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  1. #301
    Titan Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ViolenceJackRespectsWomen View Post
    I called you a liar because clearly the word racist triggers you for some unknown reason. If someone shows abolish behavior, I call them an asshole. If someone does racist things, I call them racist.
    You called me a liar because of your lack of reading comprehension. I just thought it was a weird thing to bring up in a case like that.

    He had Asperger and that not an excuse either way but I was wrong about that.
    No, having Asperger's is not an excuse for literal murder. But I'm not sure, given his mental health record, if he can be taken as representative of the "incel community." Which was my initial point.

    He's an "incel terrorist," sure, but I'm not sure any discussion of incels that uses Rodger as a focal point is going to be productive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Giving women the option of working
    Women could work prior to the 60s, they just tended not to. The country was better for it.

    not being "wards" of their parents, husbands, etc
    There was no separate legal category for women. They were wards of no one.

    making sex less taboo were all good things.
    Genuinely curious how is this a good thing?

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    You called me a liar because of your lack of reading comprehension. I just thought it was a weird thing to bring up in a case like that.


    No, having Asperger's is not an excuse for literal murder. But I'm not sure, given his mental health record, if he can be taken as representative of the "incel community." Which was my initial point.

    He's an "incel terrorist," sure, but I'm not sure any discussion of incels that uses Rodger as a focal point is going to be productive.



    Women could work prior to the 60s, they just tended not to. The country was better for it.


    There was no separate legal category for women. They were wards of no one.


    Genuinely curious how is this a good thing?
    That's not true that correlation at best otherwise link sources. A lot of things happened between now and the 60 your over simplifying the issue. The problem is income equality, social mobility, and wages. It's a lot hard to do what your parents did and requires a much higher education. Most household need two sources of income now because of drunken spending by the government.

    I called you a liar because you clearly care when someone uses the word racist. You kept dragging it back into the conversation while be trigger by it. If it bothers you that much ignore it next time.

    He embodied everything wrong with most Incels though so he is a good example.
    Last edited by ViolenceJackRespectsWomen; 2019-04-30 at 09:12 PM.
    Violence Jack Respects Women!

  3. #303
    Titan Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ViolenceJackRespectsWomen View Post
    That's not true that correlation at best otherwise link sources. A lot of things happened between now and the 60 your over simplifying the issue.
    Sources for what exactly?

    He embodied everything wrong with most Incels though so he is a good example.
    In the sense that he was violent? Sure. But rehabilitation of someone with mental health issues is going to look a lot different than any action that could be taken with otherwise neurotypical individuals who have ended up as incels, or somewhere in that sphere.

  4. #304
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    It was not just observed in him, as everyone has it, if you dig down deep enough. Both women and men.
    As everyone has it? Freud is a case study of how not to practice ethical and scientifically sound psychology

  5. #305
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Sources for what exactly?


    In the sense that he was violent? Sure. But rehabilitation of someone with mental health issues is going to look a lot different than any action that could be taken with otherwise neurotypical individuals who have ended up as incels, or somewhere in that sphere.
    That women entering the work force hurt the US.

    Nah in the sense that he couldn't focus on fixing or pin pointing his own issues and instead tried to project them on to others. He couldn't self critique at all.
    Violence Jack Respects Women!

  6. #306
    Quote Originally Posted by Zafire View Post
    That wasn't even the point I was trying to make, but I'll bite.

    Thank god for the social responsibility of men needing to provide something to be desirable.
    Thank god more and more women are actually able to make it for themselves

    P.s given most of the men subject itt cant provide for themselves your point is a bit moot

  7. #307
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    It's not just hippies it's humanity, all races, genders, orientations or backgrounds. $$$$$$$ Talks.

    Plenty of legitimate highly intelligent people know better, but sell the fuck out all the time because $$$$$$$.

    Because telling stupid people what they want to hear is a lucrative business.
    Totes.

    I was trying to figure out why connal thought hippies were moral paragons. My guess is that they are an old

  8. #308
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Violence, and vengeance as well. Not that I am "surprised" by that... it's just a predictable expectation.

    I think people are mad at me, thinking I condone it because I will not name call, or hate the "incels" for it. For the most part, I do not blame them, though responsibility is something they should take on. I look at the culture that is creating these people, instead.

    But changing culture is a fool's errand. Culture changes when people change, and we do not want to do that.
    A single man can easily change the world and that includes culture. Take drawings of the prophet Mohammad. All it took was one man willing to kill and die and since then the entire west has had its back broken on the subject and were scared into silence.

    A single man no matter how base can change the world for the better or worse through his actions. A single construction worker can easily have had a major role in the construction of a dozen building that will last over a century.

    A single man with nothing can pick up a weapon and shatter dozens of lives with it and effecting millions more to a much lesser degree.

    Change will come it always does.

  9. #309
    The Undying Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Josuke View Post
    Totes.

    I was trying to figure out why connal thought hippies were moral paragons. My guess is that they are an old
    My guess is he is fucking confused and disingenuous with a lot of bullshit like he always is, until called on it and he pivots on My Autism or some other bullshit.

    He clings to tired ass hippies as moral paragons because he is generally full of shit in my opinion. It could be ignorance but it's not, he knows he is spewing nonsense.
    Last edited by Doctor Amadeus; 2019-04-30 at 09:23 PM.
    "Intellect alone is useless in a fight...you can't even break a rule, how can you be expected to break bone" Khan Singh

  10. #310
    I cannot sympathize with anyone that blames all their problems on somebody else and takes absolutely zero responsibility or action on themselves to do better, try harder, try something different...just WORK at it.

