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  1. #361
    Quote Originally Posted by Has lost its way View Post
    You don't find it weird to both admit I am right then try to back pedal in the same post?
    Except I never admitted you're right. You're just plain wrong. There's no such thing as a "mythic raider tax".

    You admit that mythic first as you put it have to farm ap
    I haven't.
    Is there anything from vanilla WoW you are not looking forward to despite your hype for Classic? Come and tell us what it is.

  2. #362
    Quote Originally Posted by Fiacla View Post
    So as I'm sure many people are aware after browsing this site and others, the WoW Classic beta has begun to a great deal of fanfare.

    However, I can't be the only one to have noticed the massive increase in hostilities between the retail and classic crowd? You have both sides creating pejorative terms to describe the others, such as "retail babies" or "nostalgia purists".

    So I suppose my question and the point of this thread is to ask how do you predict this will all turn out?

    I personally believe the community is fractured beyond belief and it's sad that so many who once shared a favourite pass time are now attacking each other over what essentially amounts to their personal preference.
    The hardcore retailers spent a long time prior to BfA insisting Classic would never happen, it was all nostalgia, nobody will play it.

    Now that retail is falling faster than WoW ever has and the desire and hype for Classic is soaring, they're into full panic mode, which amounts to doubling down on he vitriol.

  3. #363
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mullet Man View Post
    Why do you think millions of players have stopped playing retail WoW?
    Five years ago, Blizzard created an infographic in which it was shown that 100,000,000 unique World of Warcraft accounts had been created over the first ten years. Of course there were many, many millions fewer players subscribed at the time.

    Millions have always left, even during Vanilla. After some time the number of people signing up becomes less than the number of people leaving and there are fewer players around. This is all very normal and not difficult to understand.

    It's not a very good argument although it's in keeping with the logic that a lot of folks use. People leave for all sorts of reasons. People typically don't stay with games for years.
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  4. #364
    Dreadlord Mullet Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Five years ago, Blizzard created an infographic in which it was shown that 100,000,000 unique World of Warcraft accounts had been created over the first ten years. Of course there were many, many millions fewer players subscribed at the time.

    Millions have always left, even during Vanilla. After some time the number of people signing up becomes less than the number of people leaving and there are fewer players around. This is all very normal and not difficult to understand.

    It's not a very good argument although it's in keeping with the logic that a lot of folks use. People leave for all sorts of reasons. People typically don't stay with games for years.
    I agree.
    There is a fallacy argument being used by the Classic detractors.
    It follows that if people leave after trying out the game, it was all nostalgia and Classic is a failure.

    As you noted, this is not true.
    Millions of people have played, and quit, WoW over the years for many different reasons.
    Push it to the limit

    #NoCollusion
    "The Special Counsel did not find that the Trump campaign, or anyone associated with it, conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in these efforts, despite multiple. offers from Russian-affiliated individuals to assist the Trump campaign."

  5. #365
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mullet Man View Post
    I agree.
    There is a fallacy argument being used by the Classic detractors.
    It follows that if people leave after trying out the game, it was all nostalgia and Classic is a failure.
    My point was it doesn't have anything to do with Classic. A lot of people are going to try that out and leave as well. It doesn't mean Classic will be necessarily a failure but it's unclear how much of what's considered its core audience is going to show up and pay to stay. You certainly can't draw conclusions based on forums and free illegal servers.
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  6. #366
    Dreadlord Mullet Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    My point was it doesn't have anything to do with Classic. A lot of people are going to try that out and leave as well. It doesn't mean Classic will be necessarily a failure but it's unclear how much of what's considered its core audience is going to show up and pay to stay. You certainly can't draw conclusions based on forums and free illegal servers.
    Blizzard doesn't provide subscription numbers so we don't have much of anything to go on, except, perhaps the actions of Blizzard.
    But that is still like reading tea-leaves.
    For example, many said Blizzard would only release Classic if Retail was dying.
    Push it to the limit

    #NoCollusion
    "The Special Counsel did not find that the Trump campaign, or anyone associated with it, conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in these efforts, despite multiple. offers from Russian-affiliated individuals to assist the Trump campaign."

