Update to Recent Suspensions

[Irian]

"Honestly I think the now-uncovered widespread usage of these tools should be used to readdress how pitifully bad WoW's character customization is. "

I am ignoring the rest cause it just seems like alot of screaming about stuff liek "why didnt they do this sooner!" c...c.ause they didnt... simple as that?
"Why didnt they add an infernal mount in tbc why did it take all the way till legion!"
c....cause they did... simple as that my dude.

Congrats, then, you admit you paid no attention to a post you're attempting to refute. What was even your point of replying to me?
And who the hell said anything about an infernal mount? I'm talking about something extremely broad like customization options, not a specific thing that a niche group of players would be interested in. You can't just compare two entirely different criticisms of Blizzard unless you're just trying to say that nobody should criticize or expect anything of Blizzard beyond the bare minimum.

But for that point, no, that's not at all what I mean. You extrapolated a lot from that statement. Let me write it down in a clear way so you don't make a dunce out of yourself by making even more assumptions based on a single sentence.

I'm not justifying mod use, because I don't personally agree with mod usage. However I can't exactly blame them when there are so many massive gaps in character options to begin with. WoW's customization options are intentionally pitifully low to the degree that we're only just now getting an option to hide armor slots like gloves, chest, and bracers when there's absolutely no reason this should have taken 7 years into the game's length to implement.
And I'm not pointing these out for just complaining. I'm pointing out that this discussion about using mods is a great stepping off point to point out how pitiful the game's customization is. I don't want mods, but what I would definitely like is if Blizzard stopped neglecting the absolutely massive amount of the playerbase who wants more cosmetic stuff beyond a 700th mount reskin.

To prove my point, there are several hairstyles available and fully functional to players in the game files that have no problems whatsoever that are mysteriously not on the barber shop. Why? Who the hell knows, there are even NPCs in new BfA zones wearing some of these hairstyles and yet we can't use them on our own characters.

also because 99% of the playerbase never sees their hairstyle.

You'd be right if you weren't, well, completely and totally wrong. The majority of the playerbase hides their helmets or uses non-hair covering helmets on their characters on virtually every server I've ever been on.

Do you seriously believe that or are you just making arguments for the sake of some kind of meaningless point? Your posts seem like just a stream of consciousness.

[Villentretenmerth]

Incredible that there are seriously people here who are angry that people who used Modeledits got unbanned. I'm really glad I don't play this shitty Game anymore, this Community has gone full retard! Blizzard should fucking thank the people who make custom Models - lots of people would not play without them.

[RaZz0r]

Honestly i think player character cosmetic edits should be allowed there is A LOT of shit old textures in this game for both gear and mounts.
there is also alot of clipping problems with pretty much all hair styles and pretty much all helms a active modding community could easily fix those things.
As blizzard most likely wont do it granted there will be tig ol bitties and other weird mods only used by REALLY small amount of people.
I think that it would overall be better for the game to allow the players to further customize there characters.

Naturally things like terrain and world objects should not be allowed to be edited as someone who used to play around with models and such Player models and textures.
Are placed in a completely different area of the game compared to world objects and terrain i just don't see why those things would not be allowed to be edited.
Just like how we can currently edit sound files.

[SoundOfGuns]

Snip

Im actually not sure about the interaction-range. But like i said, the resizing of both the flag and the node can certainly be done. It certainly worked in BC because thats how a lot of assholes did grind netherwing-reputation till they got whooped. 3miles tall eggs are easy to find at least.

However you are kind of wrong with everything else here tho, no offense. No, these guys would not go here, but go to mmowned or ownedcore these days or can be found on places like the WOWMV's Discord and similar sides focussing on Machinimacreation. Also reading helps; No, i did not do any "botting" or "malicious hacking". But i use evermorph and used tmorph before because im kind of done staring at the same character for over a decade but a race change is not viable due to racials, so there is that. I also used self-made skins to recolor the utter mess that were T-Sets during Wrath before transmogging was a thing. My account, however, stands strong and unaffected since EU-Release, as it should.

Also, i kind of don't really believe this could have happened during Legion, are you sure you are not remembering that wrong? Because the same kind of fix was implemented somewhere in Cataclysm, then extended upon during Pandaria which is also why you no longer can get under the map as easy as you could before... I think there was something in Draenor but that was short lived? And it also did not have anything to do with flying, but made the disconnect-thing that is another safety method to prevent you from getting where you should not be not work.

Also for fuck sake spare me the CThun exploit. Half of the people commenting here were barely sentient when that was a thing. Yea, replacing inworld items with another worked and it did with heavy manipulation till late Wrath, but then they changed the way their entire system worked. You can also see that this video is way pre-cataclysm just by how orgrimmars gates look.

