Thread: Joe Biden- why?

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  1. #641
    Quote Originally Posted by Aurinaux View Post
    Biden is far from my favorite politician, but I agree with Biden.

    The Democrats are becoming the new Tea Party. Cory Booker repurposing his message is *literally* Biden's fucking point.

    This is why I would be a bad candidate: because I can't stand this ridiculous gatekeeping that has NOTHING to do with policy. The moment you try to form an argument you get stomped with some bullshit purity test. And you people think you're engaging in politics.

    So fucking depressing to watch.
    You think his obvious racism does not affect policy? The dude should just join the GoP already, fits him way better. He is by far the most conservative democrat.

  2. #642
    What his campaign is showing me so far is that whoever was working with him as VP did a great job keeping a lid on his stupid comments.

    I get what he was trying to get at with the segregationist comment but...good lord, read the fucking Democratic base a bit. And his response to Booker asking him to apologize didn't help.

    Biden needs to be more disciplined if he wants to get broad Democratic support and enthusiasm (more important) leading into the debates, and shooting himself in the foot like this isn't going to help.

  3. #643
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    What his campaign is showing me so far is that whoever was working with him as VP did a great job keeping a lid on his stupid comments.

    I get what he was trying to get at with the segregationist comment but...good lord, read the fucking Democratic base a bit. And his response to Booker asking him to apologize didn't help.

    Biden needs to be more disciplined if he wants to get broad Democratic support and enthusiasm (more important) leading into the debates, and shooting himself in the foot like this isn't going to help.
    I mentioned this before; there's a reason why Biden is a perennial candidate but has not actually come close to winning the primary.

    Like, ignoring his political positions - his perceived strength as a candidate this time around is literally just a function of Democrats being too afraid to put anyone who isn't a right leaning white dude up to challenge Trump. Which is one of the chief reasons why I'm apprehensive of a Biden candidacy; Clinton tried running against Trump as a contest of character and lost, and I don't think Biden's character is sufficiently sterling for 2020. He's too old and set in his ways.

    Levelfive really had the right of it. This is the campaign strategy of a candidate who assumes he already has the primary in the bag, and that isn't smart.
    φιλοκαλοῦμέν τε γὰρ μετ᾽ εὐτελείας καὶ φιλοσοφοῦμεν ἄνευ μαλακίας
    We are lovers of wisdom without excess, and lovers of beauty without weakness

    - Pericles' Funeral Oration


  4. #644
    Anung un Rama Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    I mentioned this before; there's a reason why Biden is a perennial candidate but has not actually come close to winning the primary.

    Like, ignoring his political positions - his perceived strength as a candidate this time around is literally just a function of Democrats being too afraid to put anyone who isn't a right leaning white dude up to challenge Trump. Which is one of the chief reasons why I'm apprehensive of a Biden candidacy; Clinton tried running against Trump as a contest of character and lost, and I don't think Biden's character is sufficiently sterling for 2020. He's too old and set in his ways.

    Levelfive really had the right of it. This is the campaign strategy of a candidate who assumes he already has the primary in the bag, and that isn't smart.
    I think you're nailing the "fear" angle exactly right.

    The Democrats are running scared. They assumed 2016 was a slam dunk, and it wasn't, because they were overconfident and stupid. But even in 2016, there was an undercurrent of ideological fear, a feeling that they had to push to the center-right because anything left of center was freaky-weirdo crap.

    And the problem with that is, most of their voters are left of center. There's a reason Bernie got so much support in 2016, even if it fell apart as they realized he didn't have solid policy proposals and Clinton's persecution generated sympathy (and antipathy, I'll freely admit). There's a reason Warren is still getting a lot of support. You don't have to push to the right to get elected as a Democrat. That's a ridiculous idea; worse, it's a Republican idea. It's exactly what they want, because the further they pull the Democrats to the right, the further right they can go, and the Overton window slips a little more to the right.

    This isn't a recent issue; this has been a deliberate strategy by Republicans for decades, now. And it's bullshit. The proper response is to elect a strong left-wing candidate and give the Republicans an ideological middle finger.

    Instead, Democrats get afraid, and kowtow to the Republicans, and push for ever-more-right-wing Democratic leadership. And that's why their voters are pulling back, why Clinton got so little support.

    Stand the fuck up for your principles, you goddamned cowards.

  5. #645
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    I think you're nailing the "fear" angle exactly right.

    The Democrats are running scared. They assumed 2016 was a slam dunk, and it wasn't, because they were overconfident and stupid. But even in 2016, there was an undercurrent of ideological fear, a feeling that they had to push to the center-right because anything left of center was freaky-weirdo crap.

    And the problem with that is, most of their voters are left of center. There's a reason Bernie got so much support in 2016, even if it fell apart as they realized he didn't have solid policy proposals and Clinton's persecution generated sympathy (and antipathy, I'll freely admit). There's a reason Warren is still getting a lot of support. You don't have to push to the right to get elected as a Democrat. That's a ridiculous idea; worse, it's a Republican idea. It's exactly what they want, because the further they pull the Democrats to the right, the further right they can go, and the Overton window slips a little more to the right.

