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  1. #201
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcereria View Post
    So wait, you just CONFIRMED MY WORDS that it was happening and I am actually right? LOL
    Many guilds for above reasons would opt for 1 side strategy in Vanila. YT has plenty of Vanila kills to back it up and I am pretty sure with enough stamina one could still find a kill video of screwed RNG.

    I think there used to be a bug too with iceblocks not spawning or having a lower amount of them.



    Have you considered in your small brain that blizzard spawns on top of you and you get slowed instantly and unavoidadly or its some private server thingy that blizzard slowed you after x seconds?
    Can confirm it, i was benched for saph, so was backseating our rogue at his place, spreading out would eventually lead to bombs spawning unevenly. No clue about the bug tho.

    That's what you get when people think that private servers = vanilla wow. Or simply don't know what they are talking about
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    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcereria View Post
    I largely agree with you, I just wonder what you think this proves. I mean grats on kill Raz I guess?
    Unreason and anti-intellectualism abominate thought. Thinking implies disagreement; and disagreement implies nonconformity; and nonconformity implies heresy; and heresy implies disloyalty — so, obviously, thinking must be stopped. But shouting is not a substitute for thinking and reason is not the subversion but the salvation of freedom. - Adlai Stevenson

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Livnthedream View Post
    I largely agree with you, I just wonder what you think this proves. I mean grats on kill Raz I guess?
    It doesn't even really do that; the original Tier 3 pieces are available on the Black Market AH other than the rings. There's actually no way to really prove that the character did or did not kill any bosses back then any more unless you have screenshots or videos of it these days. It's obviously a character that was played back then, and you're also correct there's no evidence of a boss kill past one of the easiest bosses of the raid, which is also the only one I ever completed at level 60.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    its gonna be rly funny looking back at this when my point gets proven,i mean you should alredy know this as blizzard have clearly shown that classic wont be like vanila
    There have been 7 blue posts proving that PS have been wildy inacurate and people complaining about the numbers being wrong are showing themselves to be PS vanilla wannabes. Blizzard have the data. They have shown the math 7 times. What does it take for people?
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizah View Post
    why so mad bro

  5. #205
    Here is world first Loathab kill, which I was a part of. Number 1 dps after going in 15 seconds after everyone else because I was afraid to pull aggro: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GPRS31bvl0&t=245s Human wariors are #1 Dps, human rogues fight mages for 2nd place usually. If you don't roll human, you are a fool.. really all there is to it.

  6. #206
    Cool, I'll definitely use that video in some of my threads. Any idea what the DPS numbers are? It's pretty blurry and was set to actual damage done.
    Reminders of what vanilla was like: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...nilla-was-like
    17 hazed on the Golemagg "cinematic": https://i.imgur.com/nlZM3cj.jpg

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcereria View Post
    So wait, you just CONFIRMED MY WORDS that it was happening and I am actually right? LOL
    You're saying that it happens every time.

    I'm saying, no it fucking doesn't

    LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcereria View Post
    Many guilds for above reasons would opt for 1 side strategy in Vanila.
    Good for them. I've never used a "1 side" strat and never had an issue with iceblocks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcereria View Post
    Have you considered in your small brain that blizzard spawns on top of you
    So...use your brain and move away from it

    difficult tactic I know

    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcereria View Post
    and you get slowed instantly and unavoidadly
    There is literally no boss-related ground effect that happens "instantly" as soon as it spawns.

    Shoo, troll.



    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcereria View Post
    0 proof that this is you.

    Now what, troll?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruor View Post
    Here is world first Loathab kill, which I was a part of. Number 1 dps after going in 15 seconds after everyone else because I was afraid to pull aggro: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GPRS31bvl0&t=245s Human wariors are #1 Dps, human rogues fight mages for 2nd place usually. If you don't roll human, you are a fool.. really all there is to it.
    The difference between human and non-human is like 50dps in absolute bis gear.

    Shoo, minmaxer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommi View Post
    LFR saved raiding
    Quote Originally Posted by Haekke View Post
    LFR is not really easy. I would say it's a lot harder thant Mythic Dungeons
    get_a_load_of_this_guy_cam.jpg

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    You're saying that it happens every time.

    I'm saying, no it fucking doesn't

    LOL


    Good for them. I've never used a "1 side" strat and never had an issue with iceblocks.


    So...use your brain and move away from it

    difficult tactic I know


    There is literally no boss-related ground effect that happens "instantly" as soon as it spawns.

