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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Giving him a taste of his own medicine, or making it a teachable moment would have done more net good, than fining him, and at the same time making a lot of people riled up... some because they hate Islam and want to see the man executed (I am being facetious) and others because they are now conflicted over who was the one that was being oppressed the most. The woman, or the Muslim that is just following his convictions to the extreme. Still others in society will see it as a punishment for being Muslim... just like how some places now have the Burqa ban...

    *shrug*... I just see this getting more and more out of control.
    You can refuse to look people in the eye because you think they're more or because you think they're less than you, regardless of gender, faith or ethnicity. You're free to adopt old thinking but shouldn't expect others to understand/read your mind or for everyone to be okay with it, much less so on broadcast tv. It is something we seek to avoid because it always leads to the insanity taking root if not. Belgians like much of the rest of Europe understand this well and it's why this decision is made - to maintain a good and healthy atmosphere in the face of malice/ignorance and people giving up their own personal control/judgement to follow the commandments of a mufti/pope.
    If you knew the candle was fire then the meal was cooked a long time ago.

  2. #102
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    It is discrimination, but... it doesn't make sense to apply it in this way. Like if a person refuses to look at me because I'm gay I don't think they should be jailed over it.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    No it's not... it's illegal to discriminate against someone because they are X.
    Which is exactly what he did.

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Mic_128 View Post
    Which is exactly what he did.
    nice to ignore the second part. We should jail everyone.

  5. #105
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiwack View Post
    You can refuse to look people in the eye because you think they're more or because you think they're less than you, regardless of gender, faith or ethnicity. You're free to adopt old thinking but shouldn't expect others to understand/read your mind or for everyone to be okay with it, much less so on broadcast tv. It is something we seek to avoid because it always leads to the insanity taking root if not. Belgians like much of the rest of Europe understand this well and it's why this decision is made - to maintain a good and healthy atmosphere in the face of malice/ignorance and people giving up their own personal control/judgement to follow the commandments of a mufti/pope.
    If this is true then do not push for multiculturalism, because you only confuse people... what this sounds like to me is pluralism.

    If you say all cultures are welcome, and can live out their culture/religion freely, but then at the same breath say "these things are not ok"... well that is going against the first concept...

    The man was following his culture to its natural extreme, to him that is being "true" to his religion. He will feel wronged if you suppress that.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    If this is true then do not push for multiculturalism, because you only confuse people... what this sounds like to me is pluralism.

    If you say all cultures are welcome, and can live out their culture/religion freely, but then at the same breath say "these things are not ok"... well that is going against the first concept...

    The man was following his culture to its natural extreme, to him that is being "true" to his religion. He will feel wronged if you suppress that.
    Yeah, this sends a confusing message. Hey Connal, do you know more about this story, btw? Maybe you can help answer my questions above lol
    Quote Originally Posted by Sulla View Post
    Senator Moore will be sitting in that seat and I hope it burns you to your core.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Trump did it so it's good. I put my faith in a strong political figure because I lack self-esteem and feel threatened by a changing world. Whoever stands against him is bad because I do not understand their arguments and I have a simple tribalistic mindset created through the consumption of right-wing media.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    nice to ignore the second part.
    Oh, okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii
    Even then, personal discrimination is fine.
    Except that's not what he did. He didn't say "It's because she's Emmanuelle Praet." He said "It's because she's a woman." It wasn't personal, it was based on her sex.

  8. #108
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaderas View Post
    Yeah, this sends a confusing message. Hey Connal, do you know more about this story, btw? Maybe you can help answer my questions above lol
    Nope, I do not know more than what was stated in the OP.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Mic_128 View Post
    Oh, okay.



    Except that's not what he did. He didn't say "It's because she's Emmanuelle Praet." He said "It's because she's a woman." It wasn't personal, it was based on her sex.
    Personal as in him as a person deciding not to interact with X because of Y reason. He is allowed to do that, same goes with you. As I said, lets jail everyone, because everyone have discriminated someone based on various reasons, inlcuding sex.

    He is not allowed to deny service to her or similar, he can choose not to interact.

