Michael Avenetti says was stolen from him...who apparently stole it from Scott Baio?

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