    Shoo, troll.




    0 proof that this is you.

    Now what, troll?

    - - - Updated - - -



    The difference between human and non-human is like 50dps in absolute bis gear.

    Shoo, minmaxer.
    50dps is a lot in Vanilla. You are human... do you really want to play as a deformed midget that cant reach over its head or a giant purple Trix rabbit so badly to sacrifice that dps? Enjoy your casual guild.

  9. #209
    Bloodsail Admiral MAGAForLife's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pua View Post
    Yep, even these numbers are inflated; nobody did those numbers as consistent DPS because, funnily enough, they're closer to The Burning Crusade numbers.
    Agreed, these numbers seem far too high. My combat swords rogue, in BIS pre-kara gear at 70 struggled to hit 700 dps, and I was 1-2 dps, only beaten by a fire mage sometimes...

  10. #210
    Remember how cherry picked the data is though:
    —Very, very short boss fights
    —Consumables and buffs in vanilla were crazy
    —BiS everything
    —Just plain old luck on crits

    So I can believe a 1200 DPS fury war under those circumstances.
    Reminders of what vanilla was like: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...nilla-was-like
    17 hazed on the Golemagg "cinematic": https://i.imgur.com/nlZM3cj.jpg

  11. #211
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    I remember seeing a fury warrior with every single buff in the game doing over 1200-1300 DPS right before TBC came out. Consumables are retarded in Vanilla and if you put the extra time into going around and getting every world buff, the DPS can get pretty stupid.

    I routinely playing as combat daggers (not-BiS, we only cleared to 4HM) was around 800 DPS on my rogue on a boss like Patchwerk. My guild didn't use world buffs either because it really wasn't well known until the end of Vanilla (and not really needed until the later bosses in Naxxaramas, like Loatheb and beyond). Rogues scaled well, just not as well as fury warriors. With every single buff imaginable my DPS could have been higher, but it's not going to be 1200-1300 like I listed above.

    Numbers are strange though especially if you're running a full group of world buffed people. Encounters start lasting such a short amount of time to the point that the few DPS CDs that are in the game have pretty high uptimes, in addition to crit RNG not really having time to even out over a standard length encounter.

    It's not really a surprise that a 70 character is going to do less damage than a fully optimized 60 character. Those 60 characters are fully buffed, with insane consumables and world buffs, with inflated crit and hit percentages compared to somebody at 70.

    I don't think people fully realize the amount of power characters in Vanilla WoW can actually achieve outside of raids. There were so many quirky buffs and potions in Vanilla in addition to a vast amount of alchemy potions, world buffs and things like DM tribute runs that could probably account for nearly 50% of your characters overall power (or more, depending on the tier). Whether you like this approach or not is entirely up to you, but being dedicated to getting every consumable possible for your class is the most important aspect in Vanilla from a raiding perspective.

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by Cruor View Post
    Here is world first Loathab kill, which I was a part of. Number 1 dps after going in 15 seconds after everyone else because I was afraid to pull aggro: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GPRS31bvl0&t=245s Human wariors are #1 Dps, human rogues fight mages for 2nd place usually. If you don't roll human, you are a fool.. really all there is to it.
    Warriors on this fight benefit quite a lot from the debuff, the rage gain alone is insane, plus deep wounds rolling. Mages do too, but they are limited by mana.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Cracked View Post
    Warriors on this fight benefit quite a lot from the debuff, the rage gain alone is insane, plus deep wounds rolling. Mages do too, but they are limited by mana.
    True, but warriors often manage #1 on parchwerk too. I wish we had a dps set in Vanilla, imagine what it could have been.

  14. #214
    Mechagnome Rehija's Avatar
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    True, but warriors often manage #1 on parchwerk too. I wish we had a dps set in Vanilla, imagine what it could have been.
    15 Warriors who bitch at each other after every single bosskill about who and why was someone dps#1 and who deserves this and that item

  15. #215
    As a BWL/AQ40 raider in vanilla as (rogue, hunter) I only saw warriors (in videos) doing 1100+ on HORDE (windfury) and allways very close of getting aggro. In my casual raiding guild the warriors were cool players, most did R13-R14 and played a lot (80+ days /PLAYED in vanilla only) and they played very well but it was so sad to watch them die from aggro so many times or they had to hold back forever to even stay alive while doing mediocre DPS.

