[TV] Batwoman

[Faroth]

That doesn't make it any more or less dumb and obnoxious, though. "I'm not going to let a man take credit for a woman's work!" -Batwoman, who just stole all the equipment and the identity of Batman, rides on his good name and literally identifies herself as a 'female Bruce Wayne'. The writers of this dialogue took a nose dive from the stupid tree and crashed into every branch available head on.

It could be a cool plot point for her to have to overcome in time. You can start a character as obnoxious and arrogant and have them grow from their experiences to realize this crusade isn't as easy as it first seemed and come to respect just how much your predecessor sacrificed to wage that war without losing the character in the predecessor's shadow.

Heck, Robin's entire journey to Nightwing is essentially about that.

But I watched Supergirl (admittedly on a 2nd monitor while MMO'ing - how I've watched all of CW shows for years now) until this current season. It's just gotten more heavy handed and hamfisted in its methods and dialogue, so I have a strong feeling Batwoman will be more of that and no character growth beyond what you see in the trailer.

A huge point to me would be that "I'm not going to let a man take credit for a woman's work" when the shadow of the Bat would work to her favor. It worked in Dick's favor all the time. You let them think Batman's back. The trailer shows her in a more Batman like costume until she changes the mask and adds the wig. Criminals would often have this relief of "oh, I thought it was Batman but it's just you" with Dick and that underestimation was an advantage for him. The fact that she's arrogant and wants everyone to know she's not Batman could actually bring about storylines that work against her and she has to look at things differently.

And the show is going to have a hard time escaping that shadow, regardless.
Where is Batman? You have to have a damn good explanation for why Batman, and Bruce, abandoned Gotham for 3 years now.
Where is Dick? Bludhaven was mentioned way back in the second season of Arrow and Batwoman (and thus Batman) exist on Earth-1, so it's not a leap to expect Nightwing is out there, but for Batman to disappear and Dick ignore everything for years seems odd. Having Grayson FINALLY appear on Batwoman and highlighting the differences between Bruce's training Dick as a detective whereas Kate has more focus on military & survival training would be a lot of fun.

We've heard Harley Quinn's voice on Arrow, so we know she, and thus logically Joker, exist. Would Joker take kindly to someone suiting up as his nemesis? We saw that this Earth has a twist on Mr. Freeze now likely being Mrs. Freeze as the freeze gun was labeled as Nora's property in Arkham. The trailer is kicking off with this Alice and the Wonderland gang....surely Jervis Tetch will be brought up, right? But that draws again on Batman's villains, keeping the show somewhat overshadowed by the lack of his presence.

The ongoing "Batman without Batman" is going to get frustrating eventually. Gotham, Titans, Pennyworth, Batwoman.
Bite the bullet and do the damn thing on AMC, Amazon, HBO, or somewhere that will put the budget in for a big spectacular Batman series with season long mysteries running across the episodic run ins with the rogues gallery with a growing Bat Family over time.

[Baio]

looks cool

[Melius]

well its the CW so its trash.

[Serpha]

It's Marvel and it's CW, pile of shit like every CW show of late.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

- - - Updated - - -

Snipping this before the like-to-dislike ratio is hidden.

[Bryntrollian]

It's Marvel and it's CW, pile of shit like every CW show of late.

That most certainly isn't Marvel.

[Serpha]

That most certainly isn't Marvel.

Indeed, might as well be...

[Dejiko]

Hm it seems to share similarities with many of the superhero tv shows, in that it`s too clean, stilted, proper and formal.
It comes across as acting for the camera not necesarrily portraying a character or a role.

The need to enforce female strength and power at the expense of men feels forced, nothing wrong with a strong female character
and lead, but being abrasive and snide while demeaning others isn`t good character traits for a likeable lead character, especially a superhero.

On a personal note i`d like them to cast more intimidating people for these roles, women that are physically strong,
would be quite refreshing to see a woman with the physique of say a crossfit athlete taking on the role.