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    Personal as in him as a person deciding not to interact with X because of Y reason. He is allowed to do that, same goes with you. As I said, lets jail everyone, because everyone have discriminated someone based on various reasons, inlcuding sex.
    I do it every day with the romani outside stores. Begging for money and I ignore them.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Girighet View Post
    I do it every day with the romani outside stores. Begging for money and I ignore them.
    Everyone discriminates... worst thing about this argument of theirs is that majority of the world populace would be jailed because most of us have a sexual preference when it comes to dating and relationship... that's the most purest form of sexual discrimination. Fairly sure they will twist that "it's not the same" bs tho.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by CryotriX View Post
    It's not even that in this case. It's not like he thinks she's an "icky yucky woman". It's him respecting a rather innocent religious custom, that is not based on "women are lesser", but on "be modest, and don't lust over women (or men) that are not yours".
    The custom may come from modesty and don't lust but... I don't usually buy that's the reason for the practice. I believe, they're using it as a way to not listen to what the woman is saying. I'd need to know about this guys policy and that of the party but I can't find much.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    He is not allowed to deny service to her or similar, he can choose not to interact.
    Except that his service was explicitly to talk with her on the show. He refused to do his job because she was a woman.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Midnight Bomber View Post
    It's weird when the right wing posters here are defending muslims...

    Here's my hot take on the situation...why would he even agree to go on the show if he was going to refuse to engage with the host of the show in any meaningful way? Seems to me he went there to make a pretty public statement about how he feels about women.
    Its a free speech issue regardless of the identity. Liberals should be defending him regardless of personal morals.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by CryotriX View Post
    It's not even that in this case. It's not like he thinks she's an "icky yucky woman". It's him respecting a rather innocent religious custom, that is not based on "women are lesser", but on "be modest, and don't lust over women (or men) that are not yours".
    Except the fact that the political party he represents wants to strip women of the right to vote, introduce separated seating in public transportation and deny women the right to run for any office. That's nothing to do with 'being modest' and everything to do with 'women are lesser.'

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    If this is true then do not push for multiculturalism, because you only confuse people... what this sounds like to me is pluralism.

    If you say all cultures are welcome, and can live out their culture/religion freely, but then at the same breath say "these things are not ok"... well that is going against the first concept...

    The man was following his culture to its natural extreme, to him that is being "true" to his religion. He will feel wronged if you suppress that.
    It's more along the lines of everybody being welcome because these simple guidelines keep the peace and everybody talking nicely. Because the world doesn't revolve around individuals but the groups and communities they make up together. We say it's not your own decision-making if you seek to isolate yourself because it's suppressing your own nature according to misguided ideals adopted through others or disinformation - and for what and to what end? There's no salvation in pain but you're free to practice it as long as you're not hurting others. Of course we'd ask you to not and seek to find out why hopefully before we find you dead due to your own idiotic actions.
    Last edited by Tiwack; 2019-05-09 at 05:11 PM.
    If you knew the candle was fire then the meal was cooked a long time ago.

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Skulltaker View Post
    You should probably add that:

    - The woman in question was the talk show host of a program he was invited to.
    - He also refused to shake her hand, talk to her or acknowledge her existance in any other way. When asked why, he said it's 'because she's a woman.' That's the discrimination he was sentenced for.

    As a funny added tidbit, his party, ISLAM, demands, among other things, to strip women of the right to vote, introduce seperated seating in public transportation, deny women the right to run for any office and outlaw any non-Halal food in school cafeterias.
    I was just looking this up.

    It's funny how these stupid sensationalist headlines always fall apart the moment you read any further than the bullshit spread across the internet.
    But hey, 99% of the people who hear about this shit probably won't look past the surface and start screaming about the "liberals".

  18. #118
    The guy and the party he represents are scum that hopefully will never achieve enough seats to cause any damage.

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Mic_128 View Post
    Except that his service was explicitly to talk with her on the show. He refused to do his job because she was a woman.
    what? That's not his service at all... Anyone is allowed to answer or not answer to questions in interviews.
    Last edited by Kumorii; 2019-05-09 at 05:17 PM.

  20. #120
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiwack View Post
    It's more along the lines of everybody being welcome because these simple guidelines keep the peace and everybody talking nicely. Because the world doesn't revolve around individuals but the groups and communities they make up together. We say it's not your own decision-making if you seek to isolate yourself because it's suppressing your own nature according to misguided ideals adopted through others or disinformation - and for what and to what end? There's no salvation in pain but you're free to practice it as long as you're not hurting others. Of course we'd ask you to not and seek to find out why hopefully before we find you dead due to your own idiotic actions.
    Yeah, then this is not multiculturalism... this is pluralism.

    Multiculturalism sees all cultures as equal. Pluralism sees one culture as the "guide", and all other cultures within it as being equal among themselves, but subservient to the overarching mores of the nation/culture.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

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