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  1. #221
    Only change I want to see is Blizzard monitoring people grinding towards Rank 14 and banning the fuckers that account share. Ban them for a month and strip them of all ranks.
    Im going to get very unpleasant depending on how motivated your stupidity ends up getting me, so... don't?
    SoundOfGuns trying to look intimidating.

  2. #222
    Everything doesn't have to be accessible to the lowest common denominator

    Don't like it? Don't do it, It's not for you
    Quote Originally Posted by Potboza View Post
    I created a black human male called "Pedopriest" and ran him to SW.
    I started asking where the schools were.
    Someone said "My kids play on this server you creep! How can you live with yourself?"
    I whispered back, "How old are they?"
    Yeah.

  3. #223
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    The Vanilla pvp Rank system will always be a better design then some RNG paid lootbox some games use to get some of it's content.

    Just because few people at a time can get it, doesn't mean there need to be some easy alternative catering to everyone.

    WoW already lead to 4 difficulties of the same raids which is a stupid direction they took too far.

    TBC had epics with resilience from Arena, not exactly a brilliant alternative either.

    And they also gave the titles of Vanilla away later on via Rated battlegrounds, so people can get their Grand Marshal/High Warlords in WoW right now (since Cataclysm)
    Last edited by Teri; 2019-04-13 at 12:55 AM.

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    They could probably make the grind a lot less painful by extending the brackets; say make the top 2% players be rank 12 instead of the literal top 0.1% or something. So you still need to grind a lot to achieve that prestigious reward, but aren't locked into lifeless turbonerd mode and virtually playing against people in your own faction.

    Maybe Blizzard will do that somewhere down the line, after too many players experience the system and are sick and tired of needing to grind constantly.
    Nah, that way you will have something like 10 people/week running around in late aq/naxx entry 2 hands making it unplayable for everyone else.

    Because people now know and everyone will rush Rank 10 for free gear and then a few for the rest, but higher % would mean what i said above.

    Back then it would be 10 players total running around in total by the time AQ gates started opening, and i am counting the casters in there also, so more like barely 2-3 2hands, and i am saying 2hands cause thats where the most broken scaling is, everyone gained insane stats obviously but them R14 2hands.

    The % of players is fine, its just a bad system of an archaic logic.

    It shouldnt be changed, but anyone glorifying it or saying "It was hard" is just being silly.
    Last edited by potis; 2019-04-13 at 01:16 AM.

  5. #225
    Warchief Mrbleedinggums's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malikath View Post
    "i can't farm low-lvls for easy honor anymore, WAAH"
    pathetic, the only change was that you HAD to fight actual threats to progress not just jump ungeared questing players.

    - - - Updated - - -



    if you wanna start talking about what people DESERVE then lets talk about you and what you deserve.

    which is nothing, from no one, ever.

    this is a product, people deserve what they pay for and if the company will not(not cannot) provide what they promoted then they should be met with a well deserved legal suit if not dissolution.
    lol, you're not even worth an infraction. Move along kid and enjoy your "no changes" Classic even though there are already tons of changes that you're more than happy to have because you're a hypocrite.
    "Why of course the people don't want war…. But, after all… it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."

  6. #226
    Does anyone know if they've officially announced whether the Battleground system will be in anyway cross realm, with Battlegroups or otherwise?

    It's just about possible if they had every server linked for battlegrounds, or at least large enough battlegroups, that it would be nigh impossible for any one single PvP group to have a monopoly on the brackets for their server (because of so many concurrent games occuring) that keeping the system as is would be basically fine.

    OF course a big issue there is that players will lose some of their server identity when doing BGs, although my personal experiences of the battlegroup system wasn't so much worse than "one server BGs" but then I was on a moderately carebear battlegroup (Vindication), maybe the more populated ones you never saw an enemy twice I don't know.

    Whilst yes there are people complaining that the system is stupid (and to some degree we all admit it ain't perfect) and needs total overhaul, we should happily ignore them in favour of NOCHANGES, absolutely. However my personal grief, as I outlined last page, is how it is handled by the 2019 crowd of players. Rather than the "having to be one of the top contributors every week for 3 or 4 months", which in itself isn't too much to ask (hell it really *ought* to be the reward for whoever spends the most time PVPing), it's the potential social fallout from "PvPing more than you're allowed to according to the ranking group" that is the issue.