  7. #367
    Quote Originally Posted by Mullet Man View Post
    You didn't answer the question... and you are missing the point.
    People are going to stop playing Classic and Retail for various reason.
    Implying that Classic is a failure because some don't like the playstyle also implies that Retail is a failure in your eyes because people have stopped playing.
    I didn't answer the question because it's a pointless question to ask. Nobody on this forum knows any better than anybody else the reasons why people quit. This information is unknowable.

  8. #368
    Dreadlord Mullet Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    I didn't answer the question because it's a pointless question to ask. Nobody on this forum knows any better than anybody else the reasons why people quit. This information is unknowable.
    Sorry... my mistake. I mis-quoted you. It was another user.
    I concede.
    Push it to the limit

    #NoCollusion
    "The Special Counsel did not find that the Trump campaign, or anyone associated with it, conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in these efforts, despite multiple. offers from Russian-affiliated individuals to assist the Trump campaign."

  9. #369
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigby View Post
    The hardcore retailers spent a long time prior to BfA insisting Classic would never happen, it was all nostalgia, nobody will play it.

    Now that retail is falling faster than WoW ever has and the desire and hype for Classic is soaring, they're into full panic mode, which amounts to doubling down on he vitriol.
    ANd classic fanboys utter BS like this in order to fuel their confirmation bias. You are proof of Fiacia's point. you re spewing vitriol by going after people who prefer retail.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by toffmcsoft View Post
    Classic PVP is WAY better then retail PVP. Much more skill involved.
    There is no skill involved in classic including PvP.

  10. #370
    @duselsteiner

    Yes? What component was more fun in Classic?
    Im only going as far as saying "only this things"

    1)Community aspect while leveling
    2)Item upgrades were extremely relevant
    3)Gear mattered and there was no pvp scaling in pvp
    4)This one is a personal one...i hate transmog.

  11. #371
    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    1)Community aspect while leveling
    Community aspect like "spamming the lfg chat in cities" or community aspect like "having to travel to a dungeon for 20 minutes after you had to look for a tank for an hour"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    2)Item upgrades were extremely relevant
    Item upgrades nowadays are way more relevant. The difference in ilevel is inflated. In classic, T2,5 and T3 difference did not really matter that much. And a casual gamer only could get dungeon gear and t0,5 later on. Which was literally all item progression avaialble outside of raids.

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    3)Gear mattered and there was no pvp scaling in pvp
    .. which made low level battlegrounds unbearable for fresh levelers because of twinkers with little level 19 bastard-chars that had 2k life and one hitted their enemies. So much for "balanced pvp".

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    4)This one is a personal one...i hate transmog.
    Yeah, i am sure no transmog is better than having a system which allows you to customize your appearance.. i beg your pardon.. that is one of your major "features"?

    How big are that nostalgia goggles you took on?
    Last edited by duselsteiner; 2019-05-22 at 09:29 PM.

  12. #372
    Quote Originally Posted by duselsteiner View Post
    Community aspect like "spamming the lfg chat in cities" or community aspect like "having to travel to a dungeon for 20 minutes after you had to look for a tank for an hour"?
    No, community aspect as in mobs are strong (stronger than retail) and you cant overpull. Mobs get tagged for your own faction so you need to group up.
    Elite quest mobs for elite group quests.
    Some buildings, caves, castles are extremely difficult without a group because of the respawns and heavy mob presence.

    All community building designs.

    Oh and server popularity, you always meet the same people.

  13. #373
    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    No, community aspect as in mobs are strong (stronger than retail) and you cant overpull. Mobs get tagged for your own faction so you need to group up.
    The only mobs which were strong are some elite mobs, which you can skip easily. Levelilng in WoW classic was as easy as nowadays if you know which mobs you had to skip. Also, there are elite rare mobs nowadays, which you cannot really solo easily during leveling, except you overgear them by far.

    Also, mobs did not get tagged for faction in classic, but for the guy or group who attacks it first. Means, all those thousand players doing the zhevra hoof quest will have those 5 zhevras respawning all 20 minutes to give one hoof to maximum 5 players.. which does not add fun to gameplay, but people who hate you because you killed their zhevra. And got their hoof. Also, if i remember correctly, one zhevra only dropped one hoof for one guy from one group.. which means, even grouping up will not help you to complete that quest.

