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  1. #21
    I think it's because both factions have been asking for them for quite a while (pretty much since their introduction in WotLK). Pair that with Blizzard seemingly being hesitant to do another neutral race and you have your reason for probably not getting Vrykul any time soon.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Honestly, this is a pretty damning indictment of Kul Tirans.

    I'm not sure there was really a demand for Big (Fat) Humans, in the same way there was a desire for Vrykul.
    I'm not sure if there's really that much of a demand for Goblins in a fox fursuit, yet that's seemingly all but confirmed at this point. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ophion1990 View Post
    I'm not sure if there's really that much of a demand for Goblins in a fox fursuit, yet that's seemingly all but confirmed at this point. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
    Don't remind me.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurhetemec View Post
    Okay, so a guy with one post wants to make his second post a needless and inaccurate personal attack? Wow, off a to a good start buddy, I'm sure you'll be with us a long time. (Also dude named after a viking loves viking themed race but his "name has nothing to do with it" - sure, dude, and someone calling themselves Legolas demanding High Elves clearly has no particular bias in the matter...).

    I'm aware of all the Vrykul lore. I've been playing WoW since the original beta, and in WotLK, the Vrykul were pretty cool, especially as there was a lot of genuinely weird stuff going on with them. In Legion, they became much more generically fake-viking, for my money, with the Titans standing in for Odin and Hel from Norse mythology and so on. That stronger alignment with Norse mythology actually made them weaker, conceptually. Especially as WoW is not, in general, a game that borrows that directly from mythology (it's more of a magpie about about mythology stealing a bit from ancient Greece here, a bit from Warhammer there, a bit from Star Wars here and so on - whereas the Vrykul stuff has been lazier - just a series of viking mythology tropes overlaid on the WoW setting, for the most part).

    But let's hear what you think:

    What actual "fresh ideas", specifically, would the Vrykul bring to WoW?
    Personal attack? You based your argument on my name. "OH LOOK HE'S GOT A VIKING NAME!!! HE'S ARGUMENT IS INVALID!!". Nothing personal against you mate, you're the one who's started giving pointless arguments.

    I think they could expand the lore, let us know new things about them, dealing with the Odyn/Helya storyline or even providing with new lore about human's origins. We've seen only a small piece of what all the norse mythology could bring to the lore. So much more lore than HM tauren, Vulpera or DI dwarves could bring. But this is my point of view, you can disagree, and that's fine, the problem is when you start your contribution with a message full of poor arguments and trying to say that I'm just a viking fan. Try to be more respectful from the beginning and you'll not have any passive aggressive messages in return.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeifErikson View Post
    Personal attack? You based your argument on my name. "OH LOOK HE'S GOT A VIKING NAME!!! HE'S ARGUMENT IS INVALID!!". Nothing personal against you mate, you're the one who's started giving pointless arguments.
    No, I based my argument on the fact that they've become relatively dull faux-vikings - I felt you might be overlooking this because you enjoyed "viking stuff". Calling me ignorant etc. is most assuredly a personal attack, just FYI!

    Quote Originally Posted by LeifErikson View Post
    I think they could expand the lore, let us know new things about them, dealing with the Odyn/Helya storyline or even providing with new lore about human's origins. We've seen only a small piece of what all the norse mythology could bring to the lore. So much more lore than HM tauren, Vulpera or DI dwarves could bring. But this is my point of view, you can disagree, and that's fine, the problem is when you start your contribution with a message full of poor arguments and trying to say that I'm just a viking fan. Try to be more respectful from the beginning and you'll not have any passive aggressive messages in return.
    I'm not seeing how this is "fresh". Re-hashing Norse mythology, except in a dumbed-down way and crossed over with the worst aspects of Titan lore (which is precisely what happened in Legion with the Vrykul) seems like it's the opposite of "fresh". There's nothing new or exciting, particular for people who actually know their Norse lore and Legion was basically wall-to-wall Titan lore and there's still Titan lore in BfA. I don't think WoW does well when it copies big chunks of real-world mythology. It does well when it steals little bits from all over.

    Re: human origins, what is there to add, specifically? Didn't WotLK more or less fully cover that? I'm not trying to be difficult here. Maybe I'm not remembering everything. What is that you'd want to see them add re: human origins that necessitates making the Vrykul a playable race?