    @Jastall @potis I don't know if you agree with me that the "ranking mafia" is an issue to be fixed or one to be celebrated, but I'd be interested to hear what you think
    Last edited by AeneasBK; 2019-04-13 at 03:11 AM.
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  7. #227
    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post

    @Jastall @potis I don't know if you agree with me that the "ranking mafia" is an issue to be fixed or one to be celebrated, but I'd be interested to hear what you think
    Nah, the problem is people do not understand how terrible Vanilla was, and their experience is tinted behind rose glasses literally.

    Its not 2005, where all the info is hidden inside elitistjerks for Ion and 50-100 top guilds and a few hundred more players to discuss their manual finds about how things worked.

    People do not understand the difference on how some people experienced Vanilla, and how Vanilla really worked.

    They have this delusion that everything was perfect because it had RPG elements and everyone was friendly with the occasional ninja looter because they had so much fun running <Insert irrelevant 58-60 dungeon here> after the gazillion class changes and dungeon changes.

    I said this before, i realized how completely out of place/knowledge the community was while i was in a lesson at Uni and because i finished the assignment early (PC requirement class so, internet access, yay!) i decided to check the wow forums for the first time cause i realized "Hey, people actually post there its not only elitistjerks, lets see" and this was in October 2006.

    I still remember the "shock" of a post and then the majority of similar posts.

    "Finally cleared all of BRD this sunday doing a 12h marathon with friends!" and they have been level 60 for close to a year according to the post.

    So something i cleared in 4-5 hours when i was a clueless Alliance druid level 60 noob , in March-April 2005 and then in 2-3 hours on my rerolled Warrior in June 2005 as level 58 because we knew the place, it takes the majority of the playerbase, with 2342343 buffs and nerfs to everything, 12 hours? What?

    I can write pages of how Vanilla actually worked community wise, but mmo-champion always has that "FUCK YOUR OPINION AND FACTS, WE HAD FUN WIPING IN ZUL GURUB WITH FREEBIE RANK 14 GEAR IN DECEMBER 2006 IN PRE-TBC PATCH", "Who are you tell me" "and you have no proof" and all that usual random shit popping around in this forum 24/7.

    Things are gonna be 10000% stupider now because all the info is out there and its not only gonna be 100 people/server having a clue how things worked.

    Its gonna be way more, the majority is gonna be delusional people that believe they can achieve something with X amount of time, while there will be a group doing XXX amount of time and they have lost be default.

    Everything in Vanilla is based in time first and skill after because its literally joke content.

    For 2005, with no experience, terrible PCs and 250ms at BEST, it was the best game on Earth.

    For full on experience of 15 years on what to farm/skip etc, and average of 40ms? Yeahhhh.

    The ranking mafia is gonna be way, way way tougher assuming they dont open 200 servers and people end up rerolling on emptier servers to be alone and get their Rank 14 only to transfer back to a full server to PvE after.

    I didnt answer the BG part cause if crossrealm opens at any time before the last 3 months of Classic, its not "Vanilla experience".
    Last edited by potis; 2019-04-13 at 04:03 AM.

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by Kilz View Post
    Only change I want to see is Blizzard monitoring people grinding towards Rank 14 and banning the fuckers that account share. Ban them for a month and strip them of all ranks.
    I hope Blizzard reads this and agree with you

  9. #229
    Pandaren Monk Rusken's Avatar
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    I'm so excited for the old Honour system. Made PvPing actually feel worth it and earning the gear is the biggest accomplishment in the game. But you're right we should just give full HWL gear to anyone who plays more than 3 WSG's to the end.

    Get the fuck out of here.

  10. #230
    Quote Originally Posted by potis View Post
    The ranking mafia is gonna be way, way way tougher assuming they dont open 200 servers and people end up rerolling on emptier servers to be alone and get their Rank 14 only to transfer back to a full server to PvE after.

    I didnt answer the BG part cause if crossrealm opens at any time before the last 3 months of Classic, its not "Vanilla experience".
    Fair cop, thank you. Apparently Battlegroups were brought in in 1.12 and that's the patch they were aiming for I thought, but yeah nothing concrete on that yet.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleks0410 View Post
    I hope Blizzard reads this and agree with you
    I mean, considering they're putting in loot sharing because a few GMs back them would do it so some poeple think that's "true vanilla" and they can't be arsed with the manpower that would require these days, that a human is gonna be tracking PvP stuff or hours online is very much wishful thinking.
    Last edited by AeneasBK; 2019-04-13 at 12:02 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Skroe View Post
    Brexit: it's the dumbest WWE plotline to ever escape into real-life that can't end soon enough because everyone hates how it started, how it's going and how its going to end.
    Quote Originally Posted by AwkwardSquirtle View Post
    Trebuchets new meta.

