View Poll Results: Do you like BFA’s story more than WOD

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  • BFA’s story is worse than WOD’s story

    157 46.04%
  • BFA’s story isn’t worse than WOD

    184 53.96%
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  1. #221
    Bloodsail Admiral DaHomieG's Avatar
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    There was absolutely nothing bad about WoD's story, so that's where your post fucks up in the first place. The theme and story of WoD was great; the content that was provided was what was bad.

  2. #222
    Bloodsail Admiral Whitedragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rafoel View Post
    WoD story wasn't bad. It had the smoothest in-out transitions with other expansions.
    ...? Smoothest? At what end?

    Starting up we have a black dragon convince a bronze dragon that letting an orc go and taking him to an alternate reality is a good idea. After arriving the orc promptly kills the bronze dragon then proceeds to kindle an incredible technological revolution... somehow... Not only somehow advancing the tec of the clans to Azeroth levels, but in some cases even surpassing it... but lets ignore that for now. Next up he proceeds to somehow open a portal of which he had exactly zero idea on how it was originally made, he dose this without the help of the one who did it, without the magic they used to do it with, nor did he have the help of someone on the other side to connect the 2 points this time...

    Jumping ahead past all the stupid plot points and throwing away of of lore figures they broke the timeline to give us in the first place, we get to HFC where we get the not dead Archamond because as long as we are reusing old enemies why not some demons as well, but don't worry Blizzard added the new plot point that demons don't actually die unless they die in the twisting nether, unless they do die for good outside of the twisting nether... for reasons... sometimes... maybe... not even blizzard knows... Let's ignore that for now, we kill the demon but Guldan in the nick of time reopens the portal and gets flung through it, where on the other side he lucks out that we left zero guards to watch the other end of the portal, he also somehow has a very good knowledge of our world and it's history miraculously because our Guldan and him where somehow linked.... somehow... ohh ya he also had knowledge about things he wasn't there for... But let's ignore that for now as well. Next up we somehow forget that he came through to our world and leave the most obvious locations for him to go after ungraded, where he somehow single handedly summons the legions vanguard to our world (also without us noticing I might add), lastly he manages to infiltrate the enemy intelligence agency fairly easily and completely mislead them into making a suicide attack...

    amazingly smooth....

  3. #223
    Titan Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaHomieG View Post
    There was absolutely nothing bad about WoD's story, so that's where your post fucks up in the first place. The theme and story of WoD was great; the content that was provided was what was bad.
    Uhh... what? WoD's story was absolutely ridiculous. The theme was complete garbage too. What in the Hell are you on about?

    Were you really satisfied, after spending the latter half of the previous expansion ousting a good Warchief, to go back in time and kill Horde heroes of yesteryear in some ridiculous bizarro world? Did you somehow enjoy "One Legion, many unvierses?" Do you actually think "Time travel and Alternate Universes" are fine, and not the absolute worst sort of comic book-tier writing?

  4. #224
    BFA is worse solely for the War stuff. The leveling story of both factions is good. The War Campaign, basically everything starting from prepatch onwards doesn't make much sense.

  5. #225
    Bloodsail Admiral Whitedragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaHomieG View Post
    There was absolutely nothing bad about WoD's story, so that's where your post fucks up in the first place. The theme and story of WoD was great; the content that was provided was what was bad.
    Time traveling, reincarnated Orcs brought back for nostalgia only, who we promptly kill leaving us with nothing, Loads of cut plot points leaving large unexplained gaps in what should have been, a new Horde Warchief getting completely ignored, Horde and Alliance going back to war... just kuz... demons not actually dieing because we didn't kill them while there was the proper amount of space magic around, Guldan somehow avoiding us even with his shadow clan being much weaker/smaller then the MU counterpart, one of our best mages tracking him as best he could the whole time we where there, and all 3 major factions in the war (+ the ogres, Botani, gron, saberon, and Arakoa most likely as well) being his direct enemy.

