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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Schattenlied View Post
    This... Far more than anything else I just want the class designs to actually be interesting again, the classes are how we interface with and experience the entire game, if they are boring, everything is boring and has little to no replay value...

    As lacking in content as WoD was I still enjoyed it more than Legion and BFA simply because I actually enjoyed playing many classes, especially my main. I haven't found enjoyment in any of the classes since the Legion revamps, and what has been my main for over 12 years now doesn't even feel like it's the same class anymore, in fantasy or gameplay.
    Class design wasn't exactly great in WoD, destro locks, arcane mages, BM and MM hunters were all super easy to play and far too strong for their simplicity. Tanks especially at the end could do almost everything completely on their own monks, pallies and DK for example were all insanely strong and self reliant. On the healing side you had disc priest who could mindlessly spam attacks and still be a very solid healer in most cases, druids with their pre stacking of their mushroom had an on demand aoe lay on hands. There was a lot to be desired with WoD's design nevermind they did almost nothing in the game as far as game play went so the classes should have been very polished.
    "Privilege is invisible to those who have it."

  2. #42

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    "Make raids harder to get into so that only a small part of the population of the game ever gets to see it." Imagine being this fucking elitist lol. Classic will not save the game. Most people who never played it will play it for a month then give up. The Vanilla fans will play for maybe two months then realize "Wait I can do this for free." then leave for private servers. Classic servers will be ghost towns after a few months.
    Thats not being elitits. You put effort you get reward. It cant get any simplier. It is you entilted casuals not actual mmorpg casual those players accept they cant get hands on everthing no no i am talking about those lazy excusers what feel they are entilted to everyhing in the gamw just becouse they paid sub. And worst part is. That those people hate other players sucess. They hate it to the point they demand same treatment as high end players while putting 0 effort into game. Becouse if they cant have it. Nobady can.

    Ans btw nost did survay on age of their players what played vannila. Average age was 17-20. So majority of players have never played vannilla befor but somehow they enyoj playing it now. Or you gonna tell me they played vannila when they were 5y old toddlers?
    Last edited by Elias01; 2019-05-14 at 03:32 AM.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    Thats not being elitits. You put effort you get reward. It cant get any simplier. It is you entilted casuals not actual mmorpg casual those players accept they cant get hands on everthing no no i am talking about those lazy excusers what feel they are entilted to everyhing in the gamw just becouse they paid sub. And worst part is. That those people hate other players sucess. They hate it to the point they demand same treatment as high end players while putting 0 effort into game. Becouse if they cant have it. Nobady can.

    Ans btw nost did survay on age of their players what played vannila. Average age was 17-20. So majority of players have never played vannilla befor but somehow they enyoj playing it now. Or you gonna tell me they played vannila when they were 5y old toddlers?
    Your typo laden response is just one long elitist rant. You're literally saying that people who can't devote endless hours to the game shouldn't get access to raids. That's incredibly elitist. So raids should only be accessable by the minority of the player base?

  5. #45
    Elemental Lord clevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarthMonk79 View Post
    The community destroyed the community, it wasn't blizzard. Them giving us LFD/LFG/LFR didn't force anyone to quit talking to people that they grouped with. Players CHOSE to do this.

    True, but people will usually take the easiest path and the moment you could randomly queue for 5 mans people did (and the 3.3 daily heroic quest incentivized running them all the time) they did.... but why talk to people you'll never see again?

    Everybody is saying "bring back Vanilla"... it never left. It changed but with the change the community decided to abuse or disconnect just because it was a option. Its like jumping off a cliff... A smart person would see the cliff and say "screw that, i'm staying over here", the WoW community is like "oh damn, a cliff, I better jump off of it" and then complain to the cliff that it "forced" them to do so.

    The difference is that these aren't the same people who played vanilla and TBC. Sure, some of us are... but more people joined during Wrath, Cata and later.

  6. #46
    Presumes that WoW even needs "saving" in the first place. BfA is not very good, but that has nothing to do with not being like Vanilla and everything to do with poor gameplay decisions.

