View Poll Results: What percentage tip am I giving based on the details in the post?

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  • 3.32/16.58 = 20%

    33 22.76%
  • 3.32/(16.58+1.65) = 18%

    7 4.83%
  • 3.32/21.68 = 15%

    23 15.86%
  • Other (posted in thread)

    82 56.55%
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  1. #301
    The Lightbringer gutnbrg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FuxieDK View Post
    That's pretty much what the delivery costs... Why would I pay it twice?
    bc delivery drivers get paid a shit wage bc their employer assumes that they will get tipped by the customer...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by AlphaOut View Post
    I tip certain pizza delivery drivers, and it's only like $3. I'm only 2 miles away from the store. I almost never tip bartenders. I find it odd. Thanks for pouring my beer, here's additional money for it because it was such a grueling task. Waiters and waitresses will get a tip if the service is absolutely incredible, and they're pleasant to talk to while they're at the table. So its rare. We dont usually tip the cooks or the dude washing dishes, so why tip the last leg of work put into my order? To br fair, I'm extremely low maintenance as a customer. To the point if my order is messed up I dont usually say anything. Because it's usually still pretty tasty either way.

    Heres the deal, I'm not a dick. But where do you draw the line? How many people here tip their FedEx or UPS person? Probably minimal? Is it because UPS drivers make around $40/hr? Thatd be a silly reason not to tip. We dont know each individual employees financial status or personal life in any line of work, regardless if it's a "tipping job" or not. So I guess I'm just not biased. Either tip everything, nothing, or only the exceptional. But dont tip because "it's the thing to do." And certainly dont tip if they add gratuity on your check.
    lol u never tip bartenders but u tip pizza delivery? You understand most bartenders make less per hour then pizza delivery guys...bartenders literally live off tips.

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by TEHPALLYTANK View Post
    Tipping doesn't do shit for employee wages, as evidenced by the examples presented in this thread. Someone should do something about tipping, but sure as hell isn't the customers. The owners are the ones who are being cheap assholes by relying on emotional manipulation to pry more money out from their customers, instead of doing the straightforward thing and banning tips while raising prices.

    The great lie here is that the customers are the ones being called assholes by the owners, while the owners are the ones being cheap assholes.
    im sorry that you feel youve been emotionally manipulated into being a decent human being. but let me be even more clear for you here: the REAL lie is you thinking that not tipping your server is somehow sticking it to the man when the only person youre actually fucking over is the person trying to give you a nice lunch. some food for thought no pun intended.
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  3. #303
    This is why I don't ever have food delivered: I can't figure out the tip. My food is usually on the cheap side, but the drive is the same regardless. I don't want to under-tip, but I don't want to end up doubling my cost.

    Know that I live too far away to have food delivered to my house. Me considering delivery means I'm out of town and therefore have even less idea what the route's like for the driver.

  4. #304
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Any other words of wisdom Gramps before you go out to the porch to yell at the kids from your rocking chair?
    I mean he's absolutely correct. A lot of states basically allow service industry employers to pay under minimum wage as long as the tips bring them up to it. So basically what happens if you don't tip is that they only get exactly minimum wage because their actual wage is like 3/hr maybe 5(although I'm not sure about delivery people). Their tips are basically their "raise" for doing a good job and often the basis of their livelihood.

  5. #305
    Quote Originally Posted by gutnbrg View Post
    bc delivery drivers get paid a shit wage bc their employer assumes that they will get tipped by the customer...

    - - - Updated - - -



    lol u never tip bartenders but u tip pizza delivery? You understand most bartenders make less per hour then pizza delivery guys...bartenders literally live off tips.
    Bartenders dont travel around in their own vehicle making drinks at my doorstep either. So no. Pizza delivery tips are my way of contributing to the wear and tear of their ride. While most pizza shops pay cents per mile driven, it comes nowhere close to the actual expense. And if their car does break down, their shit out of luck with their job. So yeah. Minor contribition. And I dont even do that all the time. If you're living off of tips and are self aware of that, then you're knowingly allowing yourself to be reliant by the grace of others. Doesnt sound like a smart financial way of making a living. So yes, I understand completely. Tipping is glorified handouts.There are plenty of shit wages in this world, guess you better tip them all, right?

  6. #306
    Immortal matheney2k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    I don't determine what is fair or how things should or shouldn't work and neither do you, but if you shit on or disrespect people working for a living and trying to get by, I have no sympathy for anyone not extending the same in return.
    But my point is that the 'disrespect' is not nearly as equal on both sides. If I yell at you because you messed up or took too long, that is not equivalent of somebody spitting in my food in return. That's like saying I shove you so you stick a shiv in my neck.