Im not going to argue to defend hackers and botters. I am fairly irritated by that myself when i see 7 druid-cats running through Tiri... Tirisgardesund? ... The Boralus-Area, all in one place with like 0,1 seconds delay and farm all the fucking shrubbery away before i even see them. But you don't ban your fans when all they do is customization or machinimas. That's kind of a group of people selling your shitty game and probably the guys you want to keep if they don't hurt anybody because they tend to be very devoted.

[steristumpie]

Just putting it out here, AHK, Punchkey users didn't get Suspended. (Rapidfire key programs)

I’ve used ahk in the past. With key presser apps and keyboard macro software, the only impact it has is you kill mobs (albeit a lot slower) by holding down 1 button. It has zero impact on the game or anyone else, other than you carrying their way below par dps. I stopped because it feels silly and gets boring and slows your questing down rather than speed it up. I also did my research first and found a gm reply saying ahk isn’t against ToS. I’m sure technically it is, but one gm reply was enough defense for me to try it.

The way I understand it, they’re mainly used by disabled players to quest / lfr.

[Aprete]

Have you actually looked for it? I mean, really looked, as if honestly interested about that? It's not like those guys actually advertise their mods and put adds in MMO fansites. I mean, I played Skyrim for almost a year before I finally found out about the Skyrim modding community when stumbled upon a Skyrim mod video on YouTube.

By the way: I have never seen someone make a botting mod for WoW either, but I do know those bots exist, since I've seen bots working in WoW back in the day. You not seeing those hack mods being made does not mean they do not exist.


Guess why those guys who use this launcher got caught in the ban-wave? It's highly likely because their launcher was doing the same thing (i.e. "injecting code"), or similar enough, to what the more harmful hack mods do. If it wasn't doing that, it wouldn't have caught.

I mean, a turtle can be caught in a fishing net. Does that mean turtles are fish?


Those that used the hack launcher simply to alter their characters' looks in ways that do not harm the game were quickly unbanned, since they were not doing any "botting/automation". But that does not mean they did not break the ToS.

Talking out of your ass for the sake of arguing with me, you got nothing better to do, do you ?
How about this, you actually use fucking Google and see for yourself if those "exploit" mods exist and that they were made with Arctium in mind, get back to me after ok ? i'll ignore the whole botting thing because that's the dumbest thing that I've read in a while

I already explained that the launcher interfered with the Warden protection in order to work which again you seem to have no idea what the fuck that is...
Tos...Tos...did it seem like Blizzard enforced it ? everyone got fucking unbanned, so no.

[Trassk]

no more big boobs in wow ....

Nope, but after the invisible shirtless transmog option, there be plenty of big, juicy, bouncy pecs to admire!

[Kauko]

Now everyone was using mods just for boobs and similar RP bs... Just stop acting, most of people used this mods for PVP advantage. Just like boters, everytime with another excuse. Just ban them all.

[Merie]

It's unfortunate that those just wanting anime tiddies on their character are lumped in with those that exploit for tactical advantage. If Blizzard has the ability to discern between the two, they should just allow it.

[Lollis]

I'd rather Blizzard grow a spine and permaban people like they used to.

Most other games do to set an example. Blizzard stopped doing it as of late and people still break the rules when they come back.

It's sad they prioritise profit over setting an example these days.

They have already stated their rationale for not permabanning. They found that with permabans, people will just say fuck it and make a new account which they will just exploit/bot again with anyway.

With temporary bans, people are much less likely to make a new account simply because they will get access back to their old account in a relatively short timeframe anyway. There is no feeling of 'gameover' which they would get if their account was completely closed off.

[MrHappy]

You seem like the kind of person that also believes in the wiki about 30 FPS.

You can't believe or not believe in facts....they are facts. Maybe if you actually read the ToS of the game they are playing you wouldn't be surprised by consequences of breaching what you blindly clicked accept on.

[Mardux]

You seem like the kind of person that also believes in the wiki about 30 FPS.

You seem like the kind of person that thinks they are above rules and also thinks consequences shouldn't apply to them.

[FelPlague]

Maybe the addon system could just be expanded to cover some models if these kind of modifications are so popular.

Texture edits are pretty harmless.
Model edits could only be applied to specific objects and they have to fit within specific sizes to be allowed.
All modifications could be protected so they are disabled for stuff like raiding/pvp.
It could even be a paid unlock feature so it's only used by those that really care about it, while also funding the extra development time to implement it for those people.