    This isn't a recent issue; this has been a deliberate strategy by Republicans for decades, now. And it's bullshit. The proper response is to elect a strong left-wing candidate and give the Republicans an ideological middle finger.

    Instead, Democrats get afraid, and kowtow to the Republicans, and push for ever-more-right-wing Democratic leadership. And that's why their voters are pulling back, why Clinton got so little support.

    Stand the fuck up for your principles, you goddamned cowards.
    Speaking of principles, let's talk about messaging.

    Say what you will about MAGA but, stupid as it is, it's a simple and easy to repeat slogan that does encapsulate the thrust of the Trump campaign - and I think one of the keys to his victory in 2016. We saw it in 2008 with "Change" and 2012 with "Yes we can" and Obama, and the inverse in 2016 with Hillary's failure to really market herself with a coherent message besides "Trump sucks", which wasn't exactly compelling to people hungry for change.

    What exactly is Biden's message? People keep saying "a return to normalcy", but that in itself is troubling since normalcy was what voters in 2016 seemed to reject. His policies seem primarily to be afterthoughts. And it's clear from his statements regarding inequality and millennial voters that he's never going to be able to generate the sort of energy Obama did in 2008.

    And yet he's still the most electable candidate because he's the most visible white dude who isn't Trump. Which, as you said, is a Republican litmus test.

    Have we really come to the point where we are so frightened that we are willing to try and primary the Republican incumbent?
    φιλοκαλοῦμέν τε γὰρ μετ᾽ εὐτελείας καὶ φιλοσοφοῦμεν ἄνευ μαλακίας
    We are lovers of wisdom without excess, and lovers of beauty without weakness

    - Pericles' Funeral Oration


  6. #646
    Anung un Rama Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Speaking of principles, let's talk about messaging.

    Say what you will about MAGA but, stupid as it is, it's a simple and easy to repeat slogan that does encapsulate the thrust of the Trump campaign - and I think one of the keys to his victory in 2016. We saw it in 2008 with "Change" and 2012 with "Yes we can" and Obama, and the inverse in 2016 with Hillary's failure to really market herself with a coherent message besides "Trump sucks", which wasn't exactly compelling to people hungry for change.

    What exactly is Biden's message? People keep saying "a return to normalcy", but that in itself is troubling since normalcy was what voters in 2016 seemed to reject. His policies seem primarily to be afterthoughts. And it's clear from his statements regarding inequality and millennial voters that he's never going to be able to generate the sort of energy Obama did in 2008.

    And yet he's still the most electable candidate because he's the most visible white dude who isn't Trump. Which, as you said, is a Republican litmus test.

    Have we really come to the point where we are so frightened that we are willing to try and primary the Republican incumbent?
    On messaging, Americans are generally action-oriented. The word that makes MAGA something we're still commenting on, unlike either of Obama's slogans, is the word "Make". It provides for agency and action. George W. Bush's slogans were more "active" than Gore's and Kerry's, Bill Clinton's as well. Unless your slogan really nails the zeitgeist in a big way, like Reagan's "Are you better off than you were four years ago?", something that's active and puts agency in the hands of your voters, rather than promising big things from above, is probably a smarter choice. That's what got Trump voters fired up about MAGA; it wasn't a call to let the Republicans do it, it was a call for Americans to show up and take part in that process. It's good messaging, even if I think the core of it is dishonest malarkey.

  7. #647
    https://twitter.com/jordanchariton/s...138312704?s=21

    Somebody tell the dems you don't fight racism with the exact same sort of racism.

  8. #648
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilrak View Post
    https://twitter.com/jordanchariton/s...138312704?s=21

    Somebody tell the dems you don't fight racism with the exact same sort of racism.
    Someone should tell Joe that the reason Eastland was willing to work with him was the same reason he was never called "boy".
    φιλοκαλοῦμέν τε γὰρ μετ᾽ εὐτελείας καὶ φιλοσοφοῦμεν ἄνευ μαλακίας
    We are lovers of wisdom without excess, and lovers of beauty without weakness

    - Pericles' Funeral Oration


  9. #649
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilrak View Post
    https://twitter.com/jordanchariton/s...138312704?s=21

    Somebody tell the dems you don't fight racism with the exact same sort of racism.
    RIP Biden. His long history was always going to be a risk, and in the current political climate I can't see him getting enough support unless the other top tier candidates royally fuck up.

  10. #650
    Joe Biden is deep in their establishment rot of corruption, I don't see Pelosi and the rest of the hags trusting the younger democrats with anything.
    This is just how much of of a shitshow the Democrats have become. But the pedo memes of Biden are effective so its going to be fun to watch them continue burning like a dumpster fire for four years now lol

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