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  1. #581
    I played Cataclysm launch HC dungeons. No dungeons are ever gonna be hard for me again. That was such a shitfest back then.

    What i remember about vanilla dungeons is that i was permanently confused and never knew where to go and that they took so long - but difficult? Not really.

  2. #582
    Quote Originally Posted by WowClassic View Post
    Lol people actually think difficulty is just about scripted boss mechanics. Retailers think if there are more mechanics listed in the Adventure Guide it must be harder.

    In Classic the world is actually dangerous, you aren't invincible, that's the big difference. Just getting to a dungeon can be a challenge.

    And so far all we've seen is lower level dungeons, which although not difficult are still more of a challenge than retail (there is a risk of wiping at least).

    Why on earth are you comparing level 20 dungeons to Mythic+, that's straight up retarded.

    I think I trust Venruki, one of the greatest Mages in the game of all time, when he says that the difficulty feels much more rewarding in Classic, over a bunch of retail babbies who have thousands of posts and think that the garbage of BfA is the way an MMO should be.
    The world really isnt that dangerous in vanilla WoW nor are that dungeons that hard to get to. They are TIMELY to get to yes. Like, Shadowfang isnt hard to get to for an Alliance character. It just takes a lot of time to get to.


    There are also a few examples of over tuned mobs (like the defias mages) as well as random elites (The worgen), however these are very big rarities and not indicative of the world as a whole. Honest question, have you yourself played vanilla?

    Hell, said mage is correct. Vanilla is more rewarding. But its because the gratification isnt instant, its more earned, but not in a difficulty sense. You arent automatically grouped with people, that adds value to grouping itself. You dont instantly enter a dungeon, which gives the world a greater sense of scale and immersion. The fights arent hard but they do last longer giving a stronger sense that you're really doing something major. Time is a major thing. Even if it is more difficult and mechanically involved, a 15 minute dead mines run won't be nearly as memorable as an hour long dead mines run.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  3. #583
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    The world really isnt that dangerous in vanilla WoW nor are that dungeons that hard to get to. They are TIMELY to get to yes. Like, Shadowfang isnt hard to get to for an Alliance character. It just takes a lot of time to get to.
    So I say something is more dangerous in Classic and your response is: "it's not that dangerous". Do you see how pointless that is? You might has well have rolled your face into the keyboard. It's dangerous enough to feel rewarding, that's all that matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    The world really isnt that dangerous in vanilla WoW nor are that dungeons that hard to get to. They are TIMELY to get to yes. Like, Shadowfang isnt hard to get to for an Alliance character. It just takes a lot of time to get to.

    Hell, said mage is correct. Vanilla is more rewarding. But its because the gratification isnt instant, its more earned, but not in a difficulty sense. You arent automatically grouped with people, that adds value to grouping itself. You dont instantly enter a dungeon, which gives the world a greater sense of scale and immersion. The fights arent hard but they do last longer giving a stronger sense that you're really doing something major. Time is a major thing. Even if it is more difficult and mechanically involved, a 15 minute dead mines run won't be nearly as memorable as an hour long dead mines run.
    Time investment is part of what makes up the difficulty of a challenge, if it wasn't then you'd have to argue that a grind that took a month of played time is easy to accomplish. It's not easy because humans have limited attention spans.

    And once again, we've only seen low level dungeons so far.

  4. #584
    Quote Originally Posted by WowClassic View Post
    So I say something is more dangerous in Classic and your response is: "it's not that dangerous". Do you see how pointless that is? You might has well have rolled your face into the keyboard. It's dangerous enough to feel rewarding, that's all that matters.



    Time investment is part of what makes up the difficulty of a challenge, if it wasn't then you'd have to argue that a grind that took a month of played time is easy to accomplish. It's not easy because humans have limited attention spans.

    And once again, we've only seen low level dungeons so far.
    you people have very strange definition of dangerous.

    dangerous is mobs suddenly jumping on you from all over the place and other surprise elements.

    dragging mobs one by one because your mana regen sucks is not dangerous its tedious and boring.

    game is not dangerous because world is dangerous - its just tedious because you have to sit and eat / drink all the time because regen sucks and there is retarded gcd on health/mana potions.

    vanilla is much closer to turn base rpg then any future implementations. because guess what before mmopgs turn based rpgs were a main branch of rpgs in pc/console gaming. hell with enough practice you can have more dynamic battles in FF7 or X then in vanilla -_-

  5. #585
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    you people have very strange definition of dangerous.

    dangerous is mobs suddenly jumping on you from all over the place and other surprise elements.

    dragging mobs one by one because your mana regen sucks is not dangerous its tedious and boring.

    game is not dangerous because world is dangerous - its just tedious because you have to sit and eat / drink all the time because regen sucks and there is retarded gcd on health/mana potions.

    vanilla is much closer to turn base rpg then any future implementations. because guess what before mmopgs turn based rpgs were a main branch of rpgs in pc/console gaming. hell with enough practice you can have more dynamic battles in FF7 or X then in vanilla -_-
    So just because you don't have infinite mana and health, and you can't spam health potions like you do in Diablo games the game is boring and tediuos?

    I'm so glad you don't design the games i like to play.

  6. #586
    Quote Originally Posted by Carnedge View Post
    Never said they weren't easy. Said they seem even easier.

    Not to mention the leveling has been capped at 30 so people are having an even easierier time with them as they get decked out in BiS.

    If you play golf enough, it's going to get easier as you get better. People playing harder dungeons since TBC came out are going to be even better at dungeons than they were in vanilla, really fogging up the nostalgia.
    TBC like TBC - you are talking about people who brag all the time about doing mythic 15+ and how lol easy it is -_-

    what a shocker that they have no problem in leveling dungeons in vanilla -_-

    they ego is biting them in the ass thats all .