  11. #231
    Pandaren Monk Crillam's Avatar
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    Yeah the old ranking system sucks. It doesn't reward people that are good, but reward them for, lets be honest... not having a life. (It can sometimes be both) It is not fun doing 20+ AVs a day with a premade, 7 days a week. But that's how vanilla was. Maybe a few years down the road they will change it, or maybe they won't.

  12. #232
    Quote Originally Posted by Hinastorm View Post
    The old highwarlord grind system is incredibly dumb. It rewards people who play 20 hours a day, and/or account share. Its an objectively bad system. And a perfect example of one of the things they should of changed for these servers.

    I know they are scared of opening pandoras box in regards to changes, but this one was a no brainer. Huge mistake.

    Anyone have an argument why this system is not embarrassingly awful?
    The entire premise for Classic is to bring back the original game. What don't you understand about that? Guessing you are just a troll looking to incite. Rather pathetic for somebody with a 10 year badge.

  13. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by lyphe View Post
    The entire premise for Classic is to bring back the original game. What don't you understand about that? Guessing you are just a troll looking to incite. Rather pathetic for somebody with a 10 year badge.
    Then you might aswell forfeit the idea of trying out the game because it's already been changed. The fact that the game is gonna run on Legion based core means that the game will never be or feel the same, in pretty much every aspect.

  14. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post
    DISCLAIMER: I don't personally mind what they do; any responses along the "hurr durr you thinkyou do but you don't" are kinda pointless at this stage. They can make no changes or some changes, it's up to them w/e. THAT SAID:


    You could keep the system and just make it so the top bracket includes the top 3 or 4% of players instead of 0.5% or 0.2% or w/e it was.

    That way you can be relatively sure that after 4 months of constant 8+hour-a-day PVP you're going to have a reward for it instead of having to play the dumb "PvP team politics" game and PVP solidly for 4 months and then another 15 weeks while you wait for your "place in the queue" to come up. Same system, broader reward appeal, because the whole "Play with the cartel or get fucked" emergent gameplay is kinda shitty. The argument to just "make your own group" doesn't hold a lot of merit because of the way the existing PvP ranking team will react to anyone potentially messing with their 'system'; I've witnessed it enough times on pirate servers to know its not a case of whether you're good at WoW PVP or anything like that it's "Are you in with the PVP clique or not"

    Before people say anything -I'm not talking about myself I've never struggled to get in and keep my head down, but I've seen it happen to other players who dare to try and rank up themselves; and that kind of competition isn't healthy. With the ease that both factions are going to be in communication with each other; theres absolutely 0 chance that ranking in PVP won't be a collusion effort between the 2 factions on that server.

    However with the potential for 4 or 5 players to attain highest CP bracket each week, players who are dedicated no-lifers will still have to play for a third of a year or w/e very regularly, the decay system will still be as effective, they just don't also have to win the "clique lottery" if they don't want to find themselves blacklisted or waiting half a year more for their "turn".

    In turn there is less chance of the cliques system getting messed up slightly by others; and they will be able to fix up their players in less time. Does this dilute the reward? Yes, of course it does. But it doesn't lessen the effort required it just levels the field, the first few people to get r14 will still have put in as much effort as tthey would have but the 10th player won't have had to put in twice as much, and the 20th won't have had to put in 3 times as much...
    3-4% is just too much. I understand where you're coming from but in a hypothetical server with a 5k pvp pool, there would be 200 players each week on bracket 1 earning insane amounts of RP. It wouldn't just make it easier for people invested in ranking to rank, it would be a shit show of players not very interested in pvp earning high ranks every single week.

    The vanilla honor system is flawed on many levels in my opinion, but making changes like this would warrant a ton of other changes not only for pvp systems but in player behavior as a whole

  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by Hinastorm View Post
    The old highwarlord grind system is incredibly dumb. It rewards people who play 20 hours a day, and/or account share. Its an objectively bad system. And a perfect example of one of the things they should of changed for these servers.

    I know they are scared of opening pandoras box in regards to changes, but this one was a no brainer. Huge mistake.

    Anyone have an argument why this system is not embarrassingly awful?
    It's vanilla's system. We want vanilla.