    By your language you are in fact condoning it because ''thats the way it is''. I wonder if any people work at fast food joints here reading your posts feeling empowered by your words since ''thats just the way it is''. Maybe somebody will get some spit in their food that would not have before thanks you to :P

    Spitting in somebody's food is not okay and never should be condoned by any means.
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  7. #307
    Scarab Lord bungeebungee's Avatar
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    Let's have some honesty here. Don't take it from me, consider this: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...united-states/

    Here's the set up for the article:

    Three years ago, Jay Porter, a former restaurant owner who abolished tipping at his restaurant, made a powerful case against the practice, an industry standard in the United States. Everything at his establishment, he wrote in a 2013 Op-Ed for Slate, improved after he enforced a mandatory 18 percent service charge—the food, the service, the pay, the customer satisfaction. Reflecting on what tipping has done to the restaurant industry as a whole, he penned what I believe is one of the most succinct and yet irrefutable paragraphs about why tipping is wrong:

    Studies have shown that tipping is not an effective incentive for performance in servers. It also creates an environment in which people of color, young people, old people, women, and foreigners tend to get worse service than white males. In a tip-based system, nonwhite servers make less than their white peers for equal work. Consider also the power imbalance between tippers, who are typically male, and servers, 70 percent of whom are female, and consider that the restaurant industry generates five times the average number of sexual harassment claims per worker. And that in many instances employers have allegedly misused tip credits, which let owners pay servers less than minimum wage if tipping makes up the difference.

    The problems are vast, as Porter points out. They tend to afflict a very specific and unfortunate swath of the American populace: the poor and disadvantaged. And the evidence isn't merely anecdotal.

    Few people are better versed in the ways in which tipping marginalizes those who depend on it than Saru Jayaraman, who is the co-founder and co-director of the Restaurant Opportunities Center United (ROC United) and director of the Food Labor Research Center at the University of California, Berkeley. Jayaraman has been working to end the modern tipping system for years, collecting the sort of data the National Restaurant Association (NRA), which has long defended the practice, hardly appreciates.

    But tipping, Jayaraman says, isn't merely problematic in its current, contemporary context. The practice is abhorrent from a historical perspective, too.

    While researching her new book 'Forked: A New Standard for American Dining," Jayaraman dug into the history of tipping, which complicates—or really darkens—the way in which we pay restaurant workers even further. Among the many things she uncovered is that the federal tipped-minimum wage, which allows restaurants to pay tipped workers as little as $2.13 per hour in the United States, is rooted in a regrettable period in this country's past: slavery.

    I spoke with Jayaraman to learn more about the racist origins of tipping, the lingering racism and sexism the system has allowed to persist, and all the other reasons why she believes we should be ashamed about the way we pay restaurant workers in the United States. The interview has been edited for length and clarity.
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  8. #308
    Legendary! TEHPALLYTANK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Natureseer View Post
    im sorry that you feel youve been emotionally manipulated into being a decent human being. but let me be even more clear for you here: the REAL lie is you thinking that not tipping your server is somehow sticking it to the man when the only person youre actually fucking over is the person trying to give you a nice lunch. some food for thought no pun intended.
    No, it really isn't. Also you seem to be under the mistaken impression that I go to restaurants and don't tip. The fact of the matter is that I don't go to restaurants or order food from restaurants to begin with. You're the one who is delusional if you think your tips are actually helping the employee, because as it has been pointed out multiple times, employers can literally take tips away from their employees.

    Maybe you should actually consider the facts of the issue of tipping, instead of pretending that it is some moral obligation.
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  9. #309
    Quote Originally Posted by bungeebungee View Post
    Let's have some honesty here. Don't take it from me, consider this: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...united-states/

    Here's the set up for the article:
    How can tipping not be an incentive for good service, and then also somehow cause specifically white males to get better service? It does, or it doesnt.

    Not that I am defending tipping, but you know what? Its weird because people in the industry tend to prefer it that way, because they end up making more money. Not only that, but the whole "making less than minimum wage" thing is just false.

    Overall, this article is pretty dishonest in many cases, though their point is a good one, that tipping culture is pretty stupid.
    Last edited by Lemonpartyfan; 2019-05-12 at 02:22 AM.