    But hey.. if you like to compete for zhevra hoofs with others, i am sure classic will be for you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    Elite quest mobs for elite group quests.
    .. which are not mandatory. And which most people skip, as most people level solo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    Some buildings, caves, castles are extremely difficult without a group because of the respawns and heavy mob presence.
    I cannot remember a single cave or castle where that was true.

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    All community building designs.
    What do you mean by that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    Oh and server popularity, you always meet the same people.
    The reboot is sharded. Very likely your shard gets reorganized sometimes.

    May i ask if you ever played original classic?
    Last edited by duselsteiner; 2019-05-22 at 09:50 PM.

  14. #374
    Quote Originally Posted by duselsteiner View Post
    May i ask if you ever played original classic?
    Thats my question to you! Everything you said is misinformation for petes sake.
    I cant even be bothered to go over them one by one.
    Ill just quote one.

    The only mobs which were strong are some elite mobs, which you can skip easily. Levelilng in WoW classic was as easy as nowadays if you know which mobs you had to skip. Also, there are elite rare mobs nowadays, which you cannot really solo easily during leveling, except you overgear them by far.
    wth

    I cannot remember a single cave or castle where that was true.
    WTH!

    This is just an example on video

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f56n6gkBSpM&t=1m3s
    Last edited by Togabito; 2019-05-22 at 09:53 PM.

  15. #375
    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    Thats my question to you! Everything you said is misinformation for petes sake.
    No, actually everything i talk about was something i experienced in real classic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    WTH!
    Seems to me you have not really played the original classic. I had. And i can tell you it was not really the hype which it is being made currently.

  16. #376
    Quote Originally Posted by duselsteiner View Post
    No, actually everything i talk about was something i experienced in real classic.



    Seems to me you have not really played the original classic. I had. And i can tell you it was not really the hype which it is being made currently.
    Check my video, is just an example. And that house was easy. Im talking really castles and caves full of mobs where they all keep respawning on you....running and calling for help.

  17. #377
    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    Check my video, is just an example. And that house was easy. Im talking really castles and caves full of mobs where they all keep respawning on you....running and calling for help.
    So what? Do you run into a cave full of mobs nowadays if you play, lets say, a rogue while leveling, without having good gear?

    No, you do not. So thats not different.

    And tell me, imagine you play a hunter, do you think you will not be able to solo elites as like Mor'ladim in classic?

  18. #378
    Quote Originally Posted by duselsteiner View Post
    So what? Do you run into a cave full of mobs nowadays if you play, lets say, a rogue while leveling, without having good gear?

    No, you do not. So thats not different.

    And tell me, imagine you play a hunter, do you think you will not be able to solo elites as like Mor'ladim in classic?
    Yeah but a demon hunter for example can kill 20+mobs if he wants on retail. And i dont know how it is on other classes but pretty sure they can pull 8 mobs of necessary.

    Hunters are extremely good yeah but if the elite kills his pet...its done.

  19. #379
    Quote Originally Posted by Togabito View Post
    Yeah but a demon hunter for example can kill 20+mobs if he wants on retail. And i dont know how it is on other classes but pretty sure they can pull 8 mobs of necessary.

    Hunters are extremely good yeah but if the elite kills his pet...its done.
    No, as hunters are very good at kiting.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5AFVf7Nr70

    Also, 20 mobs? Really? Did you try with a not overgeared damage dealer specced demon hunter?

  20. #380
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigby View Post
    The hardcore retailers spent a long time prior to BfA insisting Classic would never happen, it was all nostalgia, nobody will play it.

    Now that retail is falling faster than WoW ever has and the desire and hype for Classic is soaring, they're into full panic mode, which amounts to doubling down on he vitriol.
    What a joke.
    No one claimed classic wont happen, there was just no reason for it to happen.
    Now that all their old games are been remastered it is only natural to get classic and maybe even TBC and other expansion servers.
    WoW has been alive for so long longer then many other games out there its only normal for this to happen.

    Retail will be alive even if it means it will sustain classic because without retail you cant play classic even if you want to.
    Retail is the machine keeping your pipe dreams alive at this point regardless of how bad it might be.

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