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  1. #81
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    I see you, Theo, and the normal conservatives keep saying this as if it means something. She won the cities and lost the urban areas. Ok? So what? You gonna post a map showing all of the vast swaths of the US that are "red counties" that have all of 150 people in them as if it means something? Are plots of land what's important, or is it American citizens?

    This argument is shallow and pathetic, and needs to stop being used. Hillary won more people over. The fact that Trump won more rural areas is irrelevant to the point at hand. This argument is only ever trying to appeal to some emotional BS, which I guess is trying to say that lefties care more about cities? In reality I hold everyone equal, 1 person = 1 vote. If you think rural areas should be more important than cities because you value land over people, just come out and say it already.
    It does not matter what I think. The fact is she lost in our system. Deal with that.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  2. #82
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    One, there are differing opinions on this, two, I was not against it per se, only that I said it is not a panacea, and three, I do not mind being called a conservative... or a liberal.
    Yes, I've tango'd with people who "believe" that minimum wage causes inflation. Using numerous studies as sources, I've reached the conclusion that minimum wage increases exist to ensure the common man is able to keep up with inflation. Stagnant wages are causing the death of the proletariat, and one thing that DOES happen after minimum wage increases, is that we see wages all the way up to the 95th percentile increase when the minimum wage goes up.

    What we do not see is any significant price hike or "inflation", which many people who say wage hikes cause inflation tend to conflate. They mix up product price hikes with "inflation" which are two entirely separate concepts.

    But as we'll find, the purchasing power of the lowest paid among us will increase significantly, while prices would only need to raise a small amount to even pay for those wage increases, since labor is a relatively small portion of business expense, at least in the current US economic climate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    It does not matter what I think. The fact is she lost in our system. Deal with that.
    My entire point was that your argument that the liberal elite has lost touch with the proletariat is complete and utter BS, because Hillary still won the majority of the working class. Don't attempt a dodge just becuase you got called on it.
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  3. #83
    I am sorry guys... but, Trump’s tax cut is already causing massive inflation. Without any sort of minimum wage increase. At this point, all wages should be increased, because inflation is lowering the worth of your income at a pretty brisk pace. Just hope that Trump doesn’t get his way, to lower the interest rate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    It does not matter what I think. The fact is she lost in our system. Deal with that.
    A NYC oligarch, beat Arkansas woman of the year... despite her winning the majority of working class... he won due to the system we have. Which of them is a coastal elite again? Do they need to make Trump tower out of ivory, to make it more obvious?
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    I don’t work here, I only smoke here.

  4. #84
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    My entire point was that your argument that the liberal elite has lost touch with the proletariat is complete and utter BS, because Hillary still won the majority of the working class. Don't attempt a dodge just becuase you got called on it.
    I stated my opinion, you do not agree with it, great, let's agree to disagree.

    But you doing what you are doing is not going to win you any favors; things will continue to get worse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    A NYC oligarch, beat Arkansas woman of the year... despite her winning the majority of working class... he won due to the system we have. Which of them is a coastal elite again? Do they need to make Trump tower out of ivory, to make it more obvious?
    I did not like her. Do I not have a right to not like people? Do I need to think, and feel like you do?
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  5. #85
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    A NYC oligarch, beat Arkansas woman of the year... despite her winning the majority of working class... he won due to the system we have. Which of them is a coastal elite again? Do they need to make Trump tower out of ivory, to make it more obvious?
    Trump's apartment is already basically entirely coated in gold plating. Though we know that Trump likes to cut corners when it's for anyone but himself, so the rest of Trump tower is likely made from the cheapest materials we could find.

    Anyone ever wondering why Trump steaks, Trump vodka, Trump airlines, Trump Bidets, Trump fleshlights, etc. all failed should realize something: Trump made all his products targeted at rich people. He marketed them with a gold veneer and an enormous price tag on most of his products. His failing was that he insisted they all be made with some of the worst materials possible. So basically every rich person he marketed these products to, knew that the products were shit, and instead of buying a Trump handbag that was made out of wal mart leather, just went to louis vuitton and bought a better bag.

    Which is basically a great metaphor for his presidency: A giant pile of shit with gold plating.

    Anyone who sees Trump's election as a rebuke against the Democrat party, and fails to acknowledge that it's really just a bad electoral system, needs to get their head screwed on straight. The proletariat elected Hillary. The business elite elected Trump. The end.
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  6. #86
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    Anyone who sees Trump's election as a rebuke against the Democrat party, and fails to acknowledge that it's really just a bad electoral system, needs to get their head screwed on straight. The proletariat elected Hillary. The business elite elected Trump. The end.
    Then you should go with this, and see where it takes you. If you are right, you will get far, and things will get better, if you are wrong expect more populism.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  7. #87
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I stated my opinion, you do not agree with it, great, let's agree to disagree.

    But you doing what you are doing is not going to win you any favors; things will continue to get worse.
    The facts disagree with your opinion. Though you're still of the position that all opinions matter. They don't, especially when they're factually untrue.

    People who think the proletariat support Trump are in for a rude awakening in 2020, and they should have already been awoken rudely in 2018 with how thoroughly Dems trounced Republicans.
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  8. #88
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    The facts disagree with your opinion. Though you're still of the position that all opinions matter. They don't, especially when they're factually untrue.
    The do not disagree with me. We just have different ways of seeing this.

