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  1. #621
    Quote Originally Posted by ViolenceJackRespectsWomen View Post
    Another one what the fuck is up the lack of rape/incest excemptions... Holy shit that just seems so fucking degenerative to me. Another state to just yikes the fuck out of.
    There are at least two reasons:
    1. If you actually think abortion is murder, then making exemptions for rape and incest make no sense. You can't murder a baby just because their father raped their mother.
    2. As far as I'm aware, there is nothing genuine about these laws in the slightest, and they're only passing them for the sole purpose of getting to the Supreme Court. So they have to be as inflammatory as possible to get as strong a legal reaction as they can.

  2. #622
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    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    There are at least two reasons:
    1. If you actually think abortion is murder, then making exemptions for rape and incest make no sense. You can't murder a baby just because their father raped their mother.
    2. As far as I'm aware, there is nothing genuine about these laws in the slightest, and they're only passing them for the sole purpose of getting to the Supreme Court. So they have to be as inflammatory as possible to get as strong a legal reaction as they can.
    Which is why Alabama, Missouri, and Georgia probably coordinated all their respective Abortion bills to go into effect at around the same time. Kinda compound the scumbaggery and force the Courts to confront them on this and try and get Roe repealed while they've got a Right-leaning Supreme Court majority and before the Democrats can retake the White house and senate.

    It's a desperate, super shitty way to force the misguided beliefs of a select few onto a majority that either doesn't want them, or who didn't care strongly enough before now opposing them because this round of bullshit's going too far. And for some dumbfuck reason, they think that the law's going to be entirely in their court on this.

  3. #623
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    And those people are almost all religious extremists. Pro-life stances are pseudo-religious if not overtly so, to begin with, and denying abortion rights is an extremist stance, full stop. There is literally no other country in the developed world that bans abortions. Not one. So yes; wanting to ban abortions makes you an extremist
    I have to correct you on this Endus because there is one country in the developed world that bans abortion but it reinforces your point rather than goes against it. That country is Northern Ireland and the ban is purely because of religion.

  4. #624
    Quote Originally Posted by Candiman View Post
    I have to correct you on this Endus because there is one country in the developed world that bans abortion but it reinforces your point rather than goes against it. That country is Northern Ireland and the ban is purely because of religion.
    Actually, they legalized it last year about this time. https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-abortion-bans
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...alise-abortion

  5. #625
    That's the wrong Ireland. That's the South which repealed their law. Abortion is still illegal in Northern Ireland.

    If you’re in the UK and you’re furious, there is something you can do. Call your MP. Tell them to decriminalise abortion in Northern Ireland


    From the first article you posted.
    Last edited by Candiman; 2019-05-18 at 09:13 AM.

  6. #626
    Quote Originally Posted by Xyonai View Post
    And for some dumbfuck reason, they think that the law's going to be entirely in their court on this.
    That would be the same reason they oppose abortion in the first place: They think it's what God wants.

  7. #627
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    Sometimes i wonder why would young women even want to live in those states, just make your life in another woman friendly state and let those religious white male republicans live with each other.

  8. #628
    Quote Originally Posted by ViolenceJackRespectsWomen View Post
    Another one what the fuck is up the lack of rape/incest excemptions... Holy shit that just seems so fucking degenerative to me. Another state to just yikes the fuck out of.
    To be fair a lot of the south is the product of incest /badumdum.

  9. #629
    Quote Originally Posted by Xyonai View Post
    It's a desperate, super shitty way to force the misguided beliefs of a select few onto a majority that either doesn't want them, or who didn't care strongly enough before now opposing them because this round of bullshit's going too far. And for some dumbfuck reason, they think that the law's going to be entirely in their court on this.
    It's almost like Trump said exactly that on the campaign trail.

    In his final debate with Hillary Clinton during the 2016 presidential campaign, Donald Trump was asked whether he wanted to see Roe v. Wade overturned. “Well, if we put another two or perhaps three justices on, that’s really what’s going to be — that will happen,” he said. “And that’ll happen automatically, in my opinion, because I am putting pro-life justices on the court.”
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...erturning-roe/
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  10. #630
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    It's almost like Trump said exactly that on the campaign trail.


    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...erturning-roe/
    Yeah, nice job to all the bernie bros out there.

    https://twitter.com/pelosiforsf/stat...645888?lang=en

    Good shit.