    WoD's level up process was fun, and it's raids where okay, that's about all it had.

  6. #226
    Herald of the Titans Nagrash's Avatar
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    The best part of WoD was in the introduction scenario when Khadgar is just like yeah.. why don't you go ahead and free Teron'gor, Cho'gall AND Gul'dan. What could go wrong right? They're nobodies..

    It really set the tone for the rest of the expansion.
    Comfortably Numb

  7. #227
    Bloodsail Admiral DaHomieG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Uhh... what? WoD's story was absolutely ridiculous. The theme was complete garbage too. What in the Hell are you on about?

    Were you really satisfied, after spending the latter half of the previous expansion ousting a good Warchief, to go back in time and kill Horde heroes of yesteryear in some ridiculous bizarro world? Did you somehow enjoy "One Legion, many unvierses?" Do you actually think "Time travel and Alternate Universes" are fine, and not the absolute worst sort of comic book-tier writing?
    The only "good" Warchief is an orc warchief. Been that way since the First War. I personally don't acknowledge Vol'jin and Sylvanas.

    And obviously the writing wasn't good but the theme was cool as shit. You can't tell me the Iron Horde wasn't fucking badass come on my guy. All the orcish clans uniting under one banner and using modern technology to create badass metal monstrosities? Shit was cash

  8. #228
    Even though BFA and its story suck balls, there's no way it's worse than WoD however you may compare them. WoD was just a massive let down, the end doesn't even make sense.

  9. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by DaHomieG View Post
    The only "good" Warchief is an orc warchief. Been that way since the First War. I personally don't acknowledge Vol'jin and Sylvanas.

    And obviously the writing wasn't good but the theme was cool as shit. You can't tell me the Iron Horde wasn't fucking badass come on my guy. All the orcish clans uniting under one banner and using modern technology to create badass metal monstrosities? Shit was cash
    He means Garrosh. The best Warchief since Orgrim. The whole previous expansion was based around overthrowing him and killing much of the orc cast in order to elevate Vol'jin and a kumbaya fortune cookie message.

    While I also like the Iron Horde, they were not just antagonists, but antagonists that the game gutted by having them not even control most of Draenor and be beaten back immediately after some minor wins despite logically being more powerful. This is without mentioning that the Horde experience consisted of killing the WC2 Horde cast again, partly on the orders of a WC2 Alliance character. It's only BFA that added the fleshed out clans and the Iron Horde back into the MU Horde.

    Past that, I agree with you in so far as WoD is better than BFA setting-wise and it ultimately had no impact on much of anything.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

  10. #230
    Bloodsail Admiral DaHomieG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    He means Garrosh. The best Warchief since Orgrim. The whole previous expansion was based around overthrowing him and killing much of the orc cast in order to elevate Vol'jin and a kumbaya fortune cookie message.

    While I also like the Iron Horde, they were not just antagonists, but antagonists that the game gutted by having them not even control most of Draenor and be beaten back immediately after some minor wins despite logically being more powerful. This is without mentioning that the Horde experience consisted of killing the WC2 Horde cast again, partly on the orders of a WC2 Alliance character. It's only BFA that added the fleshed out clans and the Iron Horde back into the MU Horde.

    Past that, I agree with you in so far as WoD is better than BFA setting-wise and it ultimately had no impact on much of anything.
    Honestly if Blizzard didn't rush the expansion to get their demon-boner throbbing for Legion, WoD would've been one of the best expansion we've ever gotten. The ogre continent, Faralon, etc would've been so good

  11. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by DaHomieG View Post
    Honestly if Blizzard didn't rush the expansion to get their demon-boner throbbing for Legion, WoD would've been one of the best expansion we've ever gotten. The ogre continent, Faralon, etc would've been so good
    I don't know about the best, but I loved Draenor and the clans, so I agree. And not getting Farahlon was a crime. They'd have time to have Grom turn more naturally.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

  12. #232
    Quote Originally Posted by DaHomieG View Post
    Honestly if Blizzard didn't rush the expansion to get their demon-boner throbbing for Legion, WoD would've been one of the best expansion we've ever gotten. The ogre continent, Faralon, etc would've been so good
    Completely agree. Having recently gone back through the leveling while working on an Allied Race, I think that very level of quality shows in the leveling experience and had it been allowed to carry forward would have been a surprisingly good expansion.