    Re: passive aggressive etc. - you do realize that by insulting a bunch of races people like, you're actually hurting the chances of a meaningful discussion? An awful lot of people like the Dark Iron Dwarves and have wanted to play them since early Vanilla. I mean, my wife's first Dwarf character, which was like two months into the game, if that, she made look as Dark Iron as possible. In 2004 bro. So you saying "Oh they don't bring enough lore!!!" is just really silly-seeming. Races aren't usually added because they "add lore". They're added because they're fan favourites and people want to play them. HM Tauren are recent but popular and you can see that if you play on Horde. Vulpera, I'm not a huge fan of, but clearly they offer something new and have their um... audience (not all of them furries!).

    Vrykul have a problem there, because whilst they have a fanbase, it's a smaller one, and I'm sorry to say, but unless you have an actually fresh take on the Vrykul, beyond the "Viking culture and titan themes" stuff, the fact that Kul Tirans ate their lunch by being "big humans" means they're going to be sitting out for at least an expansion or two.
    Last edited by Eurhetemec; 2019-05-10 at 02:17 PM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurhetemec View Post
    No, I based my argument on the fact that they've become relatively dull faux-vikings - I felt you might be overlooking this because you enjoyed "viking stuff". Calling me ignorant etc. is most assuredly a personal attack, just FYI!



    I'm not seeing how this is "fresh". Re-hashing Norse mythology, except in a dumbed-down way and crossed over with the worst aspects of Titan lore (which is precisely what happened in Legion with the Vrykul) seems like it's the opposite of "fresh". There's nothing new or exciting, particular for people who actually know their Norse lore and Legion was basically wall-to-wall Titan lore and there's still Titan lore in BfA. I don't think WoW does well when it copies big chunks of real-world mythology. It does well when it steals little bits from all over.

    Re: human origins, what is there to add, specifically? Didn't WotLK more or less fully cover that? I'm not trying to be difficult here. Maybe I'm not remembering everything. What is that you'd want to see them add re: human origins that necessitates making the Vrykul a playable race?

    Re: passive aggressive etc. - you do realize that by insulting a bunch of races people like, you're actually hurting the chances of a meaningful discussion? An awful lot of people like the Dark Iron Dwarves and have wanted to play them since early Vanilla. I mean, my wife's first Dwarf character, which was like two months into the game, if that, she made look as Dark Iron as possible. In 2004 bro. So you saying "Oh they don't bring enough lore!!!" is just really silly-seeming. Races aren't usually added because they "add lore". They're added because they're fan favourites and people want to play them. HM Tauren are recent but popular and you can see that if you play on Horde. Vulpera, I'm not a huge fan of, but clearly they offer something new and have their um... audience (not all of them furries!).

    Vrykul have a problem there, because whilst they have a fanbase, it's a smaller one, and I'm sorry to say, but unless you have an actually fresh take on the Vrykul, beyond the "Viking culture and titan themes" stuff, the fact that Kul Tirans ate their lunch by being "big humans" means they're going to be sitting out for at least an expansion or two.
    Ignorant is not an insult. You were an ignorant in your first message because you summarized vrykuls as, your words not mine, "A bunch of dull giant fake-vikings". That's a really poor argument, so next time, as I said, be more respectful when you reply to someone you don't know at all because you don't have any confidence with me. You can say your opinion without talking about my name and stuff, otherwise you're gonna get back a passive aggressive reply again.

    In my opinion, Vrykuls could add more things to lore than DI dwarves or HM tauren do. You disagree, that's fine. We've got different points of view and we're not gonna convince each other. Thanks for sharing your opinion with us, but honestly I don't think you can contribute with anything else, so now let us continue our debate

  6. #26
    Give me WC3:R, Blizz! The Stormbringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    The reason is that they are too tall to fit thru doorways, so the options are:

    1. Shrink them down which probably takes away the fun.
    2. Allow them to clip through the top of doorways which looks ugly and would probably get mocked by players or rival gaming companies and it might also result in hacking issues.
    3. Make them only playable via toys or transforms and simply have them get blocked from entering some doorways.
    4. Never have them as a playable race at all.