    As a rogue it was super chill to play and keeping DPS high even in sensitive fights for aggro was a reason many guild stacked rogues for first kills. But Hunter was a dream come true for raiding. Even less aggro issues, similar DPS to full combat dagger and chilling at range was beautiful.

    And when I think about naxx geared players, I really only see those broken trash-loot servo arms dualwielding rogues destroying everything in the game pvp/pve with its broken (thunderfury like) armor ignoring proc. There are some cool pvp warrior videos with naxx/R13 geared warriors killing everything with the backup of 3-4 healers. (5vs1) And then you have those solo combat rogues using servo arms and using blade flurry and win 1vs7+ fights against R14 teams - hilarious. Those 5k+ ambush crits with naxx daggers were allready fun to watch (burn videos) but servo arms broke the game - basicly dual thunderfurys with naxx ilvl.

    As for PvE all I saw were dead warriors all the time, doing at best rogue/mage/hunter like dps at best but many times just died short after pull or midfight. Not the DPS class you wana stack for progression to be honest.

    If I had to choose 1 class for ending up in naxx gear I would allways go for a rogue. Zero aggro issues, highest DPS without windfury and broken naxx items way beyond anything a warrior could do with those in pvp or pve.
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  16. #216
    Mechagnome Rehija's Avatar
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    but it was so sad to watch them die from aggro so many times or they had to hold back forever to even stay alive while doing mediocre DPS
    Our 2Hand Fury Warrior started a fight with /dance for about the first 20% of Bosslife, then he got into it and at about 50% he used his Soulstone. BWL/AQ40 loot, R13 stuff and Ashkandi were a nasty combination.

  17. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAGAForLife View Post
    Agreed, these numbers seem far too high. My combat swords rogue, in BIS pre-kara gear at 70 struggled to hit 700 dps, and I was 1-2 dps, only beaten by a fire mage sometimes...
    Common numbers for T4 were between 600 and 700 DPS, with freakish numbers being there via quirks depending on the encounter.

    Claims that typical numbers were higher through Classic just aren't true, but it's ignorant to suggest that todays players will won't be better; therefore, expecting general increases is reasonable.

  18. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pua View Post
    Common numbers for T4 were between 600 and 700 DPS, with freakish numbers being there via quirks depending on the encounter.

    Claims that typical numbers were higher through Classic just aren't true, but it's ignorant to suggest that todays players will won't be better; therefore, expecting general increases is reasonable.
    I wonder if the general increase can be sustained because of how aggro works in vanilla. Also with everyone with better internet and computers.

  19. #219
    Mechagnome Storfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pua View Post
    Common numbers for T4 were between 600 and 700 DPS, with freakish numbers being there via quirks depending on the encounter.

    Claims that typical numbers were higher through Classic just aren't true, but it's ignorant to suggest that todays players will won't be better; therefore, expecting general increases is reasonable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewshine View Post
    I wonder if the general increase can be sustained because of how aggro works in vanilla. Also with everyone with better internet and computers.
    A naxx-geared lvl60 player with full worldbuffs will have higher character stats than a T4 geared lvl70 character.
    “Listen... Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.” – Dennis

  20. #220
    I'm not sure what the point of arguing about this is tbh, if the patch progression rate is as it should be then naxx won't be coming out for almost 2 years , it's safe to assume that a large portion of the people basing their class decisions on whatever consensus this thread yields will never even set foot in naxx.

    There's also a few things to consider before basing decisions:

    - The most popular P.servers have harder bosses ( increased damage/hp/armor) to compensate for everyone knowing everything about the game, classic won't have that so expecting fights to last longer because there won't be as much world buffs/flasks probably won't happen.

    - Classic wow won't be vanilla either, there are already a shitton of bugs and differences in classic so anyone expecting it to be a true vanilla will be disappointed.
    This is especially the case with layering exploits directly countering the flask/pots argument since it'll mean more lotus/herbs = more flasks/pots so it might end up exactly the same as P.servers in that regard.

    - World buffs having gcd won't stop the top guilds from rotating buffs on a timely basis , most likely there will be a "raid time" that most servers will follow where everyone will expect world buffs to roll out at that given time, as most of the good guilds will probably be saving their world buffs for specific timetables and just a heads up, I've seen a lot of hardcore raiders log off for days to save their world buffs for an upcoming raid, pretty sure that mentality won't fade from the hardcore scene if there is ever a lack of world buffs.

    - Don't base your decisions on the final content of the game, who knows if you'll end up playing that long or even have time to raid naxx tbh.

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