    Plus, Classic is going to be a niche game for nostalgic people. It's not going to be some massive success that makes all the game devs in the world realize that they've been making wrong choices and "my gosh, if we just make our games like Classic WoW they're SURE to succeed". Vanilla was only great by comparison to what was otherwise available at that time.
    Shut your goddamn mouth, Gene!

  7. #47
    Legendary! FuxieDK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aizen244 View Post
    Classic is a 15 years old game, it's completely outdated both graphic, lore and game wise. They basically ask for the people to do a bunch of whores within areas that are considered a joke now. I wonder how many will grind the ogres in burning steppes from 52 to 54(I think?) until they can get quests from western/eastern plaguelands.

    Why not focus at improving every aspect of current wow instead of going back to classic?

    Cmon blizzard, you are supposed to be a big company, this shouldn't be rocket science for you

    1. Bring back the communities and wall off the servers
    2. Improve your art (weapons, raids and sets suck!!)
    3. Throw something big into the lore and the game (an emberscar sword legendary would be great!)
    4. Make the raids less accessible and harder to see the lore
    5. Throw mogs into a trashbin so that the people would be forced to farm the new gear in order to look cool

    It takes courage and decisiveness but wow can be saved, it doesn't have to go back into vanilla in order to do so.
    Classic will NOT save the game. It will not be nearly as popular as some people seem to think.
    It will not attract any amount of players that will make a difference, and people will fall off quite fast.

    Within a year, it will go below 100.000 players, where 90% of them play retail as their primary Warcraft game.
    Fact (because I say so): TBC > Cata > Legion > MoP > BfA > WoD = WotLK

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  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Aizen244 View Post
    Classic is a 15 years old game, it's completely outdated both graphic, lore and game wise. They basically ask for the people to do a bunch of whores within areas that are considered a joke now. I wonder how many will grind the ogres in burning steppes from 52 to 54(I think?) until they can get quests from western/eastern plaguelands.

    Why not focus at improving every aspect of current wow instead of going back to classic?

    Cmon blizzard, you are supposed to be a big company, this shouldn't be rocket science for you

    1. Bring back the communities and wall off the servers
    2. Improve your art (weapons, raids and sets suck!!)
    3. Throw something big into the lore and the game (an emberscar sword legendary would be great!)
    4. Make the raids less accessible and harder to see the lore
    5. Throw mogs into a trashbin so that the people would be forced to farm the new gear in order to look cool

    It takes courage and decisiveness but wow can be saved, it doesn't have to go back into vanilla in order to do so.
    Why not do both?

    Although, on the topic of classic. "naxx will be so tough only 5% will ever even clear it" private server HOLD MY BEER "world record speed run of naxx - classic" lolol.
    Last edited by arkanon; 2019-05-14 at 04:39 AM.

  9. #49
    Titan Aggrophobic's Avatar
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    "Save"? It's a very old version of the game that might bring back a few people in the short run but most will never be able to handle the amount of time it takes to do just about anything in that version of the game. It won't have much impact on subs after a few months.

    There is a reason why Blizzard was against this idea and it's still true: You think you do but you dont.
    In the end, the bad press kinda forced them but I doubt even they think that it'll keep people subscribed for long.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceboytg View Post
    Presumes that WoW even needs "saving" in the first place. BfA is not very good, but that has nothing to do with not being like Vanilla and everything to do with poor gameplay decisions.

    Plus, Classic is going to be a niche game for nostalgic people. It's not going to be some massive success that makes all the game devs in the world realize that they've been making wrong choices and "my gosh, if we just make our games like Classic WoW they're SURE to succeed". Vanilla was only great by comparison to what was otherwise available at that time.
    Yeah and this.