    Ogres suffer the exact same problem. Can't fit thru doorways.
    There's plenty of smaller Ogres. Just play one that's the size of a Tauren or Kul Tiran, problem solved.

  7. #27
    Because Blizzard thought that Kul'Tirans would be the better new humans... boy were they wrong.

    Meanwhile I'm still waiting for playable gores.

  8. #28
    Back when they were relevant Blizzard didn't want to add another race. Now that they could add them they are simply not relevant.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by McNeil View Post
    Because Blizzard thought that Kul'Tirans would be the better new humans... boy were they wrong.

    Meanwhile I'm still waiting for playable gores.
    Oh man, don't remind me. If I had the option to play a vrykul or a normal human, I'd pick a vrykul probably, but compared to fat humans.. this isn't even a competion. They even make great casters imho (because they have proper beards..)
    Last edited by Haidaes; 2019-05-10 at 05:04 PM.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    The reason is that they are too tall to fit thru doorways, so the options are:

    1. Shrink them down which probably takes away the fun.
    2. Allow them to clip through the top of doorways which looks ugly and would probably get mocked by players or rival gaming companies and it might also result in hacking issues.
    3. Make them only playable via toys or transforms and simply have them get blocked from entering some doorways.
    4. Never have them as a playable race at all.

    Ogres suffer the exact same problem. Can't fit thru doorways.
    Yea, so you can just shrink them abit.. I mean zandas are pretty damn tall and dont fit through doorways mounted.
    The smaller vrykuls on the brokenshore are the perfect example that this could work, so Id say shrinking them is a non issue.
    Being super large isnt realy fun anyway.. you feel slow and clumsy.

    Vrykull are perfectly viable to make them playable and besides that I also wondered this myself like they should have been made playable with the first batch of allied races imo.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Eurhetemec View Post
    A bunch of dull giant fake-vikings would bring "fresh ideas" to the storyline? You have to be kidding - but I see from your name you might be a bit biased on the issue, especially given this is literally the first thing you posted about. Ironically you might have had a better argument back in WotLK, before the Vrykul got hopelessly tied to being fake-vikings, when they had a viking-ish culture but it hadn't been developed very far.

    Anyway, Kokolums is correct. They're too tall to be playable, currently, so player ones would need to be significantly shorter (perhaps only reaching "full" size when using a racial cooldown). Also, if you make a Vrykul shorter, whaddya got? A human. Indeed as you know this is kind of where humans come from in WoW. At least a shorter Ogre would actually match up with some Ogres in the game (they vary in size considerably) and still be clearly not another race.

    Further, Kul Tirans mean that even shorter Vrykul are not a real option, because then we'd essentially just have three sizes of human - Humans, Tall Fat Humans, Tall Muscle-y Humans, and at that point we might as well go back to arguing about body shape and size sliders...
    Maybe they are dull to you.. but their whole kit has been fleshed out completely and is somuch better then the allied races we got so far. Most of what you say is an opinion so this is mine.

    Complaing about being different bodysizes is also a non argiment because allied races are already same of the same with differnt hairstyles.
    Already talked about the size being a non issue.

    So the conclusion is what you dont like vrykuls.. while alot of people do and feel left out.. who do like them.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by sara24 View Post
    I have such reason like Shrink them down which probably takes away the fun. again and again
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  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    So the conclusion is what you dont like vrykuls.. while alot of people do and feel left out.. who do like them.
    Which goes back to my point that people just want them because they like viking stuff. Their "fleshed out kit" is just cheap replicas of Norse mythology or viking iconography. It's not as nuanced or interesting as say, that of the Night Elves, who combine ancient Greek/Roman visual styling with more modern Druidic/Celtic themes (rather than actual ancient Celtic ones). Add that to them being just "big humans" like the Kul Tirans, and I'm not seeing any compelling reasons to add them.

    Back in WotLK the Vrykul were going a different way - it looked like they were going to combine viking and sci-fi visuals and theme-ing (remember the sleep chambers and stuff?). But Legion completely abandoned that in favour of more and more viking stuff, albeit some of it by the way of Jack Kirby's take on Thor/Asgard.
    Last edited by Eurhetemec; 2019-05-10 at 04:52 PM.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Maybe they are dull to you.. but their whole kit has been fleshed out completely and is somuch better then the allied races we got so far.
    Maybe not as fleshed out as the Shal'dorei, but definitely more than the High Mountain or void elves.