    Incels are generally socially isolated because of their own decisions and actions. They may not choose to be socially isolated, but they do choose to act the way they do which makes them socially isolated. That's on THEM, not society. If you want to live a relatively normal life and have relatively normal social interactions you have to conform to most of the social norms, though some things can be overlooked for several reasons (good looks, lots of money, charisma, talent, etc...).

    And the whole nice guy thing is fucking stupid. I can't find the tweet I first saw it in, but it was phrased really well. Basically, "nice" is not a personality trait, it's not a characteristic, it's not a talent or anything that really means ANYTHING, especially if that's your only claim. it's the bare minimum expectation for how people should interact with others. Being "nice" doesn't mean shit when the rest of you is not noteworthy, or noteworthy for the wrong reasons.

  11. #311
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    That is change though tyranny... as noted, I do not fault that.

    But if we want to avoid tyranny, the change has to be in each person.
    Humanity in a state that isn't tyranny is a humanity rebelling against its true nature.

    Strength of body, strength of mind, and strength of will are what will always determine the fates of the individual and of society.

  12. #312
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    My guess is he is fucking confused and disingenuous with a lot of bullshit like he always is, until called on it and he pivots on My Autism or some other bullshit.

    He clings to tired ass hippies as moral paragons because he is generally full of shit in my opinion. It could be ignorance but it's not, he knows he is spewing nonsense.
    You probably know better than I do.

  13. #313
    Quote Originally Posted by Has lost its way View Post
    Humanity in a state that isn't tyranny is a humanity rebelling against its true nature.

    Strength of body, strength of mind, and strength of will are what will always determine the fates of the individual and of society.
    You watch to much TV

  14. #314
    Titan Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Giving that choice should still be there.
    Legally they had that choice, they just weren't being constantly bombarded with propaganda to do so.

    On paper? No. As a culture? Yes, they were. But usually in the more educated, upper scale parts of society where women were seen as "fairer" and more emotional. In the country(rural areas), where farming was still done, both men and women tended to be equal. So this is really an issue with modernity.
    Rural communities weren't really egalitarian, either. That's fine, men and women are different and should have different cultural expectations. Things tend to work better when that's the case.

    Because suppressing sexuality too much has consequences for a culture, and people. Keeping sex private, in the bedroom, etc, is fine, and that would have been the "moderate" approach. I am not talking about being loose sexually. Moderation needs to be practiced with sex... especially with sex.
    Go read literally any single one of J.D. Unwin's works. I'd recommend "Monogamy as a Condition of Social Energy" or "Sex and Culture."

    The single most successful model for social organization is abstinence until (lifelong) marriage. The Hippies helped undo that. We're currently dealing with the consequences. Incels are part of those consequences.

    Quote Originally Posted by ViolenceJackRespectsWomen View Post
    That women entering the work force hurt the US.
    I'm far more concerned with social consequences. The impact on working people was laid out fairly well, ironically by Elizabeth Warren, in "The Two Income Trap." As far as my actual concern goes, financially liberating husbands was a negative development. I'm really not sure what else can be said on that front.

    Nah in the sense that he couldn't focus on fixing or pin pointing his own issues and instead tried to project them on to others. He couldn't self critique at all.
    He absolutely couldn't, but again, dealing with him, or any other mentally ill individual, is going to be considerably different from dealing with individuals who aren't. I'm not saying every member of the incel community is mentally healthy, they're clearly not, but there's going to be a difference in approach.

    Take conspiracy theorists for example, the out there ones. There are literal schizophrenics running around in conspiracy circles. Rehabilitating them is going to be entirely different than talking sense into someone who's mentally "fine," but somehow believes everything is a false flag. They might both believe in Lizard People, or things of that nature, they might have similar personal faults, but "dealing with them" isn't going to work if we're focusing on the schizophrenics.

  15. #315
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I did not say they were moral paragons, only that to me, that was the left I was attracted to growing up. I am in my late 30's now, so not that old.

    Wait you're in your 30s and haven't grown out of your hippie phase?

  16. #316
    The Undying Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Josuke View Post
    You probably know better than I do.
    Hahaha yeah if you are paying attention you know too, just as everyone else, because his bullshit act works. It's exactly how he gets away with half the shit he gets away with ironically. Especially for the amount of nonsense he spews.
    "Intellect alone is useless in a fight...you can't even break a rule, how can you be expected to break bone" Khan Singh

  17. #317
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Rebelling, and transcending are not the same thing. But I can also agree with your assessment... for humanity... currently.
    I sense that it could be a topic onto itself so will tentatively agree till that topic arises I have to leave or would pursue it now.

    As on incels in general they lack the will to become anything. That can always change but they need to find it themselves no one can really help them with that past childhood as it requires facing true problems and over coming them.

  18. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    Hahaha yeah if you are paying attention you know too, just as everyone else, because his bullshit act works. It's exactly how he gets away with half the shit he gets away with ironically. Especially for the amount of nonsense he spews.
    I'm honestly surprised people still engage him. He is a broken record that always manages to play the same old shit including Peterson, Paglia and Jung in whatever order fits his disingenuous drivel. It was old years ago; people are just too polite to tell him to finally stfu.

  19. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    For all of the many faults he has, Jordan Peterson kind of gets this too. He just doesn't phrase it well, or take it to its logical conclusion because he's a milquetoast, mediocre charlatan.
    Peterson is a man selling Christian theology without actually believing in Christ, so to speak. Admirable, but mistaken.

  20. #320
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    No, I continue to fight the nihilistic, jaded zeitgeist of this current culture.
    What's wrong with nihilism exactly?

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