  11. #631
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    One of their favourite little misdirections, that I'll point out pre-emptively, is this late-term abortion stuff, particularly with regards to Canada. Canada has no laws regarding abortion. Literally, none, other than the same medical-ethics stuff that covers the entire medical field. By law, a doctor can pursue an abortion whenever he and the patient want it.

    This is where the misdirection occurs, because the lack of any law does not mean there's a lack of ethical medical practice. Doctors won't abort a healthy late-term baby in the vast majority of circumstances; they'll induce a birth or extract the fetus through caesarean. That's the safest practice, at that point, in the vast majority of cases, for both mother and fetus. A late-term abortion only occurs when it's medically warranted, and those circumstances are rare.

    But they like to pretend that because we don't have a law banning it, relying on doctors to have better understanding of medical ethics and practice than politicians (crazy notion, right?), that Canada must therefore be aborting all kinds of late-term pregnancies willy-nilly because WOO ABORTIONS R COOOOL!

    It's obviously bullshit. Because they don't care about the facts. They care about pushing a completely horseshit perspective of the world based upon lies and fearmongering, to scare otherwise decent people into accidentally supporting a regressive limitation on women's basic human rights, for an at least implicitly religious motivation (though often, overtly as hell).
    It's almost like a doctor and the mother are better placed to make that decision than some rich asshole in Washington who panders to religious nuts but secretly pressured his mistress to get an abortion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  12. #632
    Quote Originally Posted by Dacien View Post
    That we're very divided. This would seem to be the natural result of Democracy. And for all my conservatism, sometimes I do honestly think that we, as conservatives, go a bit too far in one direction. A good a direction, but too far. And we have the Democratic Party to help reign us in. And sometimes the Democratic party goes way too far in what they believe in. A direction that is beneficial, but too far, and conservatives are there to hold the breach. To keep things from going too far. Not all issues are like this, but many of them are.

    But in this issue it seems we just have two extremes vying for dominance.
    Pro-choice are in the overwhelming majority in democratic and secular countries.
    Last edited by Gilrak; 2019-05-18 at 12:22 PM.

  13. #633
    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    There are at least two reasons:
    1. If you actually think abortion is murder, then making exemptions for rape and incest make no sense. You can't murder a baby just because their father raped their mother.
    2. As far as I'm aware, there is nothing genuine about these laws in the slightest, and they're only passing them for the sole purpose of getting to the Supreme Court. So they have to be as inflammatory as possible to get as strong a legal reaction as they can.
    call a spade a spade and state the third reason

    they dont believe women can be raped

  14. #634
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinro View Post
    Prove that I don't.
    the above was preceded by:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jinro View Post
    It's pretty sexist to assume abortion being available is in a womans interest. I think abortions should be banned.
    pick one , and stop shit-posting

  15. #635
    Quote Originally Posted by Dacien View Post
    That we're very divided.
    No, we are not divided. This isn’t something you can blame on division. I even asked you a logistics question of how police would capture these aborting women, but you refused to answer it.

    This would seem to be the natural result of Democracy. And for all my conservatism, sometimes I do honestly think that we, as conservatives, go a bit too far in one direction. A good a direction, but too far. And we have the Democratic Party to help reign us in. And sometimes the Democratic party goes way too far in what they believe in. A direction that is beneficial, but too far, and conservatives are there to hold the breach. To keep things from going too far. Not all issues are like this, but many of them are.
    Other times, people use division to skirt their unpopular opinion.

    But in this issue it seems we just have two extremes vying for dominance.
    Bullshit... I already asked a basic question to show which side is extreme and you are refusing to answer it. How do police go about finding these women? Would you call police on a woman that suddenly wasn’t pregnant? Once your argument gets grounded, it’s very clear that only one opinion is extreme... not some side.

    You know what else is part of ‘right wing’? MRA... men’s rights... How can the same ideology be complaining that they have no say in a woman choosing to abort, to now support the government replacing the woman in taking the man’s choice away?

    Only one side of this argument is extreme, which is blatantly obvious when grandiose statements about politicians, are grounded in logistics of how this side would enforce their law. If you don’t think investigation of women who have a miscarriage is extreme, than you might be way more than just extreme.

    I’d also like to point out out, you are not saying what is actually extreme. It should be obvious why you can’t say what’s extreme, but shift into generalities of political parties.