    The Tideskorn arc in Legion alone, from Skovald through Stormheim and finally with God Queen Sigryn, provides ton of lore. Everything related to Odyn and the Halls of Valor is compelling.

    Chronicle Vol 1 is chock full of vrykul lore and my ideal race/class combo would be a Vrykul Paladin of Tyr. Two of the three Paladin Artifacts were Vrykul!



    So much potential ignored.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeifErikson View Post
    I still cannot understand the reason why Blizzard hasn't made them playable yet. They're one of the most interesting races in Azeroth, their culture is awesome and they could bring fresh ideas to the storyline. Why Blizzard? You made high mountain taurens playable, a race nobody really gives a f***. Would you like to see them as a playable race? It'd be awesome to know your points of view guys.
    What is there to not understand? Blizzard, up to right now, had not wanted them to be playable. That may change in the future.

    I've never really been all that keen on Vrykul, so, personally, I wouldn't play one. That said, I will hope that one day, just for you, they are playable.


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  14. #34
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    Same reason they won't make vulperas or nagas.
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    This isn't true, at all.

    You can use the Kovork Costume toy, paired with an Elixir of Giant Growth to match the size of regular Ogres from WoD (Which makes you considerably larger than both Tauren, and a fair amount of the Ogre NPCs on Azeroth).

    Even at that size, which is likely larger than playable Ogres would need to be, considering you're larger than a few Ogre mobs, you can still fit through doorways (Even the obnoxiously small ones in Orgrimmar) both on foot and mounted.

    To run into pathing issues, you have to be riding an obnoxiously large mount, which puts Ogres in the same boat as Tauren. To actually run into clipping issues, you'd have to be wearing a tall helm (ie, Lei Shen's helm) on a hypothetical playable Ogre.

    The "Ogres are too big" argument is dumb and doesn't hold up to scrutiny.
    I was brushing up on ogres on wowpedia earlier today, and I found something that may be a difficulty against playable ogres. In ogre culture in order to show off their strength and intimidate their enemies ogres deliberately wear as little clothing as possible in order to show off their physiques. Which is why the most armored ogres we've seen have nothing more than shoulder pads and a chest strap or two. Might be difficult to justify that with playable character and armor models.

    Then again they did it with demon hunters in lore eschewing (sp?) wearing anything above their waists.

  16. #36
    What is there to not understand? Blizzard, up to right now, had not wanted them to be playable. That may change in the future.

    I've never really been all that keen on Vrykul, so, personally, I wouldn't play one. That said, I will hope that one day, just for you, they are playable.
    I do appreciate your post. There should be more people like you here.

  17. #37
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    Some races are better represented without being playable, have a bigger impact when we get to see them or go up against them and just altogether have more story opportunities not being playable in the current MMO landscape of WoW

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by cparle87 View Post
    I was brushing up on ogres on wowpedia earlier today, and I found something that may be a difficulty against playable ogres. In ogre culture in order to show off their strength and intimidate their enemies ogres deliberately wear as little clothing as possible in order to show off their physiques. Which is why the most armored ogres we've seen have nothing more than shoulder pads and a chest strap or two. Might be difficult to justify that with playable character and armor models.

    Then again they did it with demon hunters in lore eschewing (sp?) wearing anything above their waists.
    8.2 fixes this in that you can hide ANY bit of your armour except your pants. So if you want to play a very lore-correct Ogre, just go ahead and hide most of it. If you want to be an Ogre in full plate because he's a rebel or you don't care about lore, just don't mog that way.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathasil View Post
    Not all Vrykul are the same hight. We met some that were only slightly bigger than Tauren. There was absolutely no reason not to make a smaller tribe of Vrykul playable.

    Except for one: There actually were Alliance players who wanted them. So this was a no-go...and we had to settle for Fat Humans instead. It is the same reasoning with High Elves vs Void Elves.

    But at least it's fair for both factions. When the Horde wanted Zandalari they instead got....oh, wait.
    tbh Horde wanted Ogres since vanilla

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    Same reason they won't make vulperas or nagas.
    Sorry to disapoint you, but it is highly likely that Vulpera are coming soon.

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