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  1. #1

    Too much horde and alliance focus -i'm sick of it.

    Anyone else? I'm just fed up and i want to RAGE !!

    It's just come to dominate EVERYTHING - the playerable races have lost their identity and exist only for the express purpose of the horde or the alliance.

    All players think about races is purely in terms of the horde and alliance too.. horde fans hate every alliance race adn can't imagine them outside the confines of the faction, alliance players hate horde races can't only view them as hordies... i'm just sick of it.

    I don't mind races joining t he horde and alliance because we have to have t2 factions, but when everything becomes dominated by this - with no grey area - it feels like warcraft only has two nations. One called horde and one called alliance.

    Whoever thought it was a good idea to drop down from the WC3 expanded factions back down to two is responsible for the messing up of racial lore - because it was too convenient to fall into the trap of only writing for 2 sides.
    Last edited by EnigmAddict; 2019-05-26 at 04:10 PM.

  2. #2
    Quit the game. It's always been about the factions in conflict with each other. Either in an all out war like BfA or as clashes in a more isolated manner. If you don't like how the plot is always gonna return to the factions as the basic storytelling force, quit asap.

  3. #3
    You are not right. Horde fans can like some Alliance races. For example, I like Draenei, dwarves and Kul Tirans, even void elves.

    That said, I think that factions indeed seem to dominant. We are basically forced to see Imperium of Mankind fighting Orcish Horde every expansion. It is even worse when the art team puts orcish architecture wherever the Horde appears. And then, people start to think that Horde is all about orcish tenets and Alliance is bound to Holy Light.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Amaterasu65 View Post
    Quit the game. It's always been about the factions in conflict with each other. Either in an all out war like BfA or as clashes in a more isolated manner. If you don't like how the plot is always gonna return to the factions as the basic storytelling force, quit asap.
    The problem is not that factions exist but that individual races lose their identity. Just look at Nightborne in red spikes, it's disgusting. Every race pretends to be either orcs or humans. In fact, only the Forsaken maintain their identity but we all can see what will happen to them.
    I give my flesh and blood freely to the Warchief. I am the instrument of my Warchief's desire. I am a weapon of my Warchief's command.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread

  4. #4
    Immortal Khaza-R's Avatar
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    Its pretty much been the case every expansion except Legion. Which largely abandoned the faction conflict outside of Stormheim and focused on a class-driven story instead.

  5. #5
    I do wish we had more race lore or INTRA-FACTION interactions but that's not really a consequence of the Horde/Alliance it's a problem from Blizz's writing style. We saw the same issues with Legion where the orcs/tauren/trolls got lumped into the human warrior class hall and the Priest class hall was all about the light/shadow no Elune or Loa or anything.
    Twas brillig

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by matrix123mko View Post
    You are not right. Horde fans can like some Alliance races. For example, I like Draenei, dwarves and Kul Tirans, even void elves.

    That said, I think that factions indeed seem to dominant. We are basically forced to see Imperium of Mankind fighting Orcish Horde every expansion. It is even worse when the art team puts orcish architecture wherever the Horde appears. And then, people start to think that Horde is all about orcish tenets and Alliance is bound to Holy Light.

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    The problem is not that factions exist but that individual races lose their identity. Just look at Nightborne in red spikes, it's disgusting. Every race pretends to be either orcs or humans. In fact, only the Forsaken maintain their identity but we all can see what will happen to them.
    To true. Watching Nightborne in orcish armor is ridiculous and looks ugly. Same goes for Forsaken but on the less severe level. In Alliance watching all races melt into one human-like golden-blue blob is also feels bad.

  7. #7
    Scarab Lord Maxrokur's Avatar
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    I just hope some savior character will destroy Orgrimmar and Stormwind and putting down for good the factions or at least the orc/human hegemony and let loose the rest of the races to take the spotlight.
    Quote Originally Posted by Varitok View Post
    No, she is my waifu. Stop posting and delete this thread immediately.
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    Voted Baine because... Well, Baine. Total nonsensical character, looks like World War II Italy, nobody really understands what role he's supposed to fill, not even himself

  8. #8
    The Lightbringer Kyphael's Avatar
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    Yeah, Horde vs. Alliance sucks hard. I've been sick of it since Sylvanas went full re*@*d, and unfortunately Azshara doesn't bitch slap both factions like I hoped. At least there is still N'zoth on the horizon to save us from this train wreck of a faction conflict.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxrokur View Post
    I just hope some savior character will destroy Orgrimmar and Stormwind and putting down for good the factions or at least the orc/human hegemony and let loose the rest of the races to take the spotlight.
    If only...