[Shadowferal]

I'm not gonna let a man take credit for a womans work, does she imply that if a man take credit from another mans work is okay?

That line doesn't really work anyway.
If she wanted to be shown as the truly independent woman, she wouldn't be dressing up as a Batman wannabee to begin with.
She should find another motif to work with.

[Skulltaker]

That line doesn't really work anyway.
If she wanted to be shown as the truly independent woman, she wouldn't be dressing up as a Batman wannabee to begin with.
She should find another motif to work with.

Yeah, but then you cannot market the name Bat with it. And all cool superhero names are taken anyway.

[enigma77]

Batwoman?

I think they misspelled Catwoman?

[Shadowferal]

Yeah, but then you cannot market the name Bat with it. And all cool superhero names are taken anyway.

And therein lies the problem with selling the feminist angle; this constant need to borrow the men's stuff.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

It could be a cool plot point for her to have to overcome in time. You can start a character as obnoxious and arrogant and have them grow from their experiences to realize this crusade isn't as easy as it first seemed and come to respect just how much your predecessor sacrificed to wage that war without losing the character in the predecessor's shadow.

given that comic batwomen has never gotten this arc i some how doubt show batwoman will.

[Skulltaker]

And therein lies the problem with selling the feminist angle; this constant need to borrow the men's stuff.

Aren't there a great many female superhero stories to explore? Maybe heroes that leave the door open for both sexes, and heroes where the heroine doesn't need to 'steal or copy' from the men? This one feels especially forced. It seems like they looked at Captain Marvel and adapted actually made the SJW orgy that people accuse Captain Marvel to be, including the stupid trick with Her and Hero. Guess what, dipshits, it's still 2/3 He. Huh. Just like that Batwoman. Bruce Wayne invented it, built it and financed it, and she's just going to use it. Sounds 100% accurate.

- - - Updated - - -

It could be a cool plot point for her to have to overcome in time. You can start a character as obnoxious and arrogant and have them grow from their experiences to realize this crusade isn't as easy as it first seemed and come to respect just how much your predecessor sacrificed to wage that war without losing the character in the predecessor's shadow.

Heck, Robin's entire journey to Nightwing is essentially about that.

But I watched Supergirl (admittedly on a 2nd monitor while MMO'ing - how I've watched all of CW shows for years now) until this current season. It's just gotten more heavy handed and hamfisted in its methods and dialogue, so I have a strong feeling Batwoman will be more of that and no character growth beyond what you see in the trailer.

A huge point to me would be that "I'm not going to let a man take credit for a woman's work" when the shadow of the Bat would work to her favor. It worked in Dick's favor all the time. You let them think Batman's back. The trailer shows her in a more Batman like costume until she changes the mask and adds the wig. Criminals would often have this relief of "oh, I thought it was Batman but it's just you" with Dick and that underestimation was an advantage for him. The fact that she's arrogant and wants everyone to know she's not Batman could actually bring about storylines that work against her and she has to look at things differently.

And the show is going to have a hard time escaping that shadow, regardless.
Where is Batman? You have to have a damn good explanation for why Batman, and Bruce, abandoned Gotham for 3 years now.
Where is Dick? Bludhaven was mentioned way back in the second season of Arrow and Batwoman (and thus Batman) exist on Earth-1, so it's not a leap to expect Nightwing is out there, but for Batman to disappear and Dick ignore everything for years seems odd. Having Grayson FINALLY appear on Batwoman and highlighting the differences between Bruce's training Dick as a detective whereas Kate has more focus on military & survival training would be a lot of fun.

We've heard Harley Quinn's voice on Arrow, so we know she, and thus logically Joker, exist. Would Joker take kindly to someone suiting up as his nemesis? We saw that this Earth has a twist on Mr. Freeze now likely being Mrs. Freeze as the freeze gun was labeled as Nora's property in Arkham. The trailer is kicking off with this Alice and the Wonderland gang....surely Jervis Tetch will be brought up, right? But that draws again on Batman's villains, keeping the show somewhat overshadowed by the lack of his presence.