    Edit: Look at the bright side, ladies. Since MRA keeps complaining about women entrapping man with getting pregnant. You can now blame the government! You no longer have to find excuses to not agree with the man’s opinion to abort. You can now blame the government! Thank you government for making it easier to entrap men!

    I am wondering where all the MRA dudes went... this thread is so on point for them. The government is taking away a right, MRA bitched they wanted to share with women. It’s a lot more difficult to convince government, than your gf.
    Last edited by Felya; 2019-05-18 at 01:17 PM.
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  16. #636
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    Overpopulation is a real issue facing future generations, yet we want to keep shoveling babies out in the world damn to the mother if she wants it or not (or is even capable of caring for the baby).
    Oh and as an added bonus we refuse to do anything except destroy the world so that when these babies we forced to be born are adults they can enjoy a dying planet.

    Go republicans!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jinro View Post
    It's pretty sexist to assume abortion being available is in a womans interest. I think abortions should be banned.
    How on God's green Earth is that sexist? You've said some dumbass shit in the past, but this might just take the cake.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elba View Post
    Klling a new born is not much morally different than a late term abortion. Should be avoided, but it's not like it is an actual person yet.

  17. #637
    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    How on God's green Earth is that sexist? You've said some dumbass shit in the past, but this might just take the cake.
    It’s the closest we got to MRA opinion on this issue, which is very disappointing. Here we have an issue women and MRA can agree on, since men didn’t have a say in abortion and now neither do women. Approaching this issue from a perspective of a man, who demanded the right to influence the abortion of his brood, is very interesting. It’s far more interesting, to consider their silence on this issue.
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell

  18. #638
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    No, I fucking did not.
    It's framed in different language in different nations. Bodily integrity, or the various sub-partitions of the right, like right to life, liberty, security of person, right to no cruel and unusual punishment, banning of slavery, etc.
    I assume you are referring to culture here? Can you provide one single legal definition of body autonomy? Because even a cursory google search provides almost nothing except a wiki article with no source for the definition and a bunch of opinion pieces.

    If bodily autonomy is such a universal right and so clear-cut, shouldn't that be framed some place in objective language? Otherwise, why should I believe your definition of bodily autonomy referring only to the physical body? And even under your definition, why are we pushing for mandatory vaccinations? Doesn't that violate this basic human right?

  19. #639
    Quote Originally Posted by Dacien View Post
    I get the feeling that anything less than complete, abortion-on-demand, any time even after birth if the abortion fails is extreme restriction. That's definitely the feeling I get. And I get the feeling that, from many conservatives, any abortion at any time ever is extreme.

    Good luck with that, guys.
    I'll be honest, I haven't been able to take you seriously since you ran away from the forum when the Mueller Report looked like it was getting worse and worse for Trump and co. at the time and only came back when it was over, but this BS about "abortion after birth" is a new level of joke for you.

    There is a special word for "abortion after birth" and I can guarantee nobody in this thread is advocating for that.
    Often updated... ?

  20. #640
    Quote Originally Posted by Vankrys View Post
    Sometimes i wonder why would young women even want to live in those states, just make your life in another woman friendly state and let those religious white male republicans live with each other.
    Because moving is expensive, time-consuming and most likely not an option for a great deal of the population. Leaving behind friends, family and lives because the lawmakers in the state seem hell-bent on criminalizing you may sound like an easy decision to make, but I can totally understand why it's not feasible for the majority.

    Also, it's much better for them to stay, gather, coordinate and vote those fuckers out come the next election. Moving from those States only ensures that they'll stay backwards and unchecked. Teach them a lesson and turn them blue. The GOP are a dying minority and they are grabbing with both hands onto as much power as they can to stay on top. These new bills/laws are a part of that. Trump flooding the SCOTUS and lower courts with GOP shills is part of that. Again, they WANT these laws to be challenged in court so that the now GOP-leaning SCOTUS will have to rule on it. They want Roe v. Wade overturned and it's NOT because they are "Pro-Life". They are Pro-Control.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by UnifiedDivide View Post
    I'll be honest, I haven't been able to take you seriously since you ran away from the forum when the Mueller Report
    I'm surprised you even took him seriously then. I've had him and most of the rest of the bad-faith posters on ignore since it first became obvious they a) have no idea what they're talking about and b) just consistently try to derail threads with warped definitions or flat-out lies.

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