Pingaan's guide to raiding

[Rusken]

There's almost no spell hit gear available before ZG.

Is that justification for ignoring what is available though? There are (from what I can see) 6 slots that can get +hit on them before DM hits. Head, Neck, Belt, Weapon, Boots, and Ring. With the guide only using Neck and Belt (and not even the best +hit neck, Diana's Pearl Necklace)

Now I'm not an expert when it comes to calculating what would put out better DPS but my assumption would be that extra 4% hit over what the proposed BiS list suggests would out-perform the ~30SP lost.

[XtraT]

Can you link those items? Also, Diana's Pearl Necklace (along many other items) isn't added until the AQ patch.

[Ralahast]

Isn't itemization off bosses staying at 1.12? Won't we see this necklace then at launch? I could be wrong, I thought the only things not dropping early on were like Shaman totems and that sort of thing, but everything else was going to be dropping just as if it were 1.12 back in vanilla.

[pingowtf]

Updated caster weapons pp1-pp2.

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Joining the discussion... @Rusken Hit is far more important than any other stat until you hit 16%, yes. But it's like the guys says here; the hit items that are on the sheet pre-ZG are the only ones that are available in the game at that stage. No caster can reach hit cap until ZG is out.

[Gperks]

Question: Why does Pre Raid phase 2 BIS not include any gear from phase one? I may have missed the answer to this and I am sorry if I did.

[tikcol]

Is that justification for ignoring what is available though? There are (from what I can see) 6 slots that can get +hit on them before DM hits. Head, Neck, Belt, Weapon, Boots, and Ring. With the guide only using Neck and Belt (and not even the best +hit neck, Diana's Pearl Necklace)

Now I'm not an expert when it comes to calculating what would put out better DPS but my assumption would be that extra 4% hit over what the proposed BiS list suggests would out-perform the ~30SP lost.

Diana's Pearl Necklace isn't supposed to drop for a long time. Don't know about the rest of the items you're thinking of but I wouldn't be surprised if they also didn't drop for a while.

https://wowwiki.fandom.com/wiki/Dian...Pearl_Necklace

[XtraT]

Isn't itemization off bosses staying at 1.12? Won't we see this necklace then at launch? I could be wrong, I thought the only things not dropping early on were like Shaman totems and that sort of thing, but everything else was going to be dropping just as if it were 1.12 back in vanilla.

Items will be using their 1.12 values (i.e. of Flame Sword was 5 DPS in 1.08 but 10 DPS in 1.12, Flame Sword will always be 10 DPS).

But some items, like Diana's Pearl Necklace, were added, not buffed. 1.10 added many items, including raid items in ZG and MC, that are extremely good; too good to be dropped in the first phases actually. Like, there's 1.10 ZG plate gloves on par with C'thun gloves.

[Gperks]

Question: Why does Pre Raid phase 2 BIS not include any gear from phase one? I may have missed the answer to this and I am sorry if I did.

Can someone answer this please?

[pingowtf]

Can someone answer this please?

I'm not sure what you are talking about...

[Gperks]

In your phase 1 pre raid BIS you do not have any raid gear. Which makes sense b/c your prepping for the first step in raiding. However you have a phase 2 pre raid BIS should that not include Raid gear from phase 1???

[pingowtf]

Oh, you mean why there are no raid drops from phase one in pre-raid BiS phase 2?
Well... If there were raid items in pre-raid BiS phase 2 then it would be pre-raid, would it? It's for the ones still prepping for raids, because phase 2 is basically the same, as phase 1 when it comes to BiS items (raid drops included).

[Gperks]

Oh, you mean why there are no raid drops from phase one in pre-raid BiS phase 2?
Well... If there were raid items in pre-raid BiS phase 2 then it would be pre-raid, would it? It's for the ones still prepping for raids, because phase 2 is basically the same, as phase 1 when it comes to BiS items (raid drops included).

I do not believe we are on the same page.
First The list and doc is amazingly compiled. So please do not think I am knocking it. I am trying to make sure I follow the "guide" because it is great!

That being said.
Since the raids are being released in phases.
I would think that the lists would look something like this

Pre Raid phase 1: inludes: world drops/dungeon items/crafted items.
Pre Raid phase 2: includes the above: plus items from raid phase 1.

Now the only thing that maybe I can understand is that you should not have a pre raid phase 2 and just have gear post phase 1: since those items will be put in under raid phase 1.

Do you see what I mean? Its almost as if pre raid phase 2 is not needed based on the logic I extracted from your comment above.

[AeneasBK]

Do you see what I mean? Its almost as if pre raid phase 2 is not needed based on the logic I extracted from your comment above.

And his point is for a toon fresh hitting 60 during phase 2, and wanting to get ready for raids, it doesn't make sense to add any raid items from phase 1.

You are asking why there is no "raid gear" in a pre-raid list, that's a question that answers itself.

you have a phase 2 pre raid BIS should that not include Raid gear

[Gperks]

Yeah i just had a doh moment and see that its dire maul only. For some reason I thought there was another raid in phase 2. Which is why I was so confused. That was my bad.

Thanks guys for helping me out. Now I have it straitened out!

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I did want to point out that the left tabs ie onyxia of the raid encounter and strat do not link to a website or any encounter strat. They just open up the same full doc in a new window.

But again great guide and thank you.

[vixien]

Hit chance against lvl 3+ mobs (i.e raid bosses) ignore the first 1% of hit chance. So hit cap for raids will be 9%, and 8% for all other content.

[XtraT]

Hit chance against lvl 3+ mobs (i.e raid bosses) ignore the first 1% of hit chance. So hit cap for raids will be 9%, and 8% for all other content.

That's only for melee and if you don't have an extra 5 weapon skill.

[Nitros14]

That's only for melee and if you don't have an extra 5 weapon skill.

Is it still 16% for casters? Didn't that go to 15% at some point in WoW's history?

[pingowtf]

It is still 16% for casters, ye.

[Rusken]

Updated caster weapons pp1-pp2.

Joining the discussion... @Rusken Hit is far more important than any other stat until you hit 16%, yes. But it's like the guys says here; the hit items that are on the sheet pre-ZG are the only ones that are available in the game at that stage. No caster can reach hit cap until ZG is out.

That's fair enough then, I didn't raid much in Vanilla and what I did was after all the content was released so I was unaware of that fact. Very good to know for my mage coming into Classic.

[pingowtf]

Update: Removed 1h enchants from phys dps classes pre-BWL. 15 agi/str are not implemented until BWL hits. Also from peer pressure I changed the feral druid enchants from striking to agility/str and with this removed the weight/sharpening stones.