The ongoing "Batman without Batman" is going to get frustrating eventually. Gotham, Titans, Pennyworth, Batwoman.
Bite the bullet and do the damn thing on AMC, Amazon, HBO, or somewhere that will put the budget in for a big spectacular Batman series with season long mysteries running across the episodic run ins with the rogues gallery with a growing Bat Family over time.

Well, your knowledge of the character clearly outpaces my own, since until today I didn't really know that there was a Batwoman. My first though was 'Wait, shouldn't that be Barbara Gordon? Who's Kate?' Never heard of the character whatsoever...

You've also put a lot of thought into all of that. Kudos! I'd love to see some of what you describe here. Judging from the trailer, though, I expect this show to crash and burn so hard that even the Hindenburg is going to offer it support. Sorry. I mean, the first half of it is still somewhat interesting, but the last bit is just so god damn insultingly stupid that I literally cannot fathom who a) wrote this and b) greenlit this.

[Shadowferal]

Aren't there a great many female superhero stories to explore? Maybe heroes that leave the door open for both sexes, and heroes where the heroine doesn't need to 'steal or copy' from the men? This one feels especially forced. It seems like they looked at Captain Marvel and adapted actually made the SJW orgy that people accuse Captain Marvel to be, including the stupid trick with Her and Hero. Guess what, dipshits, it's still 2/3 He.

She could have called herself "Huntress."
I can understand why the cancelled Arrow though. Despite the reasons given, if the two butted heads...him after taking on all comers for the past 7 seasons, he'd be difficult at best to match, let alone beat. And we can't have this "guy" do that.

[Adamas102]

Not a bad idea (we've had enough Batman for a while). Fucking awful execution, though.

[Martymark]

Sadly, this does not look good...

[Orby]

Yeah I think we got the most important message conveyed by this trailer

The aesthetics seem to fit the Gotham themes. But I think this serie will feature "I'm a woman so I'm better than any man" every 15 seconds so that'll be annoying. Maybe one day they'll understand they can perfectly write strong women without feeling obligated to smash this into our head.

Man if they wanted to do a female hero I have no issue with that, there should be more female heroes, regardless of sexuality or gender, I love to see diverse characters in TV.

My problem is sometimes these shows can go too far into the preachy side, and it constantly tries to club home the message that I feel like a baby seal.

This was my biggest problem with Sabrina, I went into that series really pumped but my god the constant feminist messaging they tried to hammer in just goes far and beyond silly that I had to stop watching. It's right up there with the environmental messages in Captain Planet or Fern Gully. You don;t have to spell it out for us, it's 2019, women can do stuff we know.

Can you imagine if Ellen Ripley in Alien (my favourite sci-Fi hero of all time), acted like this. She actually did shit, she didn't have to justify she was a women, we knew that, she was a badass who kicked ass and we all loved her for it."

Even recent examples like Jessica Jones did it right. It can be done. I just don't know why people have to hammer this shit in, it's like they are trying to troll to get a reaction. Who gives screenwriter jobs to trolls?

[Ayirasi]

I woman might woman watch woman an woman episode woman or woman two woman to woman see woman what woman all woman the woman fuss woman is woman about. Woman.

[Gasparde]

They didn't even put any emphasize on her whole jew backstory thing. Like, the fuck? If you're already pandering your fucking SJW virtue signaling ass off at least go all the way and give the character all the minority credits instead of just most of them.

I hope we'll get at least 10 lesbian kissing scenes, 15 I'm-a-lesbian drop bombs and at least 20 scenes of women don't need no men cuz women are better right in the first fucking episode to really hit the point.

It's beyond me how the CW with 20 shows like this can stay in business. But, I mean, with an IP as rich as DC you can't really help it but to boil everything down to social justice if you wanna make money.