It would be a great way to gain resources from the community too, as once its legitimised it also means things like old texture upgrades could be done by the community rather than taking up blizzard artist time.

Texture edits are very much not harmless, you can make the stealth bump texture bright orange for example.
or mining nodes bright pink to make them much easier to see
Imagine the load times of when changing from world to PVP having to switch all the textures, im sure some people would enter areanas with thier healer already dead.
lol you want MORE on the store?
there is alot of legal issues with getting stuff the community makes and putting it in the game, with stuff like TF2 i beleive they get a small cut.
but if its free in wow, then what?

- - - Updated - - -

I already explained that the launcher interfered with the Warden protection in order to work which again you seem to have no idea what the fuck that is...
Tos...Tos...did it seem like Blizzard enforced it ? everyone got fucking unbanned, so no.

Yes, they have done ban waves of this in vanilla, wotlk, and wod.

[Ielenia]

Talking out of your ass for the sake of arguing with me, you got nothing better to do, do you ?

This is so deliciously ironic considering your very next sentence:

How about this, you actually use fucking Google and see for yourself if those "exploit" mods exist and that they were made with Arctium in mind, get back to me after ok ?

How about you quote me when I said that those mods "were made with Arctium in mind"? Considering I even said, and you quoted: "It's highly likely because their launcher was doing the same thing (i.e. "injecting code"), or similar enough, to what the more harmful hack mods do."

And yes. Blizzard does enforce their ToS. Remember the whole "Preach got banned for using an exploit" discussion?

- - - Updated - - -

Also, i kind of don't really believe this could have happened during Legion, are you sure you are not remembering that wrong? Because the same kind of fix was implemented somewhere in Cataclysm, then extended upon during Pandaria which is also why you no longer can get under the map as easy as you could before... I think there was something in Draenor but that was short lived? And it also did not have anything to do with flying, but made the disconnect-thing that is another safety method to prevent you from getting where you should not be not work.

Yes, it was during Legion. I remember because I've never seen a bot before, it stuck with me: Azsuna, just west of the Blue Dragon area, south of the area with all the cats. There was a mining node and as I approached it, I noticed someone falling down right onto it. He mined the node, then summoned a flying mount. From there is literally went straight up. But it wasn't "flying", it was like it was constantly "respawning" just a little higher, gaining altitude that way, before turning around and "flying" straight away, in that same manner, as if it was constantly "respawning" just a little bit ahead. The mount, as well, was always playing its standing idle animation, not the flight animation.

Also for fuck sake spare me the CThun exploit. Half of the people commenting here were barely sentient when that was a thing.

How about you tone it down? I never even mentioned C'Thun. I was talking about wall-hacking to get to safe areas in BGs.

[FelPlague]

Also for fuck sake spare me the CThun exploit. Half of the people commenting here were barely sentient when that was a thing. Yea, replacing inworld items with another worked and it did with heavy manipulation till late Wrath, but then they changed the way their entire system worked. You can also see that this video is way pre-cataclysm just by how orgrimmars gates look.

Im not going to argue to defend hackers and botters. I am fairly irritated by that myself when i see 7 druid-cats running through Tiri... Tirisgardesund? ... The Boralus-Area, all in one place with like 0,1 seconds delay and farm all the fucking shrubbery away before i even see them. But you don't ban your fans when all they do is customization or machinimas. That's kind of a group of people selling your shitty game and probably the guys you want to keep if they don't hurt anybody because they tend to be very devoted.

The video is from wotlk.
so no, obviously wotlk did not fix it.
also "spare me the cthun exploit, half of the people commenting here were barely sentient when that was a thing"
2005, you think most of the people here were born in 2003-2005? i dont think many people here are 13-16

so nah, we arnt gunna ignore the biggest possible exploit ever of what this whole thread is about.

So report them, and they will eventually be banned.
also idk if you know, but the injection method used to get these custom textures ingame is the same that was used for bot injecting, why they were banned for "botting/third party"

also Ielenia literally didnt say anything about c'thun

[Eleccybubb]

Incredible that there are seriously people here who are angry that people who used Modeledits got unbanned. I'm really glad I don't play this shitty Game anymore, this Community has gone full retard! Blizzard should fucking thank the people who make custom Models - lots of people would not play without them.

Indeed. Not like some random people getting unbanned affects them lol.

However Blizzard as I said seriously need to start setting an example and permabanning those that do things that are banworthy.

They only stopped doing it recently because as I said it's losing them money which is a damn shame.

Hell they only reverted the 180 days because that's 6 months of sub lost on their end. Sad.

[Arakakao]

So... we are not gonna be able to use the new models mod in Classic?