  9. #9
    Immortal Syegfryed's Avatar
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    >play the game about faction
    >get mad about the focus on it

    its like being mad about a football tourney, because it focus on football

    let me guess, you wish everything would be about elves, cause the "tribal" horde to not combine with then, sure

    btw, they are prob focusing on"race campaign next expansion anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    To true. Watching Nightborne in orcish armor is ridiculous and looks ugly. .
    they can always transmog

    it snot like the races can't use then if they want, its rly impossible to visit other countries and try their styles?

  10. #10
    Take a break till the next expansion? BfA is all about the faction war, something some players have been wanting to come back for years....you know what they say sometimes about getting what you wish for?
    #WithoutRespectWeReject

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    >play the game about faction
    >get mad about the focus on it

    its like being mad about a football tourney, because it focus on football
    It was never stated that this game is about humans and orcs.
    let me guess, you wish everything would be about elves, cause the "tribal" horde to not combine with then, sure
    Trolls are okay. Only orcs and tauren should disappear for a while.
    btw, they are prob focusing on"race campaign next expansion anyway.
    It is long overdue and we still have no confirmation.
    I give my flesh and blood freely to the Warchief. I am the instrument of my Warchief's desire. I am a weapon of my Warchief's command.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread

  12. #12
    The Insane Thage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amaterasu65 View Post
    Quit the game. It's always been about the factions in conflict with each other. Either in an all out war like BfA or as clashes in a more isolated manner. If you don't like how the plot is always gonna return to the factions as the basic storytelling force, quit asap.
    The problem is that the faction war in and of itself cannot carry an expansion story with the current writing team's level of "talent." The writing requires too many plot holes, too many factors pushed to the wayside, and too many characters derailed or pushed into situations they have no rational reason to be in in order to make the faction conflict work. It's especially egregious when amorphous 'spirits' told Vol'jin to select a known omnicidal maniac to lead the Horde when the Horde was still picking up the pieces from Garrosh's disastrous turn into maniacal villainy and the fallout therein. It was painfully obvious this story choice was influenced outside the plot in order to push the faction conflict from a B-plot (which it's been since the second half of Warcraft 3) into the A-plot, even if only for the first half of BFA, and the current story status (the entire landfill being on fire) is indicative of the writing team's complete inability to make a faction war work.

    If the faction war wants the A-plot, it needs good writing. Factors that put one faction at a clear disadvantage should be addressed and countered, not quietly ignored without so much as a passing reference. If the Ancients have such strong ties to the night elves but ignore the Horde burning Teldrassil and desecrating wide swaths of Darkshore, explain why. If the Vindicaar is unable to fire on the Horde when the Horde was stonewalled by wisps for a week, explain why. If the Cenarion Circle hasn't declared war on the Horde after aforementioned ecological devastation, explain why. If the Ebon Blade aren't mobilizing against someone whose stated goal is to wipe out all life on Azeroth, explain why. If the Silver Hand hasn't put Sylvanas in their sights after what went down at the Undercity, explain why.

    "This isn't the story we want to tell" is bad fanfic-level justification. It's something the troll who wrote My Immortal as "Tara Gillespie" would use in ff.net feedback comments to defend their work as part of the masquerade. When this is the quality of writing we have to expect from the faction war, don't get shitty when someone gets sick of the faction war and wants it to be the hell over with. When you're fed a steady buffet of bullshit, you're fully in your rights to say "I'm tired of eating bullshit, can I get a burger instead?"
    Last edited by Thage; 2019-05-26 at 04:37 PM. Reason: Clarification
    Battle for Azeroth: Now with more Morally Grey™!*

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  13. #13
    The idea of the faction war was flawed from the start. While many people never wanted a faction war expansion (me included), many other people did - until they got it. This seems like the last hurrah for a faction conflict narrative, with them driving the story toward "we need to work together to beat the big bad" yet again, albeit more insistently than Cata, MoP, and even Legion.

    Quote Originally Posted by EnigmAddict View Post
    All players think about races is purely in terms of the horde and alliance too.. horde fans hate every alliance race adn can't imagine them outside the confines of the faction, alliance players hate horde races can't only view them as hordies... i'm just sick of it.
    This more rarely happens outside of the forums. Here, people are all for being "passionate" about whatever they feel strongly about - often times it comes down to "I wish [insert race/faction] would just wipe out [insert other race/faction] because I don't like them." That certainly does happen in some trade/general chats, and I would imagine it's more prevalent for RPers, since that is a facet of the fiber of every race in WoW. Even then, I would imagine that many RPers don't act this way. But, not many people RP in the grand scheme of things, and the majority of players don't sit around in an auction house to chat in trade chat as well.