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    According to you it's not only okay to spit in a customer's food, but it should be expected if you ''disrespect'' the staff. That's not how any of this should work.
    Funny how it always happens in threads like these and people who post it don't realize that's it's basically blackmail. "Pay me extra or something might happen to your food. Also, for some insane reason, you're the asshole here, not me."

    Maybe other professions should try that. "Oh hey, I'm almost done with that big IT project, but I need a bit extra cash... There's so many viruses around nowadays, we wouldn't want anything to happen to the server". "The operation is almost done... but I don't remember if I didn't leave something inside the patient. I'd need a tip to refresh my memory."

    What, that'd be wrong? Illegal? No shit, so why is it somehow considered a good "argument" in this particular area?

  11. #311
    Pandaren Monk Strikeywikey's Avatar
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    We don't tip in the UK because we pay our waiters and delivery drivers, unlike some countries that give them peanuts and expect the public to pay their wage.

  12. #312
    Scarab Lord bungeebungee's Avatar
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    @Lemonpartyfan Well, you know, you could have actually read the article first. Your questions are addressed in detail, and no it isn't a "does or doesn't" situation.

    There’s this myth, especially if you live in a place like New York or Washington D.C., that what tipped workers make is largely even, that everyone makes what white guys working at fancy steakhouses make.

    But even in places like New York and D.C., seventy percent of tipped workers are actually women, largely working at casual restaurants, like Applebees, IHOP , and Olive Garden, earning a median wage of $9 an hour when you include tips. These people suffer three times the poverty rate of the rest of the U.S. workforce, use food stamps at double the rate, and, the worst part, suffer from the absolute worst sexual harassment of any industry in the United States. When you’re a woman living on tips—even if you’re making a lot of money on tips, which most women aren’t—you’re subject to the whims of the customer, and really encouraged by management to objectify yourself or subject yourself to objectification to make money in tips.

    ...

    For our most recent report, which came out in 2014, we asked hundreds of restaurant workers to answer this question: ‘Have you experienced sexual behavior in the restaurant industry that is scary or unwanted?’ And 90 percent of workers, both male and female, said yes.

    More broadly, the data show that the restaurant industry has the highest rate of sexual harassment of any industry in the United States. It’s actually five times the rate of all other industries. Seven percent of American women work in restaurants, but thirty percent of sexual harassment complaints from women come from the restaurant industry. It's the single largest source of sexual harassment complaints of any industry in the United States.

    Our research shows that all of that sexual harassment—from customers, coworkers, and management—can be traced back to this whole culture of forcing women to make their income based on pleasing the customer. To me it’s all summed up by this one quote from Texas, where they earn $2.13 an hour before tips. This waitress was speaking at a Senate press conference, and she said: ‘Senators, what would it be like for you if your income depended on the happiness of the people you serve? Because my income depends on the people I serve, I have to put up with a guy groping by butt every day so I can feed my four year old son every day.’
    So, people from groups seen as less likely to tip well get less attention, while those seen as more likely to tip will get pampered. That is not improved service across the customer base. Another segment of the article also addresses the negative effect on employers, that staff will do things like throwing in a free drink for good tips.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemonpartyfan
    Not only that, but the whole "making less than minimum wage" thing is just false.
    Going to need to see some facts on that, because the article addressed that one as well and you're just making an unsupported assertion.

    I mean, when we’ve directly confronted them on this issue we’ve hit a wall, too. In the Connecticut state legislature, we bought up this issue of sexual harassment, and a leader of the Connecticut restaurant association, a restaurant owner, basically said ‘well, if women are experiencing sexual harassment they should find another place to work.’ That’s been their response. They have had no legitimate response.

    Their response to the poverty issue is that no, it’s not true. They say these workers make a ton of money, that they underreport their tips, which is why you don’t see it in the government data. The data of course disproves that. But with sexual harassment it’s worse, since they don’t even pretend to have an explanation.

    So, despite all of this, not everyone has a problem with tipping—like the National Restaurant Association, which vehemently defends it. What’s their argument for it?

    Their favorite thing to say is that no one actually earns $2.13 an hour, and that employers are obligated to make up the difference. They love to paint this picture of the wealthy white guy working in fancy restaurants as though it’s emblematic of restaurant work around the country. I’ve been at conferences and senate hearings, where they’ll say ‘our workers make $18 an hour with tips,’ and they can because, honestly, for about a century they haven’t really been pushed to provide actual evidence of this.