[sibut]

Ha, botting as a "malicious action." What a fucking joke. I love people who bot for resource gathering; it makes shit affordable for those of us who can't dedicate 40+ hours a week to the game. But hey, gotta cater to the mouthbreathers who spend all the time controlling the markets so they can save up for more tcg mounts. Good work, Blizz, continue keeping us safe.

[Kithelle]

People know, they just enjoy things different to you. I don't care about skin mods myself, but I don't think someone that wants to play with a Mod only he/she can see should be banworthy.

- - - Updated - - -



They haven't always permabanned at any point in WoW. So your attempt to try the usual "HURR NEW BLIZAARD IS CHANGED" is pointless.

It's against the rules....they break them then they should get banned, doesn't matter if all it's for is a *titty* mod.

- - - Updated - - -

A lot of people used them to fix vanilla armor textures as well from what I know. Why does it matter when it's client side only?

It's against the rules....break the rules and they should be banned

- - - Updated - - -

You shouldn't dictate where people get their "exotic entertainment", and if they mod a game to show huge tits, only in their client, they should be able to do that.

Well they want to risk getting banned to get their rocks off, then they deserve it.

- - - Updated - - -

LOL. I gave up fighting that fight years ago. Some guys just need bewbs 24/7. Hey, someone has to have arrested development.

But I like this reversal. I think Ion may be getting emails from the top, along the lines of "Dude, that's a bit harsh for sloot mods - and do I need to remind you we're fighting to retain subs here?." Someone at Blizzard seems to be calling out the decisions, and that's great, whether it's Brack, the new producer, Ion, whoever. It's a good direction.

It's a good sign they're willing to reverse bad decisions, like this, and the portals. The WoW devs have oddly dug their heels into the sand on some issues in the past, nice to see someone is keeping that from happening,

- - - Updated - - -



I dimly recall some coming out in vanilla, that some people got temp bans for. I remember laughing at cartoon nipples in guild chat.

No....they just fucked shit up and they're worried about losing subs so they tucked their tails between their legs.

[Alkizon]

Merie
It's unfortunate that those just wanting anime tiddies on their character are lumped in with those that exploit for tactical advantage. If Blizzard has the ability to discern between the two, they should just allow it.

Well, actually, they could have done it in some way “officially”. If it's possible to create mods, then it's possible to include "allowed content" in client and make it available for editing by everyone (not through client itself, of course, but through some official "sources"), which means to make it "visible for anyone". Community will eventually complement base as some of them get official "approval". That will allow them, quite consciously, without any moral remorse of conscience, officially ban those who “impatient in waiting for approval, disagree with it or really are abusing system”.

...what will turn this "mod" into something more legal and controllable from security point of view (in fact, no longer being a mod), since it doesn't violate "moral" component (doesn't carry abuse of system's imperfection in order to gain game advantage)... or does?

I don't in any way justify even those people who change just some kind of custom "non-essential" elements. No-no-no. And most of you even know why, don't you? I'm against breaking rules, and I think that law should, no! must apply equally to everyone. But laws in some places aren't perfect, which sometimes leads to similar moral confrontations, it's probably necessary for them to group culprits more successfully in connection with their main signs here, which means that these "signs" require more tangible designation (law doesn't change here, just being specified, and therefore continues to be fully relevant and working). So why not try to make it more civilized. Naturally, it won't be everything to be “approving” from stylistic point of view, but what will get “approval” can be used without fear and for your own pleasure - fully and effectively. It turns out such mutual concession without confrontation: devs agree to “legalize” what doesn't go beyond of what is permissible, and players agree that they won't do it “secretly”, which, in violation event, doesn't entail negative consequences (devs won't have any moral remorse about excessive power abuse during law application, and players won't shame them for "excessive cruelty together with passive own inaction to resolve conflicts of interest"). Otherwise, everything must follow the law without exception, which means that “partial” un-ban directly isn't eligible here (there're no extenuating circumstances, but surely there is mention about "on their discretion", which isn't very similar to "legislative" formulation; I don’t have their contract before my eyes, because game client has been removed along with battle.net something like 4 years ago already, correct me if I'm mistaken).

ps. I repeat. I'm generally against any addons - any unofficial "software", because in one way or another it affects gameplay (and for me control over character model appearance is quite objectively integral part of this process), and even if look at phenomenon more widely (I'm about excessive modern player's "third-party software" dependence during encounters (both in PvP&PvE), absence of which in their success would give real their exclusive skills' indicator and clearly slow down content consumption speed and requirements in its complexity)... but if consider this issue in principle...