  10. #50
    it definitely won't save retail wow, the only thing that can do that are the devs of retail, they need to make a lot of changes and revert the game in too many ways to name to make it work again.

    what it will do is succeed and thrive, and show blizzard what people really want out of an MMO, when people are more willing to play a 15 year old game over a much newer version of it they will get a pretty clear message about what they need to do. wf/tf needs to go away, there needs to be smaller raid size for competitive raiders who don't want to raid with 20 people, snapshotting needs to come back so rotations are constantly changing based on your current power. and then the obvious one, classes need to go back to being unique and interesting to play. stop homogenizing every class and let things be different and maybe even OP, make the game fun first, then worry about the balance and don't ruin the fun for the balance. classic isn't balanced at all, but wait and watch what it does, balance matters, but not nearly as much as they think it does.

    i can't wait for classic so i can stop playing retail, i'll come back to retail if it ever looks decent to play again but my guess is i will just play classic and wait for tbc to come along.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Aizen244 View Post
    Why not focus at improving every aspect of current wow instead of going back to classic?
    They are improving every aspect of current WoW and they're not going back to classic.
    They are opening a realm where you can play classic. The retail WoW will exist on the current servers and it will keep getting expacs/improvements just like it has always done.

    They recruited a separate team to work with the classic servers, so there's no loss of focus due to it.

    And no. I don't think it will "save the game". I find the idea silly.

  12. #52
    No it wont save Wow, and it will probably start out strong and crash hard.

  13. #53
    I feel like it's worth reminding people: WoW will probably still be making bank even if it drops down to 800,000 players, and they can probably maintain at or around that by doing virtually nothing.

    There's people that will sub no matter what the quality is. I bet there's probably at least 20,000 players who only sub because they forgot to unsub. (Those people are why free trials auto renew on things!)


    On topic: I don't think anyone outside of a minority of really curious people, a few people with deep rooted nostalgia, and an ultra hardcore minority are going to care about Classic long term. It'll probably have insanely high numbers when it pops up, then a colossal drop off. I suspect it'll probably have a pool of about maybe ~100,000 after the rush, as it's stable base, that'll dwindle down every few months until it's nothing but the really, really, really hardcores.
    Last edited by Otimus; 2019-05-14 at 05:16 AM.

  14. #54
    since they are completely 2 seperate games how would classic save bfa?

  15. #55
    Lets assume you are right and wow is in such dire straits that it needs saving, no I do not think Classic will do much of anything beyond giving a fix to the people that crave classic.

  16. #56
    To infinity and beyond det's Avatar
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    No, because "save" is such a buzzword ....it is even more vague than whatever "success" means to any given poster here, based on their own definition which isn't even necessarily Blizzard's definition.

    Also just by listing random points does not mean you know how to implement them and if you could if they have the effect you desire.

    That said, why don't we wait until Classic is out?

  17. #57
    Mechagnome Drpizka's Avatar
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    Ofc not, the game is dead already.

    We wanted classic so we are able to play again the game we loved, without having to rely on private servers. Modern gaming has changed, retail WoW cannot be saved.

  18. #58
    I can speak for only two games that have done that.

    First one is Runescape. The playerbase of Old-School Runescape is much bigger than the new runescape.

    Second is Lineage2, where they released Lineage2 Classic, which start at the first version of it. Lineage2 now has only 4 servers in total, 2 for new and 2 for classic. The classic ones as are on "High" population, while the new ones are on Medium.

  19. #59
    It will save A PART of the game but not the game. It had quite a journey. Should end it with dignity (not like those tv shows where they drag it until its a mess).

  20. #60
    The Undying Gehco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aizen244 View Post
    Classic is a 15 years old game, it's completely outdated both graphic, lore and game wise. They basically ask for the people to do a bunch of whores within areas that are considered a joke now. I wonder how many will grind the ogres in burning steppes from 52 to 54(I think?) until they can get quests from western/eastern plaguelands.

    Why not focus at improving every aspect of current wow instead of going back to classic?

    Cmon blizzard, you are supposed to be a big company, this shouldn't be rocket science for you

    1. Bring back the communities and wall off the servers
    2. Improve your art (weapons, raids and sets suck!!)
    3. Throw something big into the lore and the game (an emberscar sword legendary would be great!)
    4. Make the raids less accessible and harder to see the lore
    5. Throw mogs into a trashbin so that the people would be forced to farm the new gear in order to look cool

    It takes courage and decisiveness but wow can be saved, it doesn't have to go back into vanilla in order to do so.
    No, I do not believe it'll save the game. It is just a museum but the numbers might feed a better production of the actual game.
    Stuff can be fixed, just get enough glue or duct tape!
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