  16. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by Hinastorm View Post
    The old highwarlord grind system is incredibly dumb. It rewards people who play 20 hours a day, and/or account share. Its an objectively bad system. And a perfect example of one of the things they should of changed for these servers.

    I know they are scared of opening pandoras box in regards to changes, but this one was a no brainer. Huge mistake.

    Anyone have an argument why this system is not embarrassingly awful?
    The grind system is one of the most iconic systems of Vanilla, changing it would be one of the largest departures from the game that could be done. Vanilla PVP was about having no life, which subjectively to me is terrible but it's certainly not objectively bad based on that reason alone. I'm sure plenty of players look back on that time fondly, plenty of players absolutely wanted to be playing the game every day and that system allowed them to set themselves apart from others based on sheer dedication.

    I do think it's a bad system, but that's purely based on personal reasons and preferences, you need to find a better reason to justify massively changing the PVP game than just claiming it's "objectively bad". I don't think the game needs to be changed, the only people who are going to go for High Warlord are unemployed 20 year olds and that's fine, it doesn't need to be a PVP system that caters to the masses or casuals.

    If you played during Vanilla you're probably too old to play Classic properly anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by lollerlaban View Post
    Then you might aswell forfeit the idea of trying out the game because it's already been changed. The fact that the game is gonna run on Legion based core means that the game will never be or feel the same, in pretty much every aspect.
    This is silly, it's not difficult to replicate the game on the Legion core, I feel like you're one of those people who look at it like it's some magical mumbo jumbo that can't be replicated, like it's some organic being. It's just programming, they have all the information they need to replicate it exactly. Any differences will be negligible differences, irrelevant nitpicks that a minority of folks are going to blow out of proportion "I eat this food and my health reached 100% 0.1s too fast, game is ruined".

    The biggest difference from 2006 is that we're going to be playing with low latency on 4k monitors at 60fps+, just like we can on the original client. Blizzard have already confirmed that spell-batching is in, so gameplay should be exactly like Vanilla.
    Last edited by Bigbazz; 2019-04-13 at 02:16 PM.
    I7 6700K : 16GB DDR4 3000 : GTX1070 : Firestudio : Naga : G27

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by Daish View Post
    a unhonorable kill was something like -300 honor

    if a player in your party / raid tagged a unhonorable npc it would really fuck up your rank
    Which is why I never made it past Stone Guard. I did a fair amount of BG's, but even more world PvP. This got me plenty of DHK's, and while it was a bit annoying at first, I started to take pride in the amount of DHK's I had.

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by tikcol View Post
    3-4% is just too much. I understand where you're coming from but in a hypothetical server with a 5k pvp pool, there would be 200 players each week on bracket 1 earning insane amounts of RP. It wouldn't just make it easier for people invested in ranking to rank, it would be a shit show of players not very interested in pvp earning high ranks every single week.

    The vanilla honor system is flawed on many levels in my opinion, but making changes like this would warrant a ton of other changes not only for pvp systems but in player behavior as a whole
    Yeah even as I was suggesting it I realised that even increasing the bracket to 1% instead of 0.5 is just making it too easy. I'm now hoping that the BG system is cross realm as it would have been in 1.12 (as far as I can research at least, happy to be corrected) either through battlegroups or just all in one pot; so that it can dampen ths mafia gameplay, but we'll just have to see.

    I know it is pretty whiny to complain about it, but in my limited experience on the pirate servers, too many people in the ranking groups are just such utter assholes that severly lessen my enjoyment of the game (obviously I'm not saying "most" just there have always been enough of them) that having to get "in" with that crowd is a big turn off
    Quote Originally Posted by Skroe View Post
    Brexit: it's the dumbest WWE plotline to ever escape into real-life that can't end soon enough because everyone hates how it started, how it's going and how its going to end.
    Quote Originally Posted by AwkwardSquirtle View Post
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  19. #239
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolsteak View Post
    Everything doesn't have to be accessible to the lowest common denominator

    Don't like it? Don't do it, It's not for you
    as somebody who will never acquire a high PvP rank I completely agree with you!

  20. #240
    System would be fine with a small tweak. Instead of 16-18 hours a day for 3 months maybe 12-14 a day should be enough, so people don't actually end up dying from this broken system. It'd still be extremely exclusive, and probably more in line with how easy BWL and AQ gear is going to be obtained now that people know how to play.

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