    Trump also did not win with facts, but with emotion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    People who think the proletariat support Trump are in for a rude awakening in 2020, and they should have already been awoken rudely in 2018 with how thoroughly Dems trounced Republicans.
    Great, then things will improve in 2020 and beyond.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I did not like her. Do I not have a right to not like people? Do I need to think, and feel like you do?
    ‘I don’t like her’ is a much better argument, than justifying the election in context of elites.
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    I don’t work here, I only smoke here.

  10. #90
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    ‘I don’t like her’ is a much better argument, than justifying the election in context of elites.
    I didn't like her and the elite in this country deserve what is coming to them. Myself included.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  11. #91
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Then you should go with this, and see where it takes you. If you are right, you will get far, and things will get better, if you are wrong expect more populism.
    Despite him being viewed as a liberal elite by the fringe left, Biden is already making great strides. Bernie has already lost significant amounts of steam and AOC and Warren are all but irrelevant. Trump's numbers are in the shitter, far below where they were when he was elected despite his loss of the popular vote. When 2020 rolls around and a Democrat candidate is elected, will you stop with these silly arguments proclaiming that the liberal elite hate the proletariat, seeing as how that only ever started with Trump's razor thin electoral college victory.
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I didn't like her and the elite in this country deserve what is coming to them. Myself included.
    What? Is Trump giving them another tax cut? Ooh... they scared... maybe we will elect a Walton or a Koch... that will scare those elites.

    Edit: By the way... you are not elite... how far are we degrading the word? Top 5%? I think elite is less than top 1% and you ain’t it...
    Last edited by Felya; 2019-05-16 at 01:54 AM.
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    I don’t work here, I only smoke here.

  13. #93
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    Despite him being viewed as a liberal elite by the fringe left, Biden is already making great strides. Bernie has already lost significant amounts of steam and AOC and Warren are all but irrelevant. Trump's numbers are in the shitter, far below where they were when he was elected despite his loss of the popular vote. When 2020 rolls around and a Democrat candidate is elected, will you stop with these silly arguments proclaiming that the liberal elite hate the proletariat, seeing as how that only ever started with Trump's razor thin electoral college victory.
    No, I will not. I do not like Biden, and will not be voting for him if he wins the democratic nomination.

    And if Biden does win, it will be interesting watching the fireworks start. Government will be even more at odds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    What? Is Trump giving them another tax cut? Ooh... they scared... maybe we will elect a Walton or a Koch... that will scare those elites.

    Edit: By the way... you are not elite... how far are we degrading the word? Top 5%? I think elite is less than top 1% and you ain’t it...
    If you say so.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    No, I will not. I do not like Biden, and will not be voting for him if he wins the democratic nomination.
    You'd rather Trump continues to be President? Lol.

    Delenda Est.

  15. #95
    Let me put it this way... if you run over and kill someone while drunk, then flee to Mexico... Afluenza defense will not work for you. None of us are elite... the elite are talking to the people, we are talking about.

    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    I don’t work here, I only smoke here.

  16. #96
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    You'd rather Trump continues to be President? Lol.
    It would not matter, I live in CA.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    You'd rather Trump continues to be President? Lol.
    Who cares? He doesn’t live in a swing state. He is a “coastal elite” from California, his vote doesn’t mater.
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    I don’t work here, I only smoke here.

  18. #98
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    Who cares? He doesn’t live in a swing state. He is a “coastal elite” from California, his vote doesn’t mater.
    I do like how people like Connal and Theo, the "not conservative" liberals who vomit up every bad conservative talking point, seem to support the electoral college and yet its very existence ensures that their vote means nothing. Most states will always vote one way or another. They go "Oh man we NEED the electoral college or else Cali and New York will decide our president!" when right now, 2-3 swing states with a fraction the population of those states currently decide the president. A popular vote setup wouldn't even mean that Cali and NY decide our prez either, as all those conservatives in Cali would suddenly have a say in the election. Saying that NY and Cali would decide our prez is another useless talking point that doesn't belong in the EC debate.
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  19. #99
    Merely a Setback Connal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    I do like how people like Connal and Theo, the "not conservative" liberals who vomit up every bad conservative talking point, seem to support the electoral college and yet its very existence ensures that their vote means nothing. Most states will always vote one way or another. They go "Oh man we NEED the electoral college or else Cali and New York will decide our president!" when right now, 2-3 swing states with a fraction the population of those states currently decide the president. A popular vote setup wouldn't even mean that Cali and NY decide our prez either, as all those conservatives in Cali would suddenly have a say in the election. Saying that NY and Cali would decide our prez is another useless talking point that doesn't belong in the EC debate.
    Theo is not a liberal, and I do not care if you call me a conservative or a liberal...

    I just get entertained by watching the current tragicomedy. And by essentially being called impious by people like you.
    Vocatus atque non vocatus, deus aderit.

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Sunseeker View Post
    I'd post a serious response if I could get up off the floor between laughing fits.
    I loved the part where he says that we shouldn't expand air pollution regulations because there are only marginal health gains. Like has this dude lived near a power plant or a factory?
    Your problem is that you’re more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right.

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