    But, a lot of other people (I would say the majority) play the game for many other reasons, and lore (which "faction pride" falls under) isn't high-ranking in that regard. Lots of people, like myself, like the lore/know a lot of lore, and play both factions as well. You can't take what you see on MMO-C as the average reaction that most people would have. Only the most dedicated, angry, bored, and/or passionate players take the time out of their day to go on a fan forum (not even the official forums, mind you) to talk about the game, instead of simply playing the game.

    Some players? Sure. All players? Absolutely not. Generalizations aren't a cute look.
    Last edited by Destinas; 2019-05-26 at 04:49 PM.
    3 hints to surviving MMO-C forums:
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    2.) If you have a source, there will be people who refuse to believe it
    3.) If you use logic, it will be largely ignored
    btw: Spires of Arak = Arakkoa.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    >play the game about faction
    >get mad about the focus on it

    its like being mad about a football tourney, because it focus on football
    Or, to use another example, it's like playing the faction in that game that's about various different races and then getting mad every time the focus isn't exclusively about the glorious Orc master race (which somehow is glorious despite 3 out of 4 Orc Warchiefs being failures, when even one bad Warchief disqualifies other races forever, because #consistency).
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Slant is an extremist, willing to sacrifice the lives of everyone to keep his wet dream of the EU alive.
    You shouldn't support people like him, it's like supporting ISIS.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Or, to use another example, it's like playing the faction in that game that's about various different races and then getting mad every time the focus isn't exclusively about the glorious Orc master race (which somehow is glorious despite 3 out of 4 Orc Warchiefs being failures, when even one bad Warchief disqualifies other races forever, because #consistency).
    Who's that 1 Warchief who didn't fail? Blackhand?
    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderaan View Post
    All it takes is an incel at the wrong place wrong time and we won't even know what hit us.

  16. #16
    Immortal Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matrix123mko View Post
    It was never stated that this game is about humans and orcs.
    Alliance and horde are orcs and humans in the essence

    even so, right now its more about humans and elves/undeads, the alliance is too much about humans and the horde too less about orcs
    Trolls are okay. Only orcs and tauren should disappear for a while.
    horde orcs disappeared since MOP, its why he just have and old grampa and depression thrall

    wod was just a gorilla villains fest

    It is long overdue and we still have no confirmation.
    in a Q&A they said how in the future they can do that, but right now they are focusing on the factions.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Or, to use another example, it's like playing the faction in that game that's about various different races and then getting mad every time the focus isn't exclusively about the glorious Orc master race (which somehow is glorious despite 3 out of 4 Orc Warchiefs being failures, when even one bad Warchief disqualifies other races forever, because #consistency).
    the glorious master race is getting shit since MOP and erased since then, talk shit about "various different races" but i only see they pampering elves and forsaken because another elf

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    The problem is that the faction war in and of itself cannot carry an expansion story with the current writing team's level of "talent."
    You're saying this as if with the current writing team's level of talent any story, alone or in tandem with something else, can carry an expansion.


    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    If the faction war wants the A-plot, it needs good writing. Factors that put one faction at a clear disadvantage should be addressed and countered, not quietly ignored without so much as a passing reference. If the Ancients have such strong ties to the night elves but ignore the Horde burning Teldrassil and desecrating wide swaths of Darkshore, explain why. If the Vindicaar is unable to fire on the Horde when the Horde was stonewalled by wisps for a week, explain why. If the Cenarion Circle hasn't declared war on the Horde after aforementioned ecological devastation, explain why. If the Ebon Blade aren't mobilizing against someone whose stated goal is to wipe out all life on Azeroth, explain why. If the Silver Hand hasn't put Sylvanas in their sights after what went down at the Undercity, explain why.
    Out of these only Vindicaar thing needs an explanation. Teldrassil is nothing more than monument to Fandral's hubris. Even Malfurion was against it. Aspects refused to bless it for a decade and even then only two gave their blessings to it. There's no real reason why Ancients should give a shit about it. Cenarion Circle didn't declare war on the Horde for the same reason they didn't declare war on Venture Company. It's just not exactly into the whole declaring wars business. No goal of wiping out all life on Azeroth has been mentioned for the Horde, so your reason for Ebon Blade having to go against Sylvanas doesn't exist and other than that she does the exact same stuff Ebon Blade itself does. And, as mentioned, nothing that went down at the Undercity is anything that Ebon Blade hasn't partook in and yet they were Argent Crusade's strongest allies against the Lich King.


    Quote Originally Posted by Maxrokur View Post
    I just hope some savior character will destroy Orgrimmar and Stormwind and putting down for good the factions or at least the orc/human hegemony and let loose the rest of the races to take the spotlight.
    You think you want that, but you don't. Because asking for a savior character only gives Blizzard an excuse to take Me'dan off the shelf. And that's a recipe for disaster.