    Can you imagine if we'd gotten WoD as it was initially set up to be? A fully customizable garrison which could be moved & set on each land mass of the continent, capital cities in Karabor & Bladespire, a slow & steady rollout of each leader from the Iron Horde complete with clan story, Farahlon as an expansive land mass alongside the supposed Ogre continent to the south of the Draenor we explored. Plus that Shattrath raid.

  13. #233
    WoD has fuck-juggled with several very important concepts within the lore; timelines and multiverses, timelapses between said timelines and multiverses, the Burning Legion's existence across all realities and a few more that are far less noteworthy. A very important thing is how the ending made absolutely zero sense whatsoever and BfA still has to be judged on that.

    The only shortcoming of BfA is that the faction conflict theme quickly turned out to not be the main drive of the expansion halfway through it. That's like a mild inconvenience compared to the clusterfuck caused by WoD in which they refashioned what constitutes a demon's deadzone, how demons can not only die in the Twisting Nether, but also possibly(?)... relatively... surely in areas super-saturated with fel too.

    The Burning Legion was the one thing that overarched almost all Warcraft stories at that point in time. They were the big bad guys who did most of the bad stuff across the universe. To mess with the story concepts of such an important participant in the lore is incomparable to anything bad BfA could've brought forward.

    The BfA complaints mostly boil down to individual plot executions and representations, not overarching super-important concepts like the existence of the Burning Legion. Why Anduin rushes Lordaeron without thinking about the plague, why Saurfang didn't kill Malfurion, how Derek turned out to have a body after being incinerated to ash and similar questions are mild inconveniences compared to the aforementioned, but these minor inconveniences seem to be huge problems simply because players have more personal investment into their faction and said faction's main characters.
    Last edited by Magnagarde; 2019-05-29 at 09:56 PM.

  14. #234
    It's hard for me to say if BfA is better or worse without seeing the ending, but I went ahead and voted "yea" just because this storyline is far too close to ground that we already tread in MoP.

    Both of them are bad enough (so far) that I personally don't think that it matters to figure out which one is technically worse. It'd be like making fun of your friend for getting an F when you got a D-.

  15. #235
    Titan Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaHomieG View Post
    The only "good" Warchief is an orc warchief. Been that way since the First War. I personally don't acknowledge Vol'jin and Sylvanas.

    And obviously the writing wasn't good but the theme was cool as shit. You can't tell me the Iron Horde wasn't fucking badass come on my guy. All the orcish clans uniting under one banner and using modern technology to create badass metal monstrosities? Shit was cash
    Yeah, I was talking about Garrosh.

    The backbone of my complaints with WoD have already been highlighted by Dickmann. To add on to what's already been said, the narrative felt absolutely awful as a Horde player. You point out that you felt the Iron Horde was badass. Sure, okay, fine. It's a lot less bad ass when you have to go kill them, your iconic heroes of yesteryear, while the Alliance gets to relive their finest RTS moments. Especially since we had just come off from an expansion dedicated to ruining the Horde.

    I'm not sure killing the people "The Horde should be" for Vol'jin's Horde is satisfying at all, considering our shared perspective on the matter.

    Beyond that, there's the fact that time travel is just bad. It's always tacky and Blizzard certainly doesn't have the writing skill to make it anything but. Even if we move past the widespread dislike for time travel as a concept, WoD was put in an unfavorable position due to the inherent nature of "Alternate Universe Time Travelling." Many players (rightfully) criticized WoD as a filler expansion, it certainly felt that way. It didn't have much impact on the story as a whole and did little to drive the narrative forward or seed future plots. That's just what happens when you have something self-contained like AU Time Traveling.