  7. #587
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    Quote Originally Posted by hardtofin View Post
    What do you guys think about this?

    I played vanilla and definitely remember them being as hard if not harder than the levelling. The guys in the beta are reporting levelling being MUCH hard than private servers but dungeons being WAY easier. They are talking about the possibility there was a stealth nerf to dungeons in 1.12

    I hope this wasn't the case as easy dungeons will really suck in classic imo, what do you guys reckon?
    I take it you didn't play Vanilla then? Having to CC is not "hard".

  8. #588
    If you play a game for 10 to 15 years and go back and do the most basic form of it things are going to be very simple. Understanding of how things work and how that ripples to other aspects of play and your group is much higher than it was at all stages now. Your average beta tester is going to have a PhD level of understanding of things compared to your average vanilla player.
    "Privilege is invisible to those who have it."

  9. #589
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    Classic was tideous, not hard.
    Well said. I think the Mandela Effect is causing people to have unrealistic views about the game. The point is not for the game to be hard, or brutal or whatever. the point is to be fun. So quit worrying & just play.

    Old D&D player, turned WoW addict. Live streaming Classic WoW.
    [About Me] [My Classic Blog]
    My battletag is: RevChris#1597

  10. #590
    Quote Originally Posted by hardtofin View Post
    What do you guys think about this?

    I played vanilla and definitely remember them being as hard if not harder than the levelling. The guys in the beta are reporting levelling being MUCH hard than private servers but dungeons being WAY easier. They are talking about the possibility there was a stealth nerf to dungeons in 1.12

    I hope this wasn't the case as easy dungeons will really suck in classic imo, what do you guys reckon?
    Vanilla difficulty was 99% about people not having any idea how to really play the game. Hell, I'm pretty sure most people who played it had never touched a MMORPG before.

  11. #591
    You have to consider back then we had no idea what any of the boss's mechanics were or how to play our classes. Stick a bunch of people who have played classic private servers for a decade in there and the results are predictable.

  12. #592
    Quote Originally Posted by Powerogue View Post
    You have to consider back then we had no idea what any of the boss's mechanics were or how to play our classes. Stick a bunch of people who have played classic private servers for a decade in there and the results are predictable.
    I just watched people wiping in wailing caverns. Just saying.

  13. #593
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    you people have very strange definition of dangerous.

    dangerous is mobs suddenly jumping on you from all over the place and other surprise elements.

    dragging mobs one by one because your mana regen sucks is not dangerous its tedious and boring.

    game is not dangerous because world is dangerous - its just tedious because you have to sit and eat / drink all the time because regen sucks and there is retarded gcd on health/mana potions.

    vanilla is much closer to turn base rpg then any future implementations. because guess what before mmopgs turn based rpgs were a main branch of rpgs in pc/console gaming. hell with enough practice you can have more dynamic battles in FF7 or X then in vanilla -_-
    No you are pulling mobs one by one becouse they hit hard and becouse you have to manage your mana and later in dungeon you threat and yes it is part of difficulty and it isnt tedious at all. For me it is brainlesss runs in retail modern dungeons where you can just join LFG faceroll dungeon or raids in LFR. Joined queue, facerolled and quit game. I struggle far more to completle classic content than i do in modern wow.

  14. #594
    Considering the ones in beta aren't your average player I would hope they are easy lol

  15. #595
    Well you can make a discord group or other online group for running dungeons with others at lower level, making it challenging.

  16. #596
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    No you are pulling mobs one by one becouse they hit hard and becouse you have to manage your mana and later in dungeon you threat and yes it is part of difficulty and it isnt tedious at all. For me it is brainlesss runs in retail modern dungeons where you can just join LFG faceroll dungeon or raids in LFR. Joined queue, facerolled and quit game. I struggle far more to completle classic content than i do in modern wow.
    I fACeROlled thE IReLlevant COntENT So I hAvE An OpINion AbOuT WoRld oF WaRCrAft.

    The irrelevant content exist so your type stops crying about "inaccessible" content cause of entitlement.

    The word struggle and classic content contradict each other by the way.

  17. #597
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggrophobic View Post
    I'll get a few sceens for you tonight. Early morning today, I'm afraid.
    Still waiting on those screenshots.

  18. #598
    Well they seem pretty easy, but it's not finished at least.

  19. #599
    Quote Originally Posted by hardtofin View Post
    What do you guys think about this?

    I played vanilla and definitely remember them being as hard if not harder than the levelling. The guys in the beta are reporting levelling being MUCH hard than private servers but dungeons being WAY easier. They are talking about the possibility there was a stealth nerf to dungeons in 1.12

    I hope this wasn't the case as easy dungeons will really suck in classic imo, what do you guys reckon?
    They were hard because no one knew exactly what to do.

    Leveling is easy on Private servers becuase most increase XP gains for fun, or, on Blizzlike servers, to compensate for broken quests.

    However, compared to the mechanics they've thrown at us the past several expansions, nothing in Classic can even compete in terms of mechanical difficulty. Classic was easy. The only difficulty will be consistently finding enough people to do the content.

  20. #600
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    No you are pulling mobs one by one becouse they hit hard and becouse you have to manage your mana and later in dungeon you threat and yes it is part of difficulty and it isnt tedious at all. For me it is brainlesss runs in retail modern dungeons where you can just join LFG faceroll dungeon or raids in LFR. Joined queue, facerolled and quit game. I struggle far more to completle classic content than i do in modern wow.
    Yeah lol LFR. Try to do that in a +15 or +20. Hell, even a 10 while being 395 ilvl. Have fun with that.

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