    Quote Originally Posted by OIS View Post
    Who's that 1 Warchief who didn't fail? Blackhand?
    Orgrim. Now, he did lose the war in the end, but at least he was fighting it in a competent manner. And then helped free Orcs from internment and had a sort of a mini-redemption arc for losing the Second War. So he wasn't a complete failure like Gul'dan's boytoy Blackhand, Alliance appeaser full of green guilt Thrall or mouthbreathing retard antagonizing entire races allied to him at a time while at war, when he really needed their support called Garrosh.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Slant is an extremist, willing to sacrifice the lives of everyone to keep his wet dream of the EU alive.
    You shouldn't support people like him, it's like supporting ISIS.

  18. #18
    The Insane Thage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Out of these only Vindicaar thing needs an explanation. Teldrassil is nothing more than monument to Fandral's hubris. Even Malfurion was against it. Aspects refused to bless it for a decade and even then only two gave their blessings to it. There's no real reason why Ancients should give a shit about it.
    The tree itself, sure. But the novellas imply a majority of the night elf civilian population burned with it, and I would certainly think the Ancients, who we're often told have a special relationship with the kaldorei, would think to take exception at so many being specifically targeted and burned alive.

    Cenarion Circle didn't declare war on the Horde for the same reason they didn't declare war on Venture Company. It's just not exactly into the whole declaring wars business.
    While true, they have taken action against groups that cause large-scale ecological damage, with offshoots like DEHTA taking it one step further and making routine work of hiring assassins.

    No goal of wiping out all life on Azeroth has been mentioned for the Horde, so your reason for Ebon Blade having to go against Sylvanas doesn't exist and other than that she does the exact same stuff Ebon Blade itself does. And, as mentioned, nothing that went down at the Undercity is anything that Ebon Blade hasn't partook in and yet they were Argent Crusade's strongest allies against the Lich King.
    The Ebon Blade, with their pact with the Lich King ongoing, ought to be moving against her considering Bolvar seems aware she's up to some shit and considers her an enemy. Why would he hesitate to remove an enemy when he's been ruthless all throughout the Death Knight order hall campaigns?

    And the Silver Hand/Argent Crusade have, according to Ask CDev threads, been 'keeping tabs' on her since the 1-60 Cataclysm quest lines, which brings to question why they aren't taking a more active role in reining her in. I have trouble believing that, as close as Hearthglen and Light's Hope are to the Undercity, word hasn't reached Tyrosus and company about Sylvanas Blighting and raising her own troops and the Alliance's, which should be a red flag the size of Naxxramas to them.
    Battle for Azeroth: Now with more Morally Grey™!*

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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    The problem is that the faction war in and of itself cannot carry an expansion story with the current writing team's level of "talent." The writing requires too many plot holes, too many factors pushed to the wayside, and too many characters derailed or pushed into situations they have no rational reason to be in in order to make the faction conflict work. It's especially egregious when amorphous 'spirits' told Vol'jin to select a known omnicidal maniac to lead the Horde when the Horde was still picking up the pieces from Garrosh's disastrous turn into maniacal villainy and the fallout therein. It was painfully obvious this story choice was influenced outside the plot in order to push the faction conflict from a B-plot (which it's been since the second half of Warcraft 3) into the A-plot, even if only for the first half of BFA, and the current story status (the entire landfill being on fire) is indicative of the writing team's complete inability to make a faction war work.

    If the faction war wants the A-plot, it needs good writing. Factors that put one faction at a clear disadvantage should be addressed and countered, not quietly ignored without so much as a passing reference. If the Ancients have such strong ties to the night elves but ignore the Horde burning Teldrassil and desecrating wide swaths of Darkshore, explain why. If the Vindicaar is unable to fire on the Horde when the Horde was stonewalled by wisps for a week, explain why. If the Cenarion Circle hasn't declared war on the Horde after aforementioned ecological devastation, explain why. If the Ebon Blade aren't mobilizing against someone whose stated goal is to wipe out all life on Azeroth, explain why. If the Silver Hand hasn't put Sylvanas in their sights after what went down at the Undercity, explain why.

    "This isn't the story we want to tell" is bad fanfic-level justification. It's something the troll who wrote My Immortal as "Tara Gillespie" would use in ff.net feedback comments to defend their work as part of the masquerade. When this is the quality of writing we have to expect from the faction war, don't get shitty when someone gets sick of the faction war and wants it to be the hell over with. When you're fed a steady buffet of bullshit, you're fully in your rights to say "I'm tired of eating bullshit, can I get a burger instead?"
    Take my upvote!

  20. #20
    The Insane Aeula's Avatar
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    I’ve wanted Horde vs Alliance for ages, but Blizzard made me hate my own faction as much as I hate the other one. I’m at the stage where I want the bad guys to win as it seems to be the most ideal outcome.

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