    For WoD to have any lasting impact on the story, it required a ridiculous retcon. "One Legion, Many Universes" was the ridiculous retcon we got in order to make things work. That created far more problems than it solved, it cheapened the Legion, and was just another bad addition to an expansion with already-flimsy lore.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaHomieG View Post
    Honestly if Blizzard didn't rush the expansion to get their demon-boner throbbing for Legion, WoD would've been one of the best expansion we've ever gotten. The ogre continent, Faralon, etc would've been so good
    Not really. I mean putting aside the horrendous gameplay philosophies, Farahlon & the Ogre continent would've suffered from the same problems outlined above. The cut content was annoying, it did feel disjointed, the fact that the plot had a section cut out, and was sewn back together haphazardly is blatantly obvious, sure. I'm not sure fixing those mistakes (Which were never the reasons WoD was bad in the first place) would have bumped WoD up to any notable degree. Maybe some people would feel like it edged out Cataclysm if that were the case, maybe, but beating World of Memecraft isn't exactly a spectacular feat. WoD certainly wouldn't have been the best expansion in terms of story even with those minor issues fixed.

  16. #236
    "The Iron Horde was badass."

    Right up until we sailed off to SMV/Frostfire, then they became the standard Warcraft passive, bumbling fools that wait for you to come use the Do Not Press button they left out with neon lights and a welcome mat. Any sense of threat went out the window when we were able to build garrisons that remained totally uncontested by this army that supposedly controlled the whole world.


    Other brief thoughts on WoD, which had decent raids and dungeons, but whose story wasn't even as good as the patch 3.2 intern project.

    I freely admit to not quite seeing the Horde fan's perspective here (duh), as to me, the Warlords are AU versions of mass murdering psychopaths who barely needed demonic encouragement. That said, I understand that to them, it was murdering off the characters they enjoyed, while twisting their stories. Can't blame them for not liking it.

    Alliance side wasn't exactly great either, with building up Maraad just to sacrifice him for that screechy voiced idiot who was just the bestest paladin evar somehow. ("Vhot is HOPPENINK to dis whirl-uh-duh?!") People bitch about Jaina, but for personality flips, she's got nothing on Yrel. "Noooooo! It is hopeless!" 3,2,1 "I wheel fight!" 3,2,1 "Nooooooo! Vhot can ve doooooo?" We kept propping that bitch up only to be rewarded with a pat on the head as her faithful pets during her exarch ceremony.

    Blizz never was, is not, and never will be good enough to handle time travel well, especially with their famous tendency to ignore anything inconvenient. The only saving grace is the AU characters weren't all sporting goatees. Exhibit A in "Blizz can't write time travel" is how it massacred the Legion and particularly Archimonde and Gul'dan. Archie takes the heroes to the one place he can be killed (until Blizz trots him out for another humiliation) and Gul'dan is a bad parody of the original.


    Is BFA worse? No, but it's not too much better. More "brilliant" plot points that demonstrated Blizz's fantastic ability to paint themselves into corners ("Where the fuck are all these Alliance resources?"), build up hype and never deliver ("SAVAGE!" "Nelves will get revenge!"), and piss off their playerbase with flat out lies ("Who burns the tree?").
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    I'll buy an Anduin shirt if Delaryn doesn't end up betraying Sylvanas by the end of the expansion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex86el View Post
    "Orc want, orc take." and "Orc dissagrees, orc kill you to win argument."

  17. #237
    Data Monster Simca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darknessvamp View Post
    WoD was a waste of a time travel expansion and antagonists topped with a rushed and uninteresting story whilst BfA is a poor man's rewrite of MoP that makes even less sense than the last time they tried to do it with a frankly inconsistent and baffling rebellion this time around and dumb things happening all over the place. WoD is still frankly worse but BfA is one stupid ending off from tying with it in terms of quality.
    I agree with your assessment completely.
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