    Actually, why don’t I give you an example. I had somebody from the Senate budget office call me recently to tell me that the NRA was recently in their office claiming that tipped workers across America make $18 an hour. We said that’s great, now give us some evidence. So they followed up with a letter, and on their letterhead it said ‘our workers make $18 an hour with tips.’ The letterhead was the evidence! That’s been the sort of nonsense we’ve been dealing with for a hundred years. Here we are providing government data—and this is not even worker reported data; it’s employer reported data, payroll data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics—that shows these workers are making a median wage of $9 an hour with tips, and all the evidence they have to the contrary is a baseless line on their letterhead.
    On the issue of making up income if tips fall short -- look into the article (I really don't want to have to copy pasta the whole thing) and you will find:
    Well, the law has always said from the very beginning that the employer has to make up the difference between the lower tipped-minimum wage and the regular tipped minimum wage, but the U.S. Department of Labor reports an 84 percent violation rate in regards to employers actually ensuring that they make up that difference.
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  13. #313
    Quote Originally Posted by gutnbrg View Post
    bc delivery drivers get paid a shit wage bc their employer assumes that they will get tipped by the customer...
    I already paid for delivery.

  14. #314
    Scarab Lord bungeebungee's Avatar
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    @Lemonpartyfan Edit noted, now please back yourself up with some sources.
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  15. #315
    I never tip, because expecting your customers to pay for your employees' upkeep is perhaps the most idiotic practice in the history of capitalism, sirs.
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  16. #316
    Immortal matheney2k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevenho View Post
    I already paid for delivery.
    Also this. Maybe 15 years ago they would have a case for tipping delivery drivers, but ever since they started that ''delivery fee'' bullshit I quit tipping so much tbh.
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  17. #317
    For delivery, I tip based on order total, rounding to the nearest $5 mark within reason. $34.96 isn't going to be a $0.04 tip only.

  18. #318
    In Australia we don't tip as delivery places tend to have a delivery fee. That, and we also pay a decent minimum wage so there is no tipping culture required for delivery and waiting staff to earn a living.
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  19. #319
    Banned Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    But my point is that the 'disrespect' is not nearly as equal on both sides. If I yell at you because you messed up or took too long, that is not equivalent of somebody spitting in my food in return. That's like saying I shove you so you stick a shiv in my neck.

    By your language you are in fact condoning it because ''thats the way it is''. I wonder if any people work at fast food joints here reading your posts feeling empowered by your words since ''thats just the way it is''. Maybe somebody will get some spit in their food that would not have before thanks you to :P

    Spitting in somebody's food is not okay and never should be condoned by any means.
    No you have no point besides having a pompous arrogant attitude like everybody else ok with not tipping and being an asshole, but pumping the breaks when they realize what goes around comes around.

    I don't spit in food, nor have I suggested anyone else should. How I feel about it isn't up to you


    I mean me personally I am a cheap ass myself, lots of things ill skimp on, fucking over someone doing their job that rely s on tips isn't one of them, because they aren't just some shrub that I look at the as though they don't exist.

    Is the tipping game a racket, yes sure, but I am not going to take it out one some person surviving knowing they need the tip. I don't make them fucking tap dance, they don't need to kiss my ass like I am royalty, and they don't need to put on some fake fucking smile and tell me a lot of nonsense.

    Just do their job, be decent, relax, if they do I tip, if they go the extra mile, I'll tip extra. The only time I won't tip is if someone is rude to me, that I won't put up with.


    As for you and what you or anyone else can do, just do what you want to, tip don't tip, I don't give a shit, I'm also not going to feel you don't deserve the disrespect you show towards them.


    Life is full of risks, and treating people like shit because you can, is just as fucking scummy as spiting in your food in my opinion.

    Me personally, I like when I order a Pizza the dude that delivers makes sure my pizza isn't all fucked up, and that it's hot. I like going to restaurants, and getting a little extra or being given good reserved seating.


    If you don't want to pay a tip don't but personally I think you know better, you know you are fucking someone over, so nobody should be expected to go out of their way for you either.

  20. #320
    Quote Originally Posted by justandulas View Post
    This. The only way this changes is if someone can ram it through Congress. Even if it’s brought up it still needs the vote and they’d never get the votes needed until lobbyists are outlawed due to them just greasing the pockets of the campaigns. The food industry has a powerful lobby and would fight it tooth and nail.

    It would nearly take an executive order outlawing lobbyist first before anything could change.
    Screwed up thing is that it isn't even the GOP that is causing the issue despite the obvious feeling that they are the culprits. It's greed on both sides, need a bipartisan effort to stop lobby money before ANYTHING can change.
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