Joker [with Joaquin Phoenix]

[infinit]

What do you actually like Elba?

he's a self loathing nihilist

[Lorgar Aurelian]

The animated films are generally fantastic. If they were smart, they would either adapt those to live-action or get the writers on board for a live-action adaptation.

They have been putting them out for years and they are almost all good I really don’t get why they haven’t taken the writers yet.

[RobertoCarlos]

I think the trailer looks great.

hes such a talented actor no one is bothering to do the lame "heath is the best and only joker!!111"

[Mister Cheese]

White dude losing his shit and going on a rampage isn't new, my man. Charles Bronson made an entire career out of it.

This is fiction.

Point to something you actually like.

[jackofwind]

I just don't see how making the Joker "tragic" is a good story. He's not supposed to be a personification of evil. He's supposed to be the antithesis of Batman's representation of order. He's not out seeking revenge on the world because someone bullied him. He's trying to prove that his reality is the "true" reality that everyone is just as insane as him.

You keep mentioning someone bullying him, but that's a really single-minded way of looking at tragic characters. I already mentioned Macbeth in this thread as a strong example of a character who has a tragic story yet also becomes a villain whose actions are totally unjustifiable. I don't disagree with your description of The Joker at all, but that description doesn't preclude him from being a tragic character unless he was born that way.

A tragic character is just one who has a fall from status and ends up being villainous. It doesn't mean they have to be a bullied kid, nor that they are out seeking revenge. They can be driven by basically anything, including their own unhinged mental machinations.

[Shadowferal]

Trailer looks interesting but...I can't really get into a movie where I'm supposed to feel some sort of empathy for a sadistic mass murdering psycho. I mean he was supposed to be all about being crazy as fuck, an avatar of chaos in the worst way.

And yes, the inevitable comparison will be made against Heath Ledjar's role, which between the script and the acting made the Joker into some anthropomorphic catastrophe. His allure made him terrifying.

I will wait and see...and watch it with low expectations. (Phoenix wasn't a bad choice I admit)

[Cosmic Janitor]

Hmm. not sure I like the direction. It seems more like a psycho thriller than a comicbook movie, very artsy and the trailer didn't even show hits of "the criminal genius Joker". By the looks of it, it seems more like a revenge/origin story of the next killing-spree shooter with a very 80/90's film look. Since this looks more like a standalone film I also don't expect a matching batman to complete the set, which will leave us probably only with the cops (maybe we get a Gordan) or a pure attempt at humanizing the Joker - something I didn't really need. Well, I will wait what the next trailers and reviews will say.

[Aurrora]

I don’t doubt his acting skills at all, but the movie seems kinda boring and more artsy than what I was expecting.

That or it's that rarity of a trailer these days that isn't the CliffsNotes version of the movie.

[Khaza-R]

Joaquin Phoenix is a great actor, so I have no doubt this will be good.

[Coldfrostzero]

You keep mentioning someone bullying him, but that's a really single-minded way of looking at tragic characters. I already mentioned Macbeth in this thread as a strong example of a character who has a tragic story yet also becomes a villain whose actions are totally unjustifiable. I don't disagree with your description of The Joker at all, but that description doesn't preclude him from being a tragic character unless he was born that way.

A tragic character is just one who has a fall from status and ends up being villainous. It doesn't mean they have to be a bullied kid, nor that they are out seeking revenge. They can be driven by basically anything, including their own unhinged mental machinations.

I mean it doesn't really matter if you agree or not with my description of the Joker. Its not my opinion or take on the character. Its how he's been written for an extremely long time (over 50 years at the least). See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joker_(character)

Even his "origin" story from The Killing Joke is unreliable because it is the Joker explaining it. Hence in the Dark Knight series, he has a shifting origin for his scars. He has no rhyme or reason. He's just the opposite of everything Batman stands for.

You can argue its a "fresh take" or a "new spin" if you want, but it really devalues what he represents in the DC universe.

[Crillam]

For sure. I mean we can't forget the original Captain America movie if we're going to talk about the real worst comic book movie ever made.

Or that fantastic four that never was released

[Kontinuum]

worst comic book movie ever made.

[Ausr]

Seems very "meh" and not what I was expecting after hearing all the praise about it so far.

[Lord Pebbleton]

Better than the Leto monstrosity, that's for sure.
Still pretty bummed that the focus is always on the Joker. I get it, he's the baddest of the Batman bads; but not the most interesting imo. I would LOVE to see a movie on Scarecrow.

[Puupi]

Looks good, the only superhero/comic book movie I have ever been interested in.

[oplawlz]

This actually does look good, especially since we haven't had a decent joker since nicholson.

[Orby]

I skipped aqua man as he’s the only hero I have absolutely no interest in.

Wonder Woman I found dreadful on every level and would count it as the worse comic movie I’ve ever seen and I’ve seen litteraly every single one baring aqua man and dead pool 2. Only positive I could give WW is I liked the design of that one evil doctor woman.

At this point I think only like a injustice movie could get me interested in dc again but something like that would need set up dc is either unwilling or unable to do.

That's interesting to hear, considering how everyone gushed over Wonder Woman... minus the ending which everyone hated :P

Or that fantastic four that never was released

That was still the better Fantastic Four movie than the other two we had... Which says a lot considering it wasnt even released lol

[jackofwind]

I mean it doesn't really matter if you agree or not with my description of the Joker. Its not my opinion or take on the character. Its how he's been written for an extremely long time (over 50 years at the least). See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joker_(character)

Even his "origin" story from The Killing Joke is unreliable because it is the Joker explaining it. Hence in the Dark Knight series, he has a shifting origin for his scars. He has no rhyme or reason. He's just the opposite of everything Batman stands for.

You can argue its a "fresh take" or a "new spin" if you want, but it really devalues what he represents in the DC universe.

Nothing you're saying contests the point I've been making, so I guess we agree.

[Gallahadd]

The animated films are generally fantastic. If they were smart, they would either adapt those to live-action or get the writers on board for a live-action adaptation.

No, if they were smart, they’d realise that they can’t compete with Marvel in the live action universe, and go back to beating them up and stealing their money in the animated universe, where they have almost always been utterly dominant.

Into the Spiderverse showed that a REALLY well made animated movie can succeed. If DC really threw their full support behind their animated stuff, they’d make buckets of cash.

[Coldfrostzero]

Nothing you're saying contests the point I've been making, so I guess we agree.

Agree that he could be a lot more interesting than being beaten up and turning evil because of it?

No, if they were smart, they’d realise that they can’t compete with Marvel in the live action universe, and go back to beating them up and stealing their money in the animated universe, where they have almost always been utterly dominant.

Into the Spiderverse showed that a REALLY well made animated movie can succeed. If DC really threw their full support behind their animated stuff, they’d make buckets of cash.

Well, the problem with DC is they jumped into the middle of the story, went backwards and told origin stories, and then tried to play present day instead of building up to it. They had the opportunity to do it better than Marvel since Marvel had to backtrack a little when they realized they could do a cinematic universe.

I don't disagree though that they could easily double-down on animated films, but people in general get turned off by animation and especially adult animation that